Destroying Information


December 1, 2001


BROOKE GLADSTONE: Welcome back to On the Media. I'm Brooke Gladstone.

BOB GARFIELD: And I'm Bob Garfield. The federal government's instructions to libraries were explicit and unprecedented: locate a CD-Rom of federal data on dams and reservoirs and destroy it. Terrorism fears have triggered a series of government actions, all aimed at keeping potentially actionable intelligence out of terrorists' hands. Joining us now is Brant Houston, executive director of the Investigative Reporters and Editors Organization. Brant, welcome to OTM.

BRANT HOUSTON: Hi. Thanks for having me.

BOB GARFIELD: Since the attacks in September, government agencies have been removing information from their web sites and asking libraries and other databases to destroy certain documents. What are some of the consequences of this?

BRANT HOUSTON: The first major consequence of this is to deny the public and the press information about public safety and threats to public safety. Dateline NBC did one-- I saw a template story on using the dam information several years ago. And it was just-- I mean [LAUGHS] there are hundreds of dams out there that aren't getting repaired that are -- they say they can have sunny-day failures. We're just kind of waiting for these little disasters to happen. Some of 'em can be big.

BOB GARFIELD:So another way of looking at this is by closing off these databases, the government is effectively shutting down the early warning system to any number of scandals or public safety disasters that could be looming on the horizon.

BRANT HOUSTON: That is exactly accurate. They're closing down the early warning system. We don't have any problems with people erring on the side of caution, but there's really no notification of discussion of what's being removed. For example, FAA enforcement data has been removed. Well only 25 percent of that data concerns airport security. There's lots of information in there about violations of transportation, of hazardous materials. After all, that's something that brought down the Value Jet outside Miami. There's information about violations of flight operations, lack of reporting, correct reporting on problems, and maintenance problems which of course are of interest to everybody that's looking into the Queens crash. So it's not really being thought out very well.

BOB GARFIELD:I think the, the public is mostly sympathetic with the government in its increasing restrictions. I think what they see is a knee jerk reaction from the press which wants to sort of compulsively have access to material that the public doesn't quite get why the press has to have.

BRANT HOUSTON: If you're going to have a free and open and democratic society, you're going to have to have a press that can keep government officials accountable.

BOB GARFIELD:The Freedom of Information Act has gotten let's say a fresh interpretation by Attorney General Ashcroft since September 11th, and he seems to be telling agencies, federal agencies, contrary to federal policy going back a couple of decades that they should withhold information if they can. Is this just a-- opportunity knocking for a government that is interested in suppression?

BRANT HOUSTON: The idea of the Freedom of Information Act was that everything should be disclosed except what you really, really need to keep private. I think the government is trying to turn this interpretation upside down. There is always a tension between the press and the government, and the government always wants to withhold more information than it should. With, I have to say, industry lobbyists pushing them on, I think it gets a much more custodial feeling over some of the data.

BOB GARFIELD:One of the things that's happened is that libraries have been directed to destroy documents that they'd had in their public records. That's kind of chilling.

BRANT HOUSTON: I think it's very chilling. I've been saying to people there's no longer a chilling effect out there. There's an Arctic Zone. Thankfully other federal agencies are stepping up and saying I'm not quite sure you have the right to destroy this -- telling the libraries to hold up.

BOB GARFIELD: But now that Pandora's Box has been closed, will it ever open again?

BRANT HOUSTON:I think we go through cycles. I think it was closed before the Freedom of Information Act and Sunshine Laws came along. I do think there will be if not a backlash a recognition and awareness of what's going on. It'll start when-- the public is told that we're taking things -- don't worry about it -- and things aren't taken care of.

BOB GARFIELD: Brant Houston, thank you very much.

BRANT HOUSTON: Thank you.

BOB GARFIELD:Brant Houston is executive director of Investigative Reporters and Editors and an associate professor at the University of Missouri School of Journalism.