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Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer on WNYC. Now, a call in for teachers on this school holiday, current teachers, about your pay and working conditions, and how the school year has gone for you. This little bit removed from the depths of the pandemic. 212-433-WNYC. 212-433-9692. The news hook here is that in New York City, the United Federation of Teachers just agreed to a tentative multi-year contract with the Adams administration. On tomorrow's show, UFT President, Michael Mulgrew, will be among our guests. If you are a New York City teacher and a UFT member, we invite you to call in and say if you plan to vote to ratify the contract or vote against it, or are so far undecided. 212-433-WNYC. You can also plant an idea or two with me for what to ask Michael Mulgrew tomorrow. 212-433-9692.

Reportedly, some people aren't satisfied with salary increases of about 3% per year in a time of inflation rising faster than that, but a lot of people do like this contract because it meaningfully raises the starting salary and moves teachers more quickly to raises based on years of service, getting them to and beyond a $100,000 a year more quickly than before. I'll give you some of the basics here, and some of you teachers in other districts that may not be as well compensated might be interested to hear this. According to Chalkbeat, the education news website says, starting salary for new teachers will jump from $61,000 to $72,000 by the end of the contract. In 5 years, the most experienced teachers will earn $151,000. The deal also proposes to cut in half the amount of time it takes teachers to reach a $100,000 salary.

It used to take 15 years to get to $100,000, now, it'll take 8 years if this is ratified to get to $100,000 a year, and the top salary, again, I'm not sure how many years it takes to reach that, but the top salary for the most experienced teachers, this says, will be a little over $150,000. New York City teachers, do you plan to ratify the contract or vote no, or are you undecided? 212-433-WNYC. Teachers elsewhere, New Jersey, Connecticut, Westchester, Long Island, anywhere else, we invite you to compare your pay and working conditions to what the UFT leadership just agreed to for its members. 212-433-9692. Part of the context, we know teacher shortages are a problem in any places.

Always in certain specialties like special ed of various kinds, math, and science, but also, in general, a lot of turnover with shortages of general ed teachers in many places because of working conditions stemming from the pandemic or just any way, given the work involved, the importance of that work and the way teachers are paid and the way teachers are perceived. I guess if you recently left teaching under any circumstances other than, say, a typical retirement at an older age, you're also welcome to call in and talk about pay and working conditions. 212-433-9692. I'll throw in one other subtopic. You can also talk about politics as a factor here if you like. I don't just mean contract politics, but we all know there are culture wars playing out in school communities all over the country.

The teaching of history as we were just discussing with Annette Gordon-Reed at the center of that. Also, the acknowledgment of LGBTQ students and families at the center of that, so report to the class out there in the non-classroom world of all our listeners, how are you navigating those politics if they have come to your school or district? How are they affecting your professional quality of life? To call in for teachers, New York City Union members, will you vote to ratify, and any teachers anywhere, what do you want listeners to know about your pay and working conditions? 212-433-WNYC. We're here for you on this day off from school to make your voices heard far and wide. 212-433-9692, or write a text to that number or tweet @BrianLehrer, and we'll take your calls right after this

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Brian Lehrer:  Brian Lehrer on WNYC. Now, the teachers calling in on this day off from school on the UFT contract and pay and working conditions wherever you are. Marny in Jackson Heights is going to start us off. Hi, Marny. You are on WNYC. I think you're going to raise an issue that I am definitely planning to ask Mr. Mulgrew about tomorrow. Hi, Marny.

Marny: Hi. How are you doing?

Brian Lehrer: Good, and you?

Marny: Good. Yes, I'm going to raise the issue of healthcare. I am glad you're planning to ask Mulgrew about this tomorrow because when he was having town hall with members, what he said is, "In this agreement, there are no changes to healthcare." The important thing for members to know is that in our 2018 contract, there were agreements about healthcare that are still in effect, and that is that the union will find $600 million per year and give back to the city on our healthcare. They'll find healthcare savings in some way. That's not going to be negotiated until the fall. Basically, Mulgrew gets to decide what that'll be without asking members' input, so we may end up in some way-- We'll still have premium-free healthcare but we may end up in some way paying more that would basically negate any raises that we're getting. We just don't know what it's going to be.

Since Mulgrew is not being transparent about this, I am planning to vote no until we know what's going on with healthcare. That's not my only reason for voting no, but that's a major reason.

Brian Lehrer: Do you feel like as we've covered on the show, the retirees from the UFT being moved into Medicare Advantage managed care if the court upholds that rather than being allowed to stay on traditional Medicare, do you feel like that was a trade-off of giving back some to the city on the part of the union that favors you all who are current teachers in the healthcare route or just overall? It was shifting money from the retirees to the current union members. There's a lot of resentment out there among the retirees over this healthcare move.

Marny: Yes, I definitely feel it's a divide-and-conquer strategy. They're singling out retirees and saying that's a better plan, but again, their real goal is to save money for the city because they have agreed to that. I think eventually, everyone's healthcare is going to be an issue, but yes, I don't think retirees should have to-- because eventually, we're all going to be retirees. I'm 15 years in the system, so we'll all be part of that plan. Basically, Adams said to Mulgrew that he wouldn't negotiate a contract with us until healthcare was agreed on, so Mulgrew must have some verbal agreement or agreement with Adams that he's not telling us about.

Brian Lehrer: It could be. It does, I guess--

Marny: I think members deserve to know. Members deserve to know and should know what's going on with their healthcare before we ratify a contract.

Brian Lehrer: Marny, thank you for starting us off. I appreciate it. It certainly also reflects the enormity of healthcare as an issue. I think throughout the professional world, anywhere where employers cover healthcare, it's such an expense. It's always going up, and so it's such a big thing that it's going to be one of the sticking points, it sounds like, for rank-and-file UFT members on this. It already is for retirees. Healthcare is incredibly expensive, and how unions and employers and the law deals with that is one of the biggest issues in our whole country. Frank in Brooklyn, you're on WNYC. Hi, Frank.

Frank: Hi, Brian. How are you doing?

Brian Lehrer: Good, so you're teaching--

Frank: Can you hear me all right?

Brian Lehrer: Yes.

Frank: Yes. I'm a middle school teacher in Brooklyn. I've been teaching for 10 years in New York City public schools. I'm voting no on this contract for a number of reasons. It's being rushed, but the most important reason for me is it's a non-starter that paraprofessionals are continuing to be left out of a living wage with this contract. The highest salary that a paraprofessional can make is $57,000 with this contract and that's after working 15 years. The number of paraprofessionals don't even make it that far and that's because they start out so low in the $30,000 range. The paraprofessional role is a support role for students with disabilities. They're educators. They are fulfilling the legal requirement as per a student with disability's IEP, their individualized education program. It's completely outrageous that paraprofessionals continue to be forced to make poverty-level wages while doing the most critical and necessary work for our students with disabilities.

Brian Lehrer: You're saying that even in the new contract, the top salary for a para, after however many years of experience gets you to the top salary is only in the 50s?

Frank: Exactly, yes. You have to work 15 years as a paraprofessional, only having one break a day, which is a lunch period, not a prep period, nothing like that. You're still working either one-on-one or with a small group or sometimes a class of students, supporting students with disabilities, students ranging from mild to very intense needs. In District 75 schools, the paraprofessionals for those students work just as hard and sometimes more than the classroom teacher and they are only able--

Brian Lehrer: Do you think there's enough solidarity on the part of the teachers because here you are a teacher calling in in solidarity with the paraprofessionals, even though your pay is-- maybe it's not what you want, but it's much better than their pay? Do you think that there might be enough teacher solidarity to sink this contract agreement on the basis of unfairness to paras?

Frank: I think that a lot of people see it. I don't think they really understand it as a solidarity issue right now, but we need to. I think there needs to be a complete revolution on behalf of the paras because our school system cannot run. Our classrooms cannot run. If the paras, just 25,000 of them across the city, if they alone walked out, they would shut the schools down. We can't run a school system without the paraprofessionals. I hope that teachers continue to see that our success and the success of our students with disabilities relies on their critical work and it's absurd that the city would cut costs on the backs of students with disabilities in a way that they do.

Brian Lehrer: Frank, thank you very much for your call. This is WNYC FM, HD, and AM New York, WNJT-FM 88.1 Trenton, WNJP 88.5 Sussex, WNJY 89.3 Netcong, and WNJO 90.3 Toms River. We are a New York and New Jersey Public Radio and live streaming @wnyc.org. Currently, we're taking calls from teachers on this day off from school about your pay and working conditions. New York City teachers on the tentative contract agreement between the UFT and the city. In advance of Michael Mulgrew's appearance on the show here tomorrow, will you vote yes? Will you vote no? Are you undecided on the tentative contract agreement and teachers anywhere else on your pay and working conditions generally? If culture war politics are infecting your classroom or your school district or anything else you want to say here on this day off from school. Mike in Brooklyn, you're on WNYC. Hi, Mike.

Mike: Hi, Brian, thanks for taking my call. I want to start by saying I think there were a lot of issues with this contract. Some of your earlier callers pointed them out, some under no illusions this is a great contract, but I think there are a couple of factors. One, it's not terrible. It offers some things. I think there's some context we have to think about. One is the Adams administration is maybe falling apart right now. I think if we can lock it in, it's a decent contract. We can get on to other issues, such as properly funding class size, and the fight to do that. The city is not going to be doing that generously. I also think the federal money from the pandemic is drying up. Unions that are not secure will struggle more as we move ahead. I think the timing suggests we should probably take this and then fight the biggest fight of all, which is funding class size.

Brian Lehrer: Mike, thank you very much. Oh, that's interesting. You want to go one level deep on that?

Mike: Oh, yes.

Brian Lehrer: I think you throw in the punch line, not not like a joke punch line, but at the end, that settling this contract, ratifying this contract would free you up for the main event, which is fighting for smaller class size.

Mike: Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to minimize the other issues that prior callers mentioned about health care and equity for paras. There are a lot of things but I also listened to young teachers, new teachers, they don't feel they can stay in this profession. We have to look to our retirees who-- We all will be retirees sooner or later, but we have to keep new teachers, attracting them and retaining them. I sit at lunch every day and hear young teachers talking about they can't do it. They can't take it. We got to get their base pay up quickly and keep them and class sizes. Any teacher who plans a 30-year career knows that 23 kids, as opposed to 32 kids, that's a game changer.

Brian Lehrer: Now the state did pass a class size bureau, which hasn't taken effect yet, but it's dramatic, isn't it?

Mike: Yes, but they have to fund it. Somebody recently said, "This is not a negotiation. The city must fund this." They're going to try to treat it like a negotiation.

Brian Lehrer: Interesting. Mike, thank you. Thank you very much. Let's see who's next. Rich in Queens, you're on WNYC. Hi, Rich.

Rich: Hi, how are you?

Brian Lehrer: Good. What do you teach?

Rich: Hello. I teach high school. One of my concerns is I also teach nights sometimes, a couple of nights a week. I teach Saturday school and I teach summer school too. One of my concerns is the virtual school program. No one knows how it's going to pan out. After reading the memorandum of agreement, it seems that we're supposed to be people teaching volunteers at night, but it might take away from valuable procession time that teachers do need in order to make ends meet. Also too if you have a family, and you can't teach at night or you can't teach on weekends. Some of the teachers that have families might not be able to fulfill the expected roles that they need to "volunteer for."

Brian Lehrer: Rich, thank you very much. We're going to go to Carrie in Washington Heights, you're on WNYC. Hi, Carrie.

Carrie: Oh, shit. Not really.

Brian Lehrer: Oh, gosh. All right. Carrie, I'm going to have to go on to somebody else because you said one of those words that you can't say on the radio. Rosie in Brooklyn, you're on WNYC. Listeners, you don't hear it because we have this delay for just such occasions. I think it was an accident, but we have to protect our license. Rosie in Brooklyn, you're on WNYC. Hi, Rosie.

Rosie: Hi, how are you?

Brian Lehrer: Good. What do you teach?

Rosie: I'm a pre-K teacher. I am lucky enough as a pre-K teacher to work in an actual public school. I don't work in one of the community organizations that have been contracted out to work as public pre-Ks in the city. One of my big complaints with this contract and one of the reasons that I'm voting no-- I'm voting no for many reasons, including some of the reasons that the earlier callers mentioned. One of my biggest complaints is that this contract really opens the door for privatization. Chancellor Banks eliminated hundreds of teachers assigned UFT positions and jeopardized 400 essential early childhood instructional coordinator and social worker jobs this year. He wants to outsource these positions. This MOA or Memorandum of Agreement will let him do that.

We need a contract that preserves all UFT positions. We need a meaningful contract limit on virtual schooling like the last caller mentioned so it's not used to line the pockets of ed tech companies and basically outsource our jobs.

Brian Lehrer: Interesting. Rosie, thank you very much. All right. Let's do one more. Now, I want to acknowledge what we're hearing on the phones, and what I'm seeing on the board which is overwhelmingly people are calling in to say they are going to vote no and in Rosie's case, encouraging her peers to vote no on this UFC contract. In fairness to the Union, we know from a lot of experience on the show that the people who tend to call talk radio are the people who are most unhappy with one thing or another. When we do our election day exit polls, we always call it the informal, unofficial, thoroughly unscientific election day exit polls, because the people who call talk shows are-- we do this to start conversations and I think our listeners have been raising a lot of issues that we will follow up in our segment with Michael Mulgrew, the UFC President tomorrow.

Listeners who are not teachers, you're getting a flavor of what kinds of issues they're dealing with, and some of the dissent out there. Don't take it as a scientific sample of whether this contract is going to pass or not of what the real level of support is. I'm just being fair here. Still while acknowledging that almost everybody who is calling in is saying they're going to vote no. One more. Gia, in Queens, a special headteacher. Gia, you're on WNYC. Hello.

Gia: Hi. Thank you so much for having us be able to call in and share our thoughts. I agree with a lot of what the other callers have said. I'm calling in to say that I'm voting no. I've been teaching for 23 years with the DOE, and I've watched this administration contract every year or every time try to sell us a percentage raise. The percentage raise every three years looks different for teachers. If you noticed the press conference last Tuesday, it was solely focused on pedagogs, on the people on the teacher line to sell it to us. I think Frank mentioned that paraprofessionals don't make nearly enough. A 3% raise for somebody who's starting off at 33,000 looks very different. I'm also mostly afraid about the virtual learning component. It's like opening the door to people who have private interests.

I know of districts across the country who've implemented this. Many have scrapped it. Others who've taken it on have completely taken over and have stopped hiring certified teachers in certain content areas, saying that they can send their students to take the class online with somebody who is an expert in the field but not union, not certified in teaching. It's a way of busting. There just isn't enough in the contract to protect the students and the teachers. There's so many problems. We shouldn't even entertain that in our contract. I'm especially concerned about class-size caps not being honored. There are so many things, but yes, those are the reasons why, and I've been through so many contract sites, we need to vote this down out of solidarity with all of our other functional chapters, but the long term of what public education means. Thank you.

Brian Lehrer: That's interesting about your reaction and the previous caller's reaction to the virtual learning piece. I don't have the details in front of me, but from what I read, and so you're going to correct me if I'm wrong because it sounds like your take on it is that I got a misimpression, that there were some things in there that were considered points of flexibility for teachers, that if they wanted to do some remote instruction, they could get paid overtime for that if it's after school, and that to some degree, there would be flexibility for teachers who through the pandemic got to like for one reason or another, doing some teaching remotely when there's a match with students who want to do it. From what I read, it sounds like it's being described by the Union leadership to some degree as a benefit for teachers, something you can take advantage if it happens to work for you to a certain degree. Do you read it that way at all?

Gia: I understand, and I heard it, and I've read the memorandum of agreement in detail several times in that. The problem is that what it actually looks like, and a contributor to why we see such a max exodus of educators, it's not going to be the retention bonuses. It's the actual living conditions and the constant tensions that exist with administrators often who-- what's not being said in this contract are these situations where administrators coerced. When we've gone to the Union about things that already exist on our contract that we're trying to enforce, we often come at a standstill and people don't push back because of fear of retaliation.

For those of us who've been around for a long time, experienced different administrations in different schools, our experience has been that even though that's written into the contract, that it looks like it protects people or gives this guise of options, the reality is that there's a lot of coercion. It's what pushes people to the brink of making that decision of leaving the profession or being able to stay. That's what needs to be addressed.

Brian Lehrer: Gia, thank you for your call. Everybody who called in, thank you very much. Wow. I didn't know this was going to happen, but it did turn into a listing of grievances with this contract tentative agreement. Like I said, this is absolutely not a scientific sample of the 115,000 UFT members who would be covered by this contract. We certainly have issues to ask Michael Mulgrew about when he comes on the show tomorrow. Teachers, thank you for calling in.

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