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Brian Lehrer: It's The Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. Good morning, everyone. We continue to invite the candidates in the New York Democratic gubernatorial primary on the show. There is no Republican primary remember, Lee Zeldin is running unopposed for that nomination. We will invite him during the general election campaign once the June 28 primary is passed. On the Democratic side, we had Governor Hochul last week. We'll have Public Advocate Jumaane Williams next week.

Right now we welcome back Congressman Tom Suozzi who is leaving Congress to take a second shot at becoming governor. Some of you remember he ran in the Democratic primary in 2006. Eliot Spitzer was elected governor that year. Suozzi has also been the Nassau County Executive for eight years, and his congressional district runs along the North Shore of Long Island from Northeast Queens through the North Shore of Nassau County out to a little bit of the North Shore in Western Suffolk County. Congressman Suozzi, thanks for coming on. Welcome back to WNYC.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Hey, Brian, great to be back on your show. You left that I was mayor of my hometown of Glen Cove for eight years also.

Brian Lehrer: You're right, I left it out. I apologize.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: No reason to apologize. [laughs]

Brian Lehrer: I want to start by playing the campaign commercial you've been running on television. One of them, the one I've been seeing a lot to let the cord-cutters out there. Hear how you've been positioning yourself lately. 30 seconds, here we go.

Speaker 1: The following political commercial is BS-free.

Speaker 2: You want to do something about crime on the streets? You fix bail reform by giving judges the power to keep violent offenders off them. You want to do something about sky-high taxes? You cut state income taxes by 10% so people can afford to live here. You want to do something about out-of-control inflation? Slash the gas tax, and cut utility bills. I'm a Democrat with a 30-year record of using common sense to get things done. It's not about being politically correct, it's about doing the correct thing for the people of New York.

Speaker 1: Tom Suozzi for New York.

Brian Lehrer: Congressman, based on that ad, if we didn't know the context that it's a Democratic primary, one could guess that that was an ad for a Republican, less bail reform, lower taxes, raising the notion of political correctness, and then running against it. What would you say to that framing?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Well, I've got a lifelong record as a Democrat. I was the New York State Environmentalist of the Year by the League of Conservation Voters. I was the Immigration Coalition of New York's Person of the Year. I have a 100% rating from Planned Parenthood. I have a 100% rating from the Human Rights Campaign. I have an F-rating from the NRA. I'm the chairman of the Labor Caucus in Congress. I founded the Labor Caucus and co-chair of it. I have a lifelong record as a Democrat, but I am finding that Democrats are concerned about crime, taxes, and affordability.

Unfortunately, we've ceded those issues to Republicans, when in reality, people are leaving New York State in big numbers, because of the fact that it's not affordable because taxes are too high, because the utility rates are going up, because of the fact that crime is growing in New York City and it's changing the quality of life. It's happening elsewhere throughout the state as well. On top of it all, we're the most corrupt state in United States of America, thanks to the Washington Post.

We've seen people leave office in scandal, so many times. Three governors, most recently, the lieutenant governor, the former Attorney General, the comptroller, Skelos, Silver, Bruno, dozens of legislators. We got to shake things up in New York State, and we have to address the things that people really care about.

Let me just say one of the things, Brian, when Trump was first elected in 2016 when I was elected, I went to a meeting with a bunch of Democrats at the Democratic National Committee, and there's a big round table. I remember, it struck me, a union guy that said Democrats used to show up at the bars and at church picnics and talk to us about the things we cared about. He said, "We don't see that anymore from Democrats. We don't hear from them anymore the way we used to." We have to get back to the fact, we have to talk about the things that people are concerned about, and people are concerned about crime, taxes, affordability, our troubled schools, and corruption. Those are real-life issues that are affecting people every day in New York State, and we have to start talking about them.

Brian Lehrer: Listeners, we will take a few phone calls for Tom Suozzi as he runs for governor, as we took a few for Governor Hochul last week. Keep them issue-oriented folks, keep them respectful as always with candidate interviews or any of our segments, 212-433-WNYC if you have a question, not a speech, a question for congressman or gubernatorial hopeful Tom Suozzi. 212-433-9692, or you can tweet it @BrianLehrer.

Let's go down the things in your ad, and that you just cited and get specific on them a little bit on bail reform. The governor came out with her public safety platform that was criticized by people on the left, including the rollback of bail reform to some degree as you know, which they did this month under pressure from the governor, it's been reported. Would you go further than she went in the bill that was passed?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Much further. I think that that was a phony-baloney proposal by her. She leaked it 10 days before the budget was due. She never advocated for it. She assigned the lieutenant governor who has since been arrested for bribery and corruption to be the negotiator on her behalf, the same person, her lieutenant governor, who campaigned on defund the police when he ran for Comptroller of New York City.

What I'm saying is we need to give judges the discretion to consider dangerousness when the defendants come before them. That's what we have in 49 other states in the United States of America, that's what the federal government has. That's what Mayor Adams is asking for. That's what Commissioner Sewell is asking for. That's what the chief judge is asking for. That's what the district attorneys are asking for, and that's what I'm asking for.

That's what we need to do, as well as I have a 15-point crime intervention and prevention plan. Crime is a major issue. It's not an afterthought. It's not something you leak to the press. It's all hands on deck. As the governor, you bring in the mayors, you bring in the police commissioners, you bring in the judiciary, you bring in your legislative leaders, you bring in the corrections facilities, you bring in the mental health experts, you bring in your academics, you bring in everybody, your all hands on deck to say, "We have a problem, and we have to address it in a comprehensive way that actually makes people feel safe." People don't feel safe. They don't feel safe taking the subway. They don't feel safe in many of the neighborhoods. It's not an afterthought.

Brian Lehrer: I asked the governor this last week, and I'll ask you the same question, those who wanted to keep bail reform as it was, say there's no data linking bail reform to any increase in crime. For example, cities that did not change their bail laws, saw their murder rates go up much more than New York City during the pandemic, they say including Philadelphia, Houston, and Portland, Oregon. Do you have any data to show you're advocating this based on something real linked to bail reform, not just playing to the fact that there's crime out there or to people's preconceptions?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: I'm playing on [unintelligible 00:08:01], there's been a lot of different op-ed pieces that have been written about this in great detail as to the number of crimes. I talked to a guy the other day, there were 80,000 complaints for shoplifting in New York City in the five boroughs in 2021, 80,000.

Brian Lehrer: Are they linked to bail reform? Would it have been less if we didn't pass the 2019 bail reform? Is there data?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: The data is that from 2019 to 2021, shootings went up 100% in New York City. Murders went up 50% in New York City. 49 other states have a dangerousness standard. There's data and there's common sense, and there's advocacy by people who are expert at this who do this for a living that say, "This is a problem that must be addressed." Now, will bail reform by itself solve the whole problem? Absolutely not. You have to do the things that the mayor is talking about with precision policing. You have to do programs to go after the guns. You have to continue to advocate in Washington DC.

I'm a great advocate to go against gun violence in Washington DC. I have an F-rating from the NRA. When Kathy Hochul was in Congress, she had A-rating from the NRA and she was endorsed by the NRA. What's shocking to me is that when she was in Congress, she had an A-rating from the NRA. She said she wanted to report undocumented people to ICE if they came before her as the County Clerk of Erie County, and she had a 50% rating from the League of Conservation Voters.

Now, she picked Brian Benjamin as her Lieutenant Governor who campaigned on defund the police. She endorsed the socialists in Queens for City Council, and she has members of the Democratic Socialist Party in her cabinet working on intergovernmental affairs. What does she really stand for?

Brian Lehrer: You're talking a lot about Governor Hochul and we'll talk to Governor Hochul about Governor Hochul.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: You didn't bring up when you interviewed her about her NRA endorsement, but I have a 15-point crime plan, Brian. I have a 15-point crime plan that it's on my website Suozzi for NY, which talks about intervention and prevention. There are things that we need to do right now to make people feel safe.

We also need to do long-term prevention. My biggest thing that I'm most passionate about is to bring health and human services into our schools. Every federally funded, state-funded, locally funded, not-for-profit, we need to bring into our schools to help kids at young ages, because if kids don't make it in school at young ages, they can't possibly succeed in life. 75% of the people in jail have a drug alcohol or mental health problem. 50% of the people at Rikers Island have a learning disability. If we fail children at a young age, they cannot possibly succeed.

Brian Lehrer: Let me follow up on a couple of things that you just said. One on Hochul endorsing a Democratic socialist for a local office. Do you think it's a scandal that any Democratic Party politician in New York would endorse somebody from the DSA wing of the party? Is it a scandal if somebody endorses Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez or Bernie Sanders for Senate in Vermont or for President?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Well, let me make it clear that I did not endorse Bernie Sanders for President. Bernie Sanders is actually not a Democrat, he's an independent. I work with Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez all the time. I recently applied for a community-funded project with her to get it done. I'll work with anybody, progressive, moderate, Democrat, Republican, anybody.

I work with anybody if you want to actually help people, even if I disagree with you on other issues, if we can find common ground, I'll work together with you. Let me say very clearly, everybody, I hear it all the time, I don't know if you hear it in your conversations, but Democrats are talking about how defund the police is a terrible message for the Democratic Party. How socialism is a terrible message for the Democratic Party. How we are losing the general public, and we are losing electorally because these messages are so divisive, and so against our traditional Democratic values, and everybody wringing their hands about it. I'm actually doing something about it.

When Byron Brown, the mayor of Buffalo, lost his Democratic primary to a Democratic socialist candidate in Buffalo, everybody went up and endorsed the Democratic socialist who was on the Democratic line. I said, while everybody's complaining about socialism is killing our democratic message, "Why are we doing that?" I went up and was the only elected official to campaign for Byron Brown, who ran on a writing ballot as a Democrat. He won that election and became the mayor of Buffalo again. Kathy Hochul who's from Buffalo would not get involved in that race and did not endorse the city mayor in that race, because he was not the Democratic nominee, the socialist was the Democratic nominee. I think there's a problem.

Brian Lehrer: One more question on the crime and bail reform piece before we move on from that, do you also have plans to continue to roll back mass incarceration, which is, of course, the other side of that concern? There's crime. There's a concern, mass incarceration is a concern. Do you have specific plans to continue to roll back mass incarceration, as had been happening in New York over the last decade or so?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: I think that we have to work at using our correctional facilities to be much better than they are to help people with drug, alcohol, and mental health problems, to help get people jobs skills so that instead of releasing people back into the communities they came from where they wreaked havoc, so they can come back again and wreak havoc once again, that people come out with some skills, so they can actually get a job. So that they can actually function in society. So that they can have their mental health issues, help them address them. So they can help address their addiction issues.

There needs to be a comprehensive effort to do this. You look at Rikers Island, I went to go visit Rikers Island a few months ago, but with Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, and others, and it's a disgrace. That facility has been neglected for so long. I ran a corrections facility when I was Nassau County Executive, we put under--

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Brian Lehrer: Well, I think some of the advocates would say, you're talking about people who are already in jail with that answer, what about rolling back mass incarceration, meaning just not jailing as many people in the first place?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Well, I agree with the idea behind elimination of cash bail that people who were incarcerated for low-level crime with low-level bails, but they couldn't afford to pay it. When I was a county executive, as I mentioned, I ran the corrections facility, and I saw instances where people were arrested for a low-level crime. Two different people, one person was given bail for $300, the other person was given bail for $300 for a low-level crime. One person got out right away, and the other person languish in jail because he couldn't pay $300. We actually had private sector people raise money to get those folks out of jail.

It's an unfair system. Cash bail is an unfair system, that you should have the languish in prison, especially for these low-level offenses, based upon your inability to pay your bail. I understand that we wanted to get rid of cash bail. What happened when they did it in New Jersey, is they adopted the dangerousness standard, as they have in every other state in the United States of America, so that you can take into account people's previous record, what kind of violence they've committed in the past, whether they are a danger to society. We don't have that standard in New York State. We never have, and we should have it, especially now that we got rid of cash bail.

Brian Lehrer: Did crime go up in Newark last during the pandemic than in New York? Did you look it up?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: No, I have not looked it up. Brian, let me just say one thing very clearly, okay?

Brian Lehrer: Yes.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: You know this, you talk to people every single day. People are scared about the crime that exists, people are worried. There's a serious problem. People talk about, well, we need more data, then get the data, then have the meetings. Have the meetings where you bring all the parties, all the stakeholders together, and come up with a comprehensive plan. Don't leak a plan 10 days before the budget is due and refuse to talk about it to the media, go out and develop a plan and sell it to the public.

I have a 15-point plan that I've laid out. Politics democracy does not work unless there's a competition over ideas. Unless there's a debate that takes place. We haven't had a debate in New York State for 30 years. Candidates should be debating each other. "I have better experience than you do." "No, I have better experience than you." "I have better ideas than you." "No, I have better ideas than you." "I can lift more people up than you can." "No, I can lift more people than you can." Let's have that debate. This insider system in New York State, which is so broken and so corrupt, which has given us the highest taxes in United States of America. People are afraid to take the subway. People leaving the state in droves is not working. Demand that debates take place.

Why did Kathy Hochul raise $20 million so quickly, more than Cuomo did, more than Spitzer did, more than Patterson did, more than Pataki did, is because everything I'm so inspired by the Buffalo Bills deal. I'm so inspired by the fact that your lieutenant governor was arrested for bribery and corruption. I'm so inspired by the fact that you have no plan to address the high taxes or crime in our state. No, because every insider in the state who does business with the state was asked to give her money.

Every lobbyist, every person who wants a cannabis license, every person who was in nursing homes, they were all asked to give money. That's who gave her the money, not the people who are inspired by the great vision for the future of our state. Our state is broken. It's not defensible. Demand that there'll be a debate. I'm asking you, Brian, have NPR have a debate between me, Jumaane, and Kathy Hochul. I'm ready to come on your show and debate with each other.

Brian Lehrer: We are already inviting you and Jumaane Williams and Kathy Hochul to do a debate that we with the Public Radio stations in New York State will moderate.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: I accept.

Brian Lehrer: You accept. Okay, that's a start. Listeners, if you're just joining us, my guest is Congressman Tom Suozzi from Nassau, Suffolk, and Queens running in the Democratic gubernatorial primary. I was just going to raise the issue of taxes by letting Saul in White Plains get there with a question that I think you'll find friendly. In fact, I think you just touched on his point. Saul, you're on WNYC with Tom Suozzi. Hello.

Saul: Good afternoon, Brian. Excellent show. I've been listening to you for 25 years. God bless you. Your guest is like any other politician. First of all, I didn't want to talk about bail reform, I was calling for Buffalo Bills. NFL has a rule that was changed five years ago because of our babies. If you change your market, you have to pay $800 million fine. $800 million fine. I live in White Plains, one of the most expensive places in New York besides New York City. Now I got to pay my taxes to build corporate welfare when this person, which is the richest person in Buffalo and in New York cannot move. He cannot move, he has to pay $800 million fine if he's looking for a new market.

They did that because they got tired of Al Davis changing market after market. That's number one.

Brian Lehrer: The owner of the Raiders who moved from Oakland to here and they're in Las Vegas now. I'm going to leave it there, Saul. I think your question is actually supportive of our current guests point, obviously against the tax break for the Buffalo Bills that Governor Hochul approved and supported once he was on the show last week. Go ahead, Congressman.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: It's more than just a tax break. It's an outright subsidy where taxpayer money is given to them to build a new stadium, and it doesn't make any sense. It's the most lucrative deal in the history of the NFL. It's not like it was debated, it's not like it was like, "Let's go through this." She released it after secretive negotiations, four days before the budget was due. There was no debate about it whatsoever. She gave away the store and the rest of the budget in return for getting the Buffalo Bills deals and to [unintelligible 00:21:03], I should have mentioned that one as well. It really, to me, I don't know how people are stomaching that she's giving away this money, there was no debate whatsoever.

Brian Lehrer: Her argument was, and I think the caller was just refuting it, but her argument, we can't be the state that loses the only NFL team that plays here, and the Bills are very important to Buffalo's economy, and there were real overtures to get them to move by Tampa and San Diego.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: The island has just built a new facility on the border of Nassau and Queens. It was completely paid for by the developer. They were threatening to leave the market as well. In addition, as the caller pointed out, there's a provision that if you leave the market, you got to pay a fine. There was just a big court case on it also that was awarded to a municipality that lost a team. Let's say you want to advocate in favor of this billion dollar taxpayer giveaway to the Buffalo Bills, let's say you want to advocate for it. Couldn't there have at least been a debate about it? Couldn't there have been a public hearing? Did it have to be that was negotiated in secret and then done four days before budget? It just so happens that Kathy Hochul's husband is the General Council for Delaware North.

Delaware North has all the concessions for the Buffalo Bills. Delaware North has casino concessions throughout the state, and it just so happened that they went after the Seneca casinos to help pay for this deal. It just so happens that Delaware North has the concessions at the Niagara Park state park facilities. The system's broken. There's a reason we have the highest taxes in America, there's a reason we spend two and a half times the cost of the national average on Medicaid, there's a reason we spend more per student than any state in the United States of America. Our results are below average as far as education goes. There's a reason people are leaving our state in droves, there's a reason the Washington Post declares the most corrupt state in the United States of America last August. It's because there's a lack of debate, there's a lack of competition. It's an insider game. We need to take the system back on behalf of the people.

Brian Lehrer: One correction from something I said in the introduction, apparently it's not sealed. I thought it was sealed that there's no Republican primary, that Lee Zeldin is the Republican nominee for governor, I guess there is still some time for the other potential hopefuls, Andrew Giuliani and Harry Wilson, primarily to submit--

Congressman Tom Suozzi: And Robert Astorino, the former Washington [crosstalk]--

Brian Lehrer: Oh, and Rob Astorino, thank you, to submit signatures to get on the Republican primary ballot, so I stand corrected on that, and obviously [crosstalk]--

Congressman Tom Suozzi: They've submitted, Zeldin is trying to get them off the ballot. The bottom line is, if the Democrats want to win the gubernatorial race, Tom Suozzi should be the democratic nominee because they can't beat me because what are they going to say? The Democrats don't care about crime and taxes, well, Tom Suozzi cares about crime and taxes. They can't beat me.

Brian Lehrer: To the people tweeting and saying that you sound like a Republican. How would you distinguish yourself from Lee Zeldin? Let's just take him as the most likely nominee at this point, and another Congressman on Long Island, district close to yours, how would you differentiate yourself from Lee Zeldin on the issues of crime and bail that we were talking about before?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Let me first start out that Zeldin is one of the biggest Trump supporters in the country. He's so close to him, it's unbelievable and I was the first person in Congress to endorse Joe Biden for president. In addition, Zeldin has never been an executive. I've been an executive as a mayor and as a county executive, and I am trained as a certified public accountant and an attorney.

I'm a proven executive, I'm a common sense Democrat. I'm not talking about crime and taxes like it's a Fox News talking point, I'm talking about a comprehensive plan for crime that involves intervention and prevention. I understand the systemic problems that exist in our society, mainly related to education that have to be addressed to help children to succeed, so they're not destined for a life of misery, because when kids are left behind in school, they can't possibly succeed.

Problems of crime and poverty and homelessness and domestic violence and other societal dysfunction comes from the fact that we don't help kids at a young age. Desmond Tutu used to say, and Eric Adams use this line all the time, "We spend a lifetime pulling people out of the river. We need to go upstream and stop people from falling in the river in the first place." We have the resources available to us, it's just that politicians and elected officials often aren't good at running things. New York State is a $220 billion enterprise, and most of the people who run it are usually lawyers or good speechmakers who've never run anything before. I know how to run government.

Brian Lehrer: The distinction that you're making between you and Zeldin on crime is that you would have more preventive programs like social programs.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Let's say that's one of the biggest distinctions. No question about it. I also accept the fact while I'm very supportive of police, I ran the Glen Cove Police Department, I ran the Nassau County Police Department, the 12th largest police department in the United States of America, bigger than Detroit or Boston. I also recognize the need for us to have justice, to make sure that people are following the rules. It's why I endorsed Eric Adams very early on because he was the perfect messenger who fought against police abuse and fought for justice within the law enforcement, his entire career, but also said we have to prevent crime from happening. That's why he asked me to serve as his deputy mayor, and I said, "Listen, I'm not going to be your deputy mayor, I'm running for governor. I can do more to help you and help the city of New York as the governor of New York State."

Brian Lehrer: He did do that. I forgot about that. That's right. We talked about it on the show at the time, Eric Adams invited you to be a deputy mayor, but you're running this campaign instead. We'll continue with Tom Suozzi in a minute. Brian Lehrer on WNYC.

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Brian Lehrer on WNYC with Democratic gubernatorial hopeful, Tom Suozzi. By the way, I mentioned COVID policy in the promo for tomorrow show with the court ruling on the mask mandates at the federal level, we see Governor Murphy in New Jersey removing the mandates for mass transit there, Governor Hochul in New York keeping them for mass transit here. What would you do right now if you were governor?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: I would remove the mandates, I would leave it up to personal responsibility, and I would do a lot better job of educating people about why they need to get vaccines and boosters and educate people about why masks are effective, and if you're afraid, then you should wear a mask. We have do a much better job educating people about this. It's become so fractious in our country on mandate issues, it's such a toxic environment that nobody's listening, they're just like, based upon your party, you're picking or what show you watch, you're basing what you do, and we should really be getting back to educating people and bringing them along. Can I see one of your [crosstalk]--

Brian Lehrer: Do you think on the Long Island Rail Road and on the New York City subways, there should not be a requirement at this moment with BA.2 rising to wear a mask.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Correct. I think that people should be wearing masks, I encourage you to wear a mask, but I think that mandates are a problem in this current environment, it's so toxic. Can I just say one other thing in your other promotion, you were talking about the Ukraine. People are fighting and dying in the Ukraine for democracy, freedom, and democracy. Freedom, and democracy is politics. We really need to have more robust politics and debate in New York State. It's an insider game and we have to demand debate on these different issues. I just wanted to make that point.

Brian Lehrer: We're on the same page on that one. John in Piermont, you're on WNYC with Tom Suozzi. Hi, John.

Tom: Hi. Hello, Mr. Suozzi. I heard you say that you want to roll back the gas tax. I'm wondering what you would do instead of subsidizing fossil fuel use and fueling climate change, are you going to leave our children and our grandchildren holding the bag to pay for what we're going to have to do to make up for climate change, just to put some dollars into people's pockets in the short term. What are you going to do about climate change? Here in Piermont, where I live, we have flooding, it's an existential problem for us, and I think it's one of the most serious problems we face and yet I hear you say nothing about climate change, instead, you want to subsidize fossil fuel use.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Okay. Let me be very clear that again, I was the New York State Environmentalist of the Year for all of New York State for my environmental record. I received awards from Al Gore for cleaning up pollution back as far when I was mayor of Glen Cove. I am a signatory to the Green New Deal in Congress. I am a tremendous advocate for subsidies from the federal government to address climate change. I believe very strongly that it's an existential threat to us and that we must address climate change. People are suffering right now from affordability and I'm not talking about rolling back the gas tax indefinitely. I'm talking about trying to give people some relief right now because people are being crushed all throughout our society because of inflationary costs. This is something that's easily addressable.

It's like a very finite defined area to try and address and put some money in people's pockets. Right now we have an enormous amount of money coming to the state of New York from the federal government, as well as enormous revenues that were received from Wall Street doing really well and people paying a bunch of taxes on their bonuses. We have a humongous infrastructure bill that I helped to negotiate a bipartisan deal on that's going to bring enormous amounts of money for infrastructure, for mass transit and for roads and bridges and sewer and water and electric vehicle charging station. I think there should be a temporary suspension, full suspension of the gas tax. I proposed it back in December. The state is now doing something they're not starting it until June, which I think it's unwise to wait until June.

Brian Lehrer: That's $0.16 a gallon that was in the Hochul budget. You're saying it should be more than $0.16 a gallon rollback.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Yes. It should have been done immediately, not waiting until June to do it. It's really, it's not about subsidizing fossil fuels. I don't think that we should subsidize fossil fuels. It's about giving people a break because they're just suffering so much and it doesn't have to be that way. It could be another way, it could be a rebate for people based upon their income or something like that.

Brian Lehrer: I have to bring up the-- before we ran out of time, the story. Oh, based on income, so you would have a sliding scale for a gasoline tax rebate.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Yes. Listen, we should be helping lower-income people who are suffering from inflationary pressure right now. Think of who's hurt the most by your utility cost going up. It's people who have the inability pay and there's no ability to pay standard with the utility bills. There really needs to be help given to low-income people.

Brian Lehrer: About the story that's been in the news regarding you this week about Florida's new education law the critics call Don't Say Gay, you said on a conservative talk show on WABC radio after the host described the law as talking to kids about their genitals in kindergarten, you said, "I think it's a very reasonable law not to get kids in kindergarten talking about sex. I mean, that's very reasonable. I don't want some teacher talking to my kid in kindergarten or first grade about their sex parts. I mean, it doesn't make sense." I know you've since distanced yourself from your own remarks, but why shouldn't LGBT Democrats voting in the primary at least think you're willing to be political and say different things to a conservative talk show audience than elsewhere, which raises trust issues?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Well, I have a record. I've been in public life for a long, long time, almost 30 years, and I have 100% rating from the Human Rights Campaign. I wrote a op-ed piece to the New York Times in 2009 in favor of same-sex marriage. That was long before it was passed into law in New York State or in the country. I got excoriated for it on Long Island from the bishop on Long Island. I have a long record of standing up for LGBTQ families and will always do so.

I spoke and I said the other day, inartfully, on that show, I was responding to the idea that I don't think we should be talking about sex and genitalia to kindergarten and first graders. What I didn't say is that that's not all that law does. It does a lot more than that. I've spoken inartfully and so I'm very clear. I'm 100% opposed to the law. I'm 100% opposed to Governor DeSantis and I will always fight for LGBT families.

Brian Lehrer: One follow-up on that. There's an op-ed. You probably saw it in the daily news by a former employee of yours, Matt Albert, called I'm gay, and my old boss, Tom Suozzi, let me down. He writes this about your clarification. As you just repeated here, that you were simply against kids being taught about sex in their early elementary years, he writes, "That's a dishonest dodge. Public schools don't teach kids about sex in those years. The claim that they do is right-wing hysteria. What does happen sometimes and what the law will prevent is schools supporting children and families who are different so they are not tormented or isolated. The law is an answer to a problem that does not exist."

He's criticizing not just your original statement, but the way you've walked it back as being based on a straw man problem that doesn't exist. They don't teach kids about their genitals in kindergarten. They teach them about different families if they're talking about families, do you think your former employee is wrong?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: No. I think that, listen, that's a legitimate concern. I've texted back and forth with Matt Albert since that op-ed piece. I think that's where I screwed up in that I didn't speak about it artfully. I said I was inartful in the way I discussed it in that if a kid is getting bullied in class because they have two moms or two daddies, then I think that there should be a way to try and address that. This law would not allow that to happen and the law is clear in most states that you can't teach about sex education until fifth grade. That's why I clarified what I said that I'm opposed to the law and that I'm opposed to what Governor DeSantis is trying to do here.

When I was asked the question, they said, "Do you think that you should be able to talk to kids about sex and about genitalia in school?" I said, "No, I think that's a reasonable law to do that, I think that's reasonable to not talk about those things." That's what most people feel is that it's reasonable not to do that. I can understand why that's not clear enough by saying that you shouldn't be doing that. It's not legal to do that now. I didn't speak about it as artfully as I should have.

Brian Lehrer: One other follow-up to raise about you that [crosstalk]--

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Again, I want to make it clear, Brian, I've got a record, I've got a record. Anybody saying, "Oh, Suozzi is trying to run from the right, Suozzi sounds like a dino." I've got a great record as a Democrat. I'm Environmentalist of the Year for the New York League of Conservation Voters when I was county executive in Nassau County. I have 100% rating from the League of Conservation Voters. I was the Person of the Year by the New York Immigration Coalition. I have 100% rating from Planned Parenthood, 100% rating from the Human Rights Campaign. I have a F-rating from the NRA. I'm the chair of the Labor Caucus in Congress. I'm a Democrat, but because I'm trying to address the things that people are concerned about in this current environment where people want you to be all left or all right and we're ignoring the people that want to talk about common-sense solutions is what's killing our discourse in this country.

Brian Lehrer: We've kept it overwhelmingly on the issues. One thing I have to raise though about you as a follow-up because you're criticizing Hochul for not vetting Brian Benjamin enough before taking him on as lieutenant governor. You suggested that her husband would benefit implying that it's corruption in the Buffalo Bills deal. I see the House Ethics Committee is investigating you for failing to disclose stock transactions in the way that you're supposed to. They won't finish the investigation until after the primary. I saw Business Insider quoted in the New York Post saying 31 stock trades valued at close to $900,000. You did put them on your annual disclosure form as I understand it, but not the periodic ones through the year that are supposed to reveal potential conflicts of interest in a timely manner. Is that much, at least true on the facts?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Yes, I filed my annual disclosures, completed them every year. My accountant reviewed them with the Committee on Ethics every year before we submitted them. We didn't think we were required to do the periodic transaction disclosures because I have a broker that has complete discretion over every trade. I don't have discretion over my trade. The broker has discretion over the trade. We gave every single bit of information as part of our annual disclosure, but we didn't do the periodic disclosures.

After five years they said, "Hey, you're supposed to be doing periodic disclosures." We said, "Okay," and we've started to file the periodic disclosures and we had to go back and do the previous five years as well to file the periodic disclosures. There's no allegations of insider trading or conflict of interest or anything like that. He said I didn't fill out the paperwork on the periodic transactions when I should have, but I did do complete disclosure and my annual disclosures."

Brian Lehrer: 30 seconds closing statement, anything you want to say as we wrap this up for today?

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Listen, our state is in trouble and Tom Suozzi is a proven executive who knows how to run things in government, get things done. I'm a common-sense Democrat that I'll get things done, but not by pandering to the left or backing down to the right, I'll work with anybody to get done. I'm a lifelong Democrat, but I'll work with anybody without abandoning my values to get things done. My record is very clear and my issues are very clear what I want to work on. Crime, taxes, troubled schools, affordability, and corruption.

Brian Lehrer: Congressman Tom Suozzi, running for the Democratic nomination for governor of New York. Thank you. We appreciate it. We'll keep inviting you. We're hoping to have the three of you on again in the month of May and the month of June as well and we'll see if we can get that debate together. Thanks for joining us today. Appreciate you a lot.

Congressman Tom Suozzi: Okay, Brian. Thanks so much. Really appreciate the opportunity to be on your show. You do a great job.

Brian Lehrer: Thank you. Brian Lehrer, on WNYC more to come.

 

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