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Announcer: You're listening to The Takeaway with Melissa Harris-Perry from WNYC and PRX in collaboration with WGBH Radio in Boston.

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Melissa Harris-Perry: Civic, racecar, deified, I'm a lasagna hog go hang a salami. These are all examples of palindromes, words are the same forward and backwards. Sequences of numbers can also be palindromes, like if you were to look at a digital clock at 12:21, [unintelligible 00:00:37] is this date of 2's, Tuesday, February 22, 2022, or 2-22-22. It's a palindrome and not just any palindrome, but a full house of 2's as well. Now, according to numerologists, those who study the essence of numbers, the number 2 represents all sorts of things, like duality, partnership, compromise, but what does that mean for us today?

Here to tell us more about the history and significance of numerology and this palindrome date of 2's is Shereen Campbell, astrologer and founder of My Little Magic Shop, a self-care and wellness store. Welcome to The Takeaway, Shereen.

Shereen Campbell: Thank you so much. I'm super, super excited to be here today and to talk with you about this really special day.

Melissa Harris-Perry: I am hyped for this day. We were chatting about, I'm a Libra, I'm married to a Libra. My birthday is October 2nd. My husband and I, our birthdays are two days apart. Our daughter is named a palindrome, she's Anna. Both my husband and I have twins for parents. His mom is a twin and my dad is a twin. Hit me. What does a two mean?

Shereen Campbell: Wow, that is a lot of twos. Throughout many cultures, the number 2 really represents duality, which I find so fascinating that it's through multiple cultures. Even in Eastern philosophies, that's like yin-yang. Then in paganism and mythology, it's about two concurrent forces. That could be Father Sky and Mother Earth, and then even in the Abrahamic religions, two represents a struggle between good and evil or like God and Satan. We see this duality happening throughout all of these different cultures.

When I think of the number 2, I really think about balance, compromise, partnership. It's really about the lesson of how do we come together with another person and how do we find some sort of middle ground between things that are potentially opposing or symbiotic.

Melissa Harris-Perry: When you talk about duality and finding balance, for my household, that makes me smile, but as a political scientist, as someone who's hosting a public affairs show, I think, what could be more different description than the realities we face in our current social and political world? Where it feels like we're not particularly finding balance, we're just straight divided down the middle.

Shereen Campbell: Yes. I think that's so interesting that during this time period, that's more obvious than maybe it's ever been. You look at this, there's been a 222 sequence that's been-- Everyone has been talking about it. It's been going on for a while, and it started back in 2000, and so you look at the last 22 years, funny enough, and we're kind of ending this almost 22-year cycle. We won't see another 222 sequence for another 200 years. My personal thought is that perhaps it was time for us to really tackle the differences between us and like, often when you have to tackle differences, first you need to see them.

They need to be back out in the open, like very obvious and transparent. I think of someone like you that sees so much duality and has to talk about it. It's more about how do we do a better job of listening to each other? How do we do a better job of accepting each other's differences but then also figuring out ways to compromise. I think that we've been really given a beautiful opportunity to do this right now. Especially right now.

Melissa Harris-Perry: I love that language of listening. Is that about the twos? Is that about the palindrome? Or a little bit of both?

Shereen Campbell: I like to think about it as a little bit of both, because if you think of just the number 2 on its own, just by itself, it's powerful. It's about duality. It's about harmony, and it's about cooperating with others. We all know that to even have a proper conversation, you have to listen as much as you talk. When the 2's in numerology come in more than one or in some sort of sequence in a powerful, significant, rare sequence like this, I feel like that energy is just amplified.

Melissa Harris-Perry: Talk to me about what folks might-- Obviously, this is a day when some people are going to have a good day, some people are going to have a bad day. We are folks of different ages and backgrounds and cultures and languages, but are there shared activities or experiences that on a day like this we might be able to do that can help us to tap into the 222 of it all?

Shereen Campbell: Yes, I love that you asked that question, because I think that's really important. I think often we get so excited about things and then we don't think, "Oh, what should we do? How can we contribute to this energy?" My big thought is really it's a day for listening and compassion. We have had a really rough last two years, [laughs] another two, but a really rough last two years. I think that right now it's really just important for us to remember everybody is going through it.

Even if they're quiet, even if they look like they're not, even if they're being a jerk, they are going through and dealing with something. I don't think there's anyone on this planet right now that's not dealing with something at some level. I think that just remembering, like, "Hey, I am a person who's going through stuff, and this person also is going through something. How can I show them compassion and love and putting that really, really top of mind?"

Then, in terms of other things, you can do, like at 2:22, I plan to do a little meditation just to sit and remind myself to be calm and to just be in conversation with the universe. I like to think that the universe is in conversation with us. I really, really believe that we play an active role in how our lives go about. I think that often we spend so much time talking to the universe, like, "Oh, I want this, and I set an intention for that, and these are my goals."

We ask so much of the universe, Mother Earth, to push us forward, but often, we don't spend a lot of time just listening to the universe or inner voice. I think that I want to use that as a reminder of balance within myself, like I need to make sure that I'm contributing to the conversation by sitting in quiet and just listening.

The final thing I'll say about this is that when I think of seeing the number 222 just on a regular day, I feel like it's just a reminder to remember that you're a part of the conversation, like if you pay attention, if you spend time listening, whether that's looking for signs or asking a question and then looking for the answer to come through another person or through a book you're reading or a podcast you're listening to or whatever it is, but if you're really open and listening, you will find that the universe really is communicating with you, is sharing feedback with you and sharing updates on how you can reach this deeper place of love and contentment and compassion.

Melissa Harris-Perry: I love your framework that being part of the conversation, that listeners are part of the conversation, being part of the conversation does not always mean speaking. In fact, maybe the most valuable part of the conversation is in fact listening. My big sister is an amazing listener. Everybody in the family loves her. Well, we all love each other, but we particularly love to talk to her because she is a truly good listener.

Shereen Campbell: Yes, it is. That is something you definitely, definitely have to work on. I think that your sister is awesome, but I feel like we can all be good listeners. We just have to put practice and become really conscious of it. Also to bring up that the United States, collectively, is going through this huge transitionary time period. I think that now probably more than ever in the history of our country is the time for us to listen to each other. Like you said, we're so divided.

We're in a place where we're spending so much time trapped in our own little bubbles of reality that constantly are reinforcing the things that we believe. I think that it's really important for us now to stretch ourselves and be open to alternative perspectives and alternative opinions and then try to work towards having compassion and love towards the others. With the United States' Pluto Return, it's the very first one we've ever had.

Throughout history, other younger countries have had them, but because we're only a little bit over about 250 years old-- 247 years old, which is the time it takes for Pluto to make an entire cycle. It's a really, really important and special time for the United States. I find it really fascinating that it's coinciding on one of these 222 dates because that means it's a bigger call for us to learn compassion and cooperation. Just for the folks who never heard the term Pluto Return, what that means is that Pluto has returned back to the place it was at the time of the birth.

Of course, humans, we don't live for 247 years, unfortunately, so we can't have them, but countries can, institutions can, colleges, anything that can live that long can have them. The US being, that we're relatively young, we're having our very first one. Other countries have had them, and this time period is really marked with a lot of change and transformation in that country. It's a time period of rebalancing of power. I think it's really a time period of listening where the masses are able to finally get their voices really heard, and we have to kind of rebalance and get a better understanding of each other.

Melissa Harris-Perry: Shereen Campbell is an astrologer and founder of My Little Magic Shop, a self-care and wellness store. Shereen, you might also be a bit of a political whisperer. Thank you for joining us.

Shereen Campbell: Aww, thank you so much. It was so fun chatting with you, and I hope you have an amazing 222 Day, and you use it to remember to bring some more compassion and love into your life.

Melissa Harris-Perry: Absolutely. For all of our listeners out there, if you are into this en2siasm, well, we love it too. We have a playlist of two songs from our control room crew. It's up at thetakeaway.org or you can find it on our Twitter feed.

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