Christopher Lydon



March 17, 2001



BOB GARFIELD: There is Talk Radio and, at least until five weeks ago, there was Christopher Lydon. [MUSIC UP AND UNDER]

CHRISTOPHER LYDON: I'm Christopher Lydon. This is The Connection. It seems to come with being human that we -each of us - are aware of a self in our system, an I or a Me behind our eyes; a mind....

BOB GARFIELD:For six years Chris Lydon was the voice of The Connection -- WBUR-FM's weekday morning talk show beloved by its devoted Boston area listeners for its dedication to ideas, rarified subject matter and uncommon civility. Then all hell broke loose. In a dispute with station general manager Jane Cristo over Internet rights and other ownership issues, Lydon was first suspended; then fired. In the uproar his salary, in excess of 200,000 dollars a year was revealed, shocking many listeners and many within the sometimes impoverished world of public radio. Next week Lydon's voice will be heard again, via the Internet. Chris Lydon, welcome back to public radio!

CHRISTOPHER LYDON: Bob it's a pleasure to be here!

BOB GARFIELD: All right I've just been scrolling through your web site -- christopherlydon.org -- and a lot of your correspondents have declared that they are going to vastly miss your, miss your program and your unique sensibility, and some substantial percentage of them believe you are the greediest S.O.B. in eastern Massachusetts! And, and by the way, there's some overlap as well. Are you the greediest S.O.B. in eastern Massachusetts?

CHRISTOPHER LYDON: No, and in fact it's a tiny peop-- percentage that say that. Some people wonder, you know, what does money have to do with public broadcasting. I think some of them think we're all born rich, serve free, you know, don't have dental bills or anything like that. I, I tell them it's not about money. Of course nobody believes anybody when they say that any more, but let's talk about what it is about! When people have paid their dues, when they know they have invention in their blood, when they know that their brain power is worthwhile-- in this world they find a market for it as individuals, and they do get those contractual relationships, and that's essentially what we were asking for, and we felt frankly and still do - in, in a very good position to ask for it!

BOB GARFIELD:A lot of the public response to this -- I mean I don't know what percentage of it, maybe it's small, but it was - you know it was certainly not invisible -- a lot of public response said that you know they can't believe that this is public radio - that this kind of money is being given to talent on public radio.

CHRISTOPHER LYDON: Okay, here, here's my, here's my view of that. It's very simple. The promise of public radio is not that you live in a hair shirt or like a monk. The promise of public radio is that you deliver original, edgy, innovative, unusual, extraordinarily satisfying programming without a heavy dose of commercialism - without a lot of sell, sell or five minutes for used cars. That's the point.

BOB GARFIELD:If you wind up back in public radio, can you ever preside over a pledge drive again, now that you know what your audience knows about [LAUGHS] what you've been through?

CHRISTOPHER LYDON: Sure! Why not?! If you like it, pay for it! Help pay for it. Help sustain it. It's cheap. Cheap at twice the price, I'd say.

BOB GARFIELD: And what, what kind of response do you think you're going to get from-- some percentage of your callers?

CHRISTOPHER LYDON:Listen - do - you know - 15 million dollar center fielders apologize for going to bat? Do they - you know - they get down and genuflect - say I'm awful sorry fellas that you has to pay 25 bucks to see me hit it out of the park?

BOB GARFIELD: You mean the - those 10 million dollar outfielders in public major league baseball?

CHRISTOPHER LYDON:What's this public?! My idea, as I said, of public broadcasting is that - that it be commercial free; also that it be very, very good.

BOB GARFIELD:Did Jane Cristo or anyone else in WBUR management ever interfere with your show? Force subject matter on you that you didn't want or stifle your expression?

CHRISTOPHER LYDON: No. No. Absolutely not, and I want to be clear about that -- Jane - Jane was a totally non-interfering manager in terms of the content of our program, and so was Boston University.

BOB GARFIELD:So it wasn't about editorial interference; management hassles or anything like that, and it - and you declare it's not about the money. Chris -- what is it about?!

CHRISTOPHER LYDON: To me as much as anything it was entry into new media -- specifically the Web, satellite, national, terrestrial broadcasting, but most particularly the Web. The way to extend the wonderful thing we're doing on the radio -- which is conversation and community-making -- is on the Internet, and we found ourselves sort of dragging WBUR kicking and screaming into that brave new wonderful world.

BOB GARFIELD:Was this something to go to the mat over? You've, you've lost a great thing! You've lost your show; you've lost your, your station, your venue-- at least temporarily -- your audience on a matter of the future direction of the Internet and-- and The Connection --was it worth it?

CHRISTOPHER LYDON: We'll find our way back to the Internet I'm sure. [LAUGHS] And - I mean you have to acknowledge that there's a hunger on that --both on the, The Connection's web page and on ours for a restoration of that sensibility, that conversation! Our people are out there. They're starving. But not for long.

BOB GARFIELD: Well, I, I hope to hear you on the radio again soon. Christopher Lydon, thanks so much for joining us.

CHRISTOPHER LYDON: It's a great pleasure Bob. See you on the radio.