BROOKE GLADSTONE: As Google buys up smart robots, some of which were developed with money from the military, the military deploys AI to help fill its ranks. Right now I'm on the internet with an Army recruiter. I'm typing in [KEYBOARD CLICK], “Who are you?”

SGT STAR:  My name is SGT STAR, which stands for strong, trained and ready. I’m an artificial intelligence agent created for the US Army, to provide you with information about Army life.

BROOKE GLADSTONE:  So how do we feel about SGT STAR? Alex Goldman, of our podcast TLDR, wasn’t sure, so he talked to the Army and other experts to consider the pros and cons of deploying a “Siri” to guide our decision to go to war.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  SGT STAR is the Army’s robot. Specifically, he’s a chatbot but, unlike some chatbots, he’s got a face. If you go to the Army’s website you can see it. He’s white, 30-something and computer generated. He straddles the uncanny valley between approachable and kind of vacant looking. Like most chatbots, he’s there to talk to you about one thing and one thing only. This chatbot wants to talk to you about your service in the US Army, and he doesn't cotton too much to goofin’ around.

Tell him to do some push-ups.

SGT STAR:  Hey, I’m the sergeant here. You drop down and give me 20. I can’t hear you. Count ‘em!

ALEX GOLDMAN:  I found out about SGT STAR from Dave Maass. Dave’s an investigative researcher with the Electronic Frontier Foundation, and for him SGT STAR was just the latest robot that he's formed a relationship with.

DAVE MAASS:  I think the first bot I encountered was ELIZA, and this was a very rudimentary bot that was supposed to function as a therapist. And I remember sitting in front of my computer at college, having these long conversations, trying to fool it, trying to get it to get angry at me. And it would just ask more questions. But there was something about engaging in the middle of the night with this character that fulfilled this – I don’t know if it was a loneliness or if it was just a, a need for late-night communication.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  Even though he knew ELIZA was a bot, she managed to simulate, to some degree, human contact, which is what made the idea of a recruitment bot a little creepy to him. So Dave got curious about how SGT STAR works. But asking SGT STAR about himself doesn't get you very far. He just pulls rank.

SGT STAR:  Because I said so. And, last I checked, I outrank you.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  So last November, Dave decided to FOIA the United States Army.

DAVE MAASS:  There were several things we asked for. One of the things primarily was the input and output scripts. These are all the things that SGT STAR can recognize and all the things that he can possibly say back to you. And we asked for that for every year he's been around, so we could compare how he’s expanded over the years and how his answers have changed. We also asked for guidelines for using him, privacy policies, how many people have used him, how many hours of manpower were saved.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  Dave didn't get any response, not even one saying they wouldn't release the information he requested. So I decided to just give them a call to see if they’d talk. Surprisingly, they were game. If the sound quality is a little funky here, it’s because I spoke to a bunch of military officials and contractors who were all huddled over one speaker phone.

ARMY OFFICIAL:  It’s our pleasure. We’re, we’re quite proud to, to talk about this innovative tool.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  To answer some of Dave’s questions:  SGT STAR has a total of 840 answers he can currently give. His answers are analyzed every day and they’re adjusted every month. And the answers he gives change as military policy changes. Although the Army collects every question that’s asked of SGT STAR, it doesn't collect any personal information of the askers themselves. The Army wasn't willing to divulge proprietary information about how SGT STAR works, but Col. Keeter was otherwise pretty forthcoming.

COL. KEETER:  Over the last five years, I believe the average is about 500,000 user engagements per year and about two million questions are answered. That estimated to be an equivalent of 55 man years.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  Cleat Grumbly from Next IT, the company that programs SGT STAR, told me that when the Army built him it endlessly focus-grouped him.

CLEAT GRUMBLY:  The Army was gonna have several different avatars, potentially. And then when they did focus group tests with people in a bunch of different, you know, ethnicities and age groups in different parts of the country, they all basically picked the same avatar. And so, the Army elected to go ahead and just go with one.

The current version is actually built off of a live soldier, and then it’s rendered to make it look slightly animated.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  Are there certain things that you didn’t even know that recruits were interested in finding out, until SGT STAR started getting those questions?

CLEAT GRUMBLY:  Yeah. One that comes to mind is if you have to shower with other folks.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  This was the most surprising thing to me about SGT STAR, that there are questions that potential recruits couldn't ask a recruiter but felt comfortable asking a chatbot.

CLEAT GRUMBLY:  Like, are there jobs where I wouldn’t have to be deployed, things about what they can bring to basic training, even down to they would ask SGT STAR questions about what toiletries should they bring.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  There are questions a teenager might have about war that they’re too scared to ask a person, but happy to ask a chatbot. Granted, SGT STAR is just a first step to recruitment but as first steps go, it seems like a pretty good one.

Still, I wanted to test my assumptions, so I got in touch with an expert.

PROF. HELEN BENEDICT:  Helen Benedict, professor at the Graduate School of Journalism at Columbia University and the author of Sand Queen and The Lonely Soldier, two books about the Iraq War. 

ALEX GOLDMAN:  In covering the Iraq War, Helen’s heard stories of recruiters forging parental permission slips for underage recruits, lying to candidates about where they would end up, sexual assaults, and much more. In the early aughts, when Helen when reporting on this, the Army disclosed a quote, “60% rise in inappropriate actions by recruiters.” So when I asked Helen about the idea of SGT STAR, I figured she'd be on board. After all, a chatbot doesn't lie and he doesn't pressure people to go to war so he can meet his quota.

PROF. HELEN BENEDICT:  It certainly takes away the power of an individual to manipulate a young recruit. But, on the other hand, the choice to enlist is absolutely enormous, will change your life forever, if not end up getting you killed or maimed. And I think some communication with an honest human being is terribly important. The answers that this robot will give will be the official line, and the official line in the military, in my view, as a result of my research, is not always honest at all. Supposing you ask the robot, what are my chances of getting sexually assaulted as a female, or, I’m gay and now “don’t ask, don’t tell” is over, but how is that going to actually affect me? And I could predict that the answers will be the official line.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  What are my chances of getting sexually assaulted in the military?

SGT STAR:  All soldiers are subject to the Uniform Code of Military Justice and Army regulations which govern behavior and conduct. Commanders have a wide range of administrative and disciplinary measures to address substandard behavior and misconduct. Each case is addressed differently, depending on the circumstances.

PROF. HELEN BENEDICT:  Totally as I predicted. [LAUGHS]

ALEX GOLDMAN:  [LAUGHS] Can you ask it about “don’t ask, don’t tell” and bullying?

PROF. HELEN BENEDICT:  I’m a gay man and I want to enlist. As an openly gay man, what are my chances of being treated badly?

SGT STAR:  If otherwise qualified, individuals may join and serve in the Army without regard to sexual orientation.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  That’s it?

PROF. HELEN BENEDICT:  Listen, the truth of the matter is a live recruiter might well give you the same answers. I think there will be an honest recruiter who could tell you, look, you know, we do have a problem with sexual assault in the military, but we’re really working on it and here are some of the things you can do to protect yourself and might actually get further with succeeding in recruiting someone. 

ALEX GOLDMAN:  It turns out that SGT STAR is a lot of different things. He's a robot who never sleeps. He's a person you can ask questions that you're scared to ask any other human being. He's also a rigidly bureaucratic pro-Army voice that can give oblique answers to questions about your basic safety. He frustratingly full of contradictions and, strangely, that makes him feel more human.

SGT STAR:  Thanks. I try.

  [MUSIC UP & UNDER]

BROOKE GLADSTONE:  OTM Producer Alex Goldman is co-host of our podcast, TLDR. You can also find a blog post featuring all 835 of the answers SGT STAR gives on the Electronic Frontier Foundation’s blog, at eff.org/deeplinks. You can hear a longer version of this piece and the follow-up interview with David Maass at tldr@onthemedia.org.

BROOKE GLADSTONE: As Google buys up smart robots, some of which were developed with money from the military, the military deploys AI to help fill its ranks. Right now I'm on the internet with an Army recruiter. I'm typing in [KEYBOARD CLICK], “Who are you?”

SGT STAR:  My name is SGT STAR, which stands for strong, trained and ready. I’m an artificial intelligence agent created for the US Army, to provide you with information about Army life.

BROOKE GLADSTONE:  So how do we feel about SGT STAR? Alex Goldman, of our podcast TLDR, wasn’t sure, so he talked to the Army and other experts to consider the pros and cons of deploying a “Siri” to guide our decision to go to war.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  SGT STAR is the Army’s robot. Specifically, he’s a chatbot but, unlike some chatbots, he’s got a face. If you go to the Army’s website you can see it. He’s white, 30-something and computer generated. He straddles the uncanny valley between approachable and kind of vacant looking. Like most chatbots, he’s there to talk to you about one thing and one thing only. This chatbot wants to talk to you about your service in the US Army, and he doesn't cotton too much to goofin’ around.

Tell him to do some push-ups.

SGT STAR:  Hey, I’m the sergeant here. You drop down and give me 20. I can’t hear you. Count ‘em!

ALEX GOLDMAN:  I found out about SGT STAR from Dave Maass. Dave’s an investigative researcher with the Electronic Frontier Foundation, and for him SGT STAR was just the latest robot that he's formed a relationship with.

DAVE MAASS:  I think the first bot I encountered was ELIZA, and this was a very rudimentary bot that was supposed to function as a therapist. And I remember sitting in front of my computer at college, having these long conversations, trying to fool it, trying to get it to get angry at me. And it would just ask more questions. But there was something about engaging in the middle of the night with this character that fulfilled this – I don’t know if it was a loneliness or if it was just a, a need for late-night communication.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  Even though he knew ELIZA was a bot, she managed to simulate, to some degree, human contact, which is what made the idea of a recruitment bot a little creepy to him. So Dave got curious about how SGT STAR works. But asking SGT STAR about himself doesn't get you very far. He just pulls rank.

SGT STAR:  Because I said so. And, last I checked, I outrank you.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  So last November, Dave decided to FOIA the United States Army.

DAVE MAASS:  There were several things we asked for. One of the things primarily was the input and output scripts. These are all the things that SGT STAR can recognize and all the things that he can possibly say back to you. And we asked for that for every year he's been around, so we could compare how he’s expanded over the years and how his answers have changed. We also asked for guidelines for using him, privacy policies, how many people have used him, how many hours of manpower were saved.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  Dave didn't get any response, not even one saying they wouldn't release the information he requested. So I decided to just give them a call to see if they’d talk. Surprisingly, they were game. If the sound quality is a little funky here, it’s because I spoke to a bunch of military officials and contractors who were all huddled over one speaker phone.

ARMY OFFICIAL:  It’s our pleasure. We’re, we’re quite proud to, to talk about this innovative tool.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  To answer some of Dave’s questions:  SGT STAR has a total of 840 answers he can currently give. His answers are analyzed every day and they’re adjusted every month. And the answers he gives change as military policy changes. Although the Army collects every question that’s asked of SGT STAR, it doesn't collect any personal information of the askers themselves. The Army wasn't willing to divulge proprietary information about how SGT STAR works, but Col. Keeter was otherwise pretty forthcoming.

COL. KEETER:  Over the last five years, I believe the average is about 500,000 user engagements per year and about two million questions are answered. That estimated to be an equivalent of 55 man years.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  Cleat Grumbly from Next IT, the company that programs SGT STAR, told me that when the Army built him it endlessly focus-grouped him.

CLEAT GRUMBLY:  The Army was gonna have several different avatars, potentially. And then when they did focus group tests with people in a bunch of different, you know, ethnicities and age groups in different parts of the country, they all basically picked the same avatar. And so, the Army elected to go ahead and just go with one.

The current version is actually built off of a live soldier, and then it’s rendered to make it look slightly animated.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  Are there certain things that you didn’t even know that recruits were interested in finding out, until SGT STAR started getting those questions?

CLEAT GRUMBLY:  Yeah. One that comes to mind is if you have to shower with other folks.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  This was the most surprising thing to me about SGT STAR, that there are questions that potential recruits couldn't ask a recruiter but felt comfortable asking a chatbot.

CLEAT GRUMBLY:  Like, are there jobs where I wouldn’t have to be deployed, things about what they can bring to basic training, even down to they would ask SGT STAR questions about what toiletries should they bring.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  There are questions a teenager might have about war that they’re too scared to ask a person, but happy to ask a chatbot. Granted, SGT STAR is just a first step to recruitment but as first steps go, it seems like a pretty good one.

Still, I wanted to test my assumptions, so I got in touch with an expert.

PROF. HELEN BENEDICT:  Helen Benedict, professor at the Graduate School of Journalism at Columbia University and the author of Sand Queen and The Lonely Soldier, two books about the Iraq War. 

ALEX GOLDMAN:  In covering the Iraq War, Helen’s heard stories of recruiters forging parental permission slips for underage recruits, lying to candidates about where they would end up, sexual assaults, and much more. In the early aughts, when Helen when reporting on this, the Army disclosed a quote, “60% rise in inappropriate actions by recruiters.” So when I asked Helen about the idea of SGT STAR, I figured she'd be on board. After all, a chatbot doesn't lie and he doesn't pressure people to go to war so he can meet his quota.

PROF. HELEN BENEDICT:  It certainly takes away the power of an individual to manipulate a young recruit. But, on the other hand, the choice to enlist is absolutely enormous, will change your life forever, if not end up getting you killed or maimed. And I think some communication with an honest human being is terribly important. The answers that this robot will give will be the official line, and the official line in the military, in my view, as a result of my research, is not always honest at all. Supposing you ask the robot, what are my chances of getting sexually assaulted as a female, or, I’m gay and now “don’t ask, don’t tell” is over, but how is that going to actually affect me? And I could predict that the answers will be the official line.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  What are my chances of getting sexually assaulted in the military?

SGT STAR:  All soldiers are subject to the Uniform Code of Military Justice and Army regulations which govern behavior and conduct. Commanders have a wide range of administrative and disciplinary measures to address substandard behavior and misconduct. Each case is addressed differently, depending on the circumstances.

PROF. HELEN BENEDICT:  Totally as I predicted. [LAUGHS]

ALEX GOLDMAN:  [LAUGHS] Can you ask it about “don’t ask, don’t tell” and bullying?

PROF. HELEN BENEDICT:  I’m a gay man and I want to enlist. As an openly gay man, what are my chances of being treated badly?

SGT STAR:  If otherwise qualified, individuals may join and serve in the Army without regard to sexual orientation.

ALEX GOLDMAN:  That’s it?

PROF. HELEN BENEDICT:  Listen, the truth of the matter is a live recruiter might well give you the same answers. I think there will be an honest recruiter who could tell you, look, you know, we do have a problem with sexual assault in the military, but we’re really working on it and here are some of the things you can do to protect yourself and might actually get further with succeeding in recruiting someone. 

ALEX GOLDMAN:  It turns out that SGT STAR is a lot of different things. He's a robot who never sleeps. He's a person you can ask questions that you're scared to ask any other human being. He's also a rigidly bureaucratic pro-Army voice that can give oblique answers to questions about your basic safety. He frustratingly full of contradictions and, strangely, that makes him feel more human.

SGT STAR:  Thanks. I try.

  [MUSIC UP & UNDER]

BROOKE GLADSTONE:  OTM Producer Alex Goldman is co-host of our podcast, TLDR. You can also find a blog post featuring all 835 of the answers SGT STAR gives on the Electronic Frontier Foundation’s blog, at eff.org/deeplinks. You can hear a longer version of this piece and the follow-up interview with David Maass at tldr@onthemedia.org.