Melissa Harris-Perry: Welcome back to The Takeaway. I'm Melissa Harris-Perry. Back in 2015 Misty Copeland became the first African American woman principal dancer of the American Ballet Theater. In her new book, The Wind at My Back, Copeland writes that the road she's traveled was paved in part by her mentor, Raven Wilkinson. Wilkinson danced in the '50s and '60s and like many Black ballerinas she faced racism and violence both within and outside the ballet world. And though Misty Copeland has been at the top of the game, that her breakthrough came just seven short years ago reveals the obstacles Black ballerinas continue to face. So I sat down with Misty Copeland to talk about her new book and the mentor that inspired it.

Misty Copeland: She was the first Black ballerina to receive a contract with a major ballet company. In 1955 she joined the Ballet Russe de Monte Carlo which really was the first American ballet company. One of the greatest companies of the 20th century. During her time touring through the South, she entered incredible racism, threats from the KKK, which ended up changing the trajectory of her career. She ended up leaving America and having to move to Amsterdam to have a full career as a classical dancer. We ended up meeting in 2011 and she quickly became a very close friend of mine and mentor.

Melissa Harris-Perry: I was particularly moved by the stories of her traveling through the South. Those stories, there's one in particular where she's talking about needing to go to the colored hotel. Maybe can you share one with our listeners?

Misty Copeland: When Raven first joined the company touring through the south there weren't those issues. It was quite a shift to go from having stayed in certain hotels before and then things changing and segregation happening. As an athlete, as an artist, as a performer and a professional, it takes a certain amount of strength and focus and mindset that you prepare yourself for before you go on stage. Raven somehow managed. She would be on the tour bus with the company on the way to the theater and the KKK would be stopping cars. They would come onto the tour bus and be looking for the Black dancer and threatening her life.

These were the spaces that she was in before taking to the stage and having to perform in front of people that didn't want her on the stage. There were so many of those instances and she remained so graceful and so passionate still about this art form that excluded her and didn't want her to exist within it.

Melissa Harris-Perry: You begin the fourth chapter of the book with such a simple quote but so powerful, from her. "The least I could do was try."

Misty Copeland: Those simple words are extremely powerful, as you said. Raven was so clear in her intentions and things were never really complicated. The lessons that I learned from her, it never felt like I was being taught or that she was a teacher. It was just the way that she shared these stories and by her example of how she dealt with situations. She did that throughout her life. It taught me what it really truly means to have grace and to have empathy and to have resilience.

Melissa Harris-Perry: Tell us about forming a friendship with her. You met in 2011?

Misty Copeland: Yes.

Melissa Harris-Perry: How did this go from a meeting to not just a friendship but a true intergenerational friendship in this way?

Misty Copeland: I learned of Raven only a year before that, in 2010 I believe it was, by watching a documentary on the company, on the Ballet Russe de Monte Carlo. Once I found out about her, I was sharing her story on every platform, every opportunity I had, every interview I was giving, doing, I would talk about her. Eventually my manager decided to do some digging. We found out that Raven was alive, living in New York City, a block away from me on the Upper West side. It was pretty incredible. Who knows how many times we walked past each other on the street.

We met for the first time right before we took to the stage for a conversation of two generations of Black ballerinas at the Studio Museum in Harlem and found out that she had been following my career since I was 15 years old and coming to my performances at Lincoln Center at the Metropolitan Opera House. From the moment we connected, it was like she was family. The way that she embraced me and she just became someone that I could lean on and rely on in someone that I could trust to be vulnerable with.

Melissa Harris-Perry: What a gift for the two of you to be such extraordinary performers but also willing to be the grateful audience for one another.

Misty Copeland: Something that I learned or I recognized within myself by just learning of her existence and seeing her was an understanding that I'm a part of something so much bigger than myself. Raven showed me that I had a bigger purpose, that I had a responsibility to tell her story. So many Black people that have come before me so many Black dancers, and Black women in particular, whose history is not documented. It really just changed the way that I looked at my career. I'm so thankful. Again, it wasn't because she told me to or the words were ever spoken, it was just by watching her and how she carried herself and the respect she had for others.

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Melissa Harris-Perry: We're going to take a quick pause but don't go anywhere. We'll be back with more of my conversation with Misty Copeland after the break. Welcome back to The Takeaway. I'm Melissa Harris-Perry and I've been talking with Misty Copeland, who became the first African American principal dancer in the American Ballet Theater back in 2015. She's used this role not only as an artist and performer but also as an opportunity to speak out about issues of racism, discrimination and bias within the world of ballet. She talked to me about the strength, the endurance, the resilience of doing a plié, of completing a pirouette. How that helps to build a certain strength and courage to face bias head on.

Misty Copeland: I think that's why the arts are so powerful and so important for every human being to experience. It builds a certain strength and resilience within you to be able to deal with certain situations and circumstances. I think that for both Raven and I it's been a saving grace in how we've processed the things that we've experienced and been able to manage them in a way that's allowed us to continue to succeed in our art. It definitely prepares you for that. All of the training that we do, it's not just we are athletes. What separates us from being a sport, we're not preparing to compete.

We're competing with ourselves but we're really preparing our body, our minds, our spirits and of course our artistry. The characters we're portraying, this is all a preparation in the training that prepares you to be more prepared for life I think.

Melissa Harris-Perry: Tell me about losing Raven Wilkinson.

Misty Copeland: There are so many situations that I've wished Raven was there to be there for me to ask questions after her passing. I have to remind myself that she's prepared me in so many ways to be ready for the world. Losing her was extremely difficult. I also know that she was in a lot of pain. She passed of COPD and really struggled her last year but it was so important that we celebrated her life. My manager and I had a memorial service for her and had all of her incredible friends from all over the world. She had collected quite an eclectic group. It just spoke volumes to the reach that she had and that all of her people came from all walks of life. She just had such an impact on so many. I feel that she deserves to have an impact on even more, which is why I've wanted to share her story in this way.

Melissa Harris-Perry: We've talked a lot about your mentor but I want to talk at least a bit about you. First of all, how are you in this moment? I think particularly for performing artists, I'm deeply interested in how you navigated the pandemic when live performance was not possible and how you're feeling in your body, your spirit, in your performative self now?

Misty Copeland: It has been quite a journey, the last three years. Starting out, it felt like a real opportunity within the pandemic for the arts to take note and learn how to adapt and catch up to the times in a way that we've not been forced to. Part of my goal and mission throughout my 20-plus-year career has been bringing ballet to more people, diversifying it, bringing more equity and inclusion, but how do we get it to more people? What better way than through streaming services, YouTube, through social media? I feel like it really was an opportunity for us to learn, the ballet community, how to be more inclusive. Then the murder of George Floyd, it pushed the ballet world even further.

I don't know that the world knows or has recognized the impact that had on the ballet community in the most positive way. It's really forced us to step back and address these issues that we've been able to get away with because we exist in this beautiful bubble. The conversations that are being heard are conversations I've been pushing for, for a long time. It means so much, even though it's such small changes, that I'm even seeing any change. I feel like my focus during this time has been on the ballet community, not so much on what I'm used to doing, which is every day, eight hours a day focused on my body and my training and the rest. Instead, it's really been channeling how I could use my voice and influence and power to further the ballet community.

Then of course I had my son Jackson seven months ago. My evolution has been vast. I haven't yet been back on stage since all of that. My last performance was December of 2019. I'm really anxious and excited to be back on stage next year with this new life, new outlook on so many things, and of course this new body I'm in.

Melissa Harris-Perry: I am so excited about you being Misty the mom. I wonder if there is some one lesson, not that you have taught young Jackson because typically as parents we don't get to start teaching lessons until fairly far in, about maybe 22 years old they'll start listening.

[laughter]

Melissa Harris-Perry: What has Young Jackson taught you so far?

Misty Copeland: That there's so much more to do. That there's so much outside of one's self. That every day I have another opportunity to set an example for him and just opened my heart up in ways that I didn't know were possible. I don't think I've cried this much, and not in a negative way. These tears are just joy and so many feelings you can't control. He's just opened me up in incredible ways and it made me so much more understanding and grateful for my own parents and my husband's parents. The bonds are stronger than ever within my family because of Jackson.

Melissa Harris-Perry: Misty Copeland, author of the new book, The Wind At My Back. Thank you for joining us today.

Misty Copeland: Thank you so much for having me. It's been such a pleasure.

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