[music]

Brian Lehrer: It's The Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. Good morning, again, everyone. Now we'll get a local Republican take on President Biden's first 100 days in office. Today is day 98, and he'll be giving 100 days' address before a limited joint session of Congress tomorrow, socially distance, meaning not the full house and Senate.

With us now, one of the local Republicans who's going to be in that audience, freshman Congresswoman Nicole Malliotakis of Staten Island and a bit of nearby Brooklyn on the early days of the Biden presidency and of her own time in Congress. You'll remember listeners that Nicole Malliotakis was in the state legislature from Staten Island previously, and was the 2017 Republican nominee for mayor against Bill de Blasio. Congresswoman, we always appreciate when you come on with us, welcome back to WNYC.

Congresswoman Nicole Malliotakis: Thank you, Brian. Great to be with you.

Brian: Biden has identified four main priorities from day one, the pandemic, the economy, the climate, and racial injustice. Let me touch each of these with you briefly, time permitting. The president touts that more than 40% of the country has had at least one vaccine dose, cases are down 16% in the last two weeks according to the New York times COVID tracker. Deaths came down from around 2,000 a day in the winter to around 700 a day right now, which is better, but that's still a pace of 20,000 COVID deaths a month nationally, which is not okay. How do you measure success against the virus and how would you rate the job the president is doing on that?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: Well, I think the main thing is that we've been able to improve access to the vaccination. I think that that's one thing that the president has done to build on President Trump's success and Operation Warp Speed and take it to the next level with production and distribution. The pharmacy program has done very well in getting a lot of the local pharmacies to be distributing the vaccination. We are seeing we are in the top five worldwide in terms of vaccinations. I think that that is something that we could all be very proud of. Certainly, one of my priorities coming into Congress was working to try to improve the access for New Yorkers to that.

Certainly, we're seeing now that all age groups are allowed to get those vaccinations should they choose to, and I think that that's a major thing because in the beginning, obviously it was very difficult and it was very limited, particularly to the seniors in trying to make sure our most vulnerable were taken care of first, but since we've been able to see the production increase and the distribution through the various pharmacy networks, through. Here in New York, the VAs have done a fantastic job of vaccinating, not only our veterans, but they're also working on other federal employees. This has been, I think, a success and one of the things that we can all be proud of.

Brian: Looking just at New York City, Staten Island continues to have some of the hottest hotspots according to the news organization, The Citi yesterday in their map, Tottenville zip code on the South shore, had by far the highest new case rate in the city over the last week, 50 cases per 100,000. The next highest was only 29 per 100,000 population for 1135 in the flushing Queens area. Why do you think Staten Island, your district has been hit so hard in general and the Tottenville leads the city right now?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: Well, the South Shore of Staten Island was one of the communities that did not have a vaccination site. We had worked very diligently to get some of the pharmacies out there to carry the vaccine. I held a pop-up event, and just recently, my local colleagues had advocated in the city finally did put a facility on the South Shore. I think we need to continue to urge people to get vaccinated. I think that there is some hesitancy and you see that in the numbers, I think, reflected across the country.

We want people to be responsible. We want to make sure that-- Look, I understand that a lot of people feel they're outdoors, they're doing certain activities, they don't want to wear a mask, but when you are in close quarters, you have to be responsible. I think that that's something that we need to continue as elected officials to communicate to everybody across the state and the city, and this is the way we're going to get our city reopened. There's been a hesitancy from our mayor to allow certain activities.

Even something like Ice Hockey League, we have 12 kids playing-- Ice Hockey has been prevented as of right now despite the fact that the local rink is open on a Friday or Saturday night up with the 25% capacity, they can have 200 people there, but they don't allow air hockey. I think this is something that-- We want to be able to push the mayor and the governor to reopen, get our economy back on track. We all need to play a role in keeping these numbers low.

Brian: Why do you think Republican men have been among the most resistant groups to the vaccine if Operation Warp Speed was one of Donald Trump's proudest accomplishments?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: It's hard to say. I think this is an individual choice. Some people want to take that vaccine and they feel more comfortable and they feel more free having done so and other people may feel that they're not at high risk and they choose not to take the vaccination. I think that is a personal choice. I think what we can just do is share the stats, share the success, share the efficacy rates, and try to encourage people to get vaccinated, or at least get the vulnerable members of their home vaccinated. I can't tell you it's an individual decision why specifically, but obviously, they're willing to take the risks of catching COVID and that's their individual choice.

Brian: Let's go on to the economy. Biden seems to have concluded that the reason the recovery was so gradual after the great recession of 2008, 2009, was that the government did not go big enough to give people relief and stimulus. He wants to avoid that kind of recovery again. How much do you agree or disagree with that approach?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: Well, I think one of my biggest concerns looking at the proposals in terms of the transportation infrastructure, the idea behind investing in our infrastructure is not just to modernize our infrastructure, bring it into the 21st century, which you and I know being from New York City is much needed, but it's also an idea to stimulate the economy, create jobs, put people back to work, and that is all positive and something that I support. We don't want to though offset the potential gain of a stimulus program of a T&I infrastructure investment by increasing taxes. I think that the issue here is any--

The reason we saw so much success after 2017 when President Trump implemented the tax cuts was that companies were then reinvesting. They were expanding, they were bringing in new equipment. They were growing and they were creating more jobs. That is why you saw record unemployment among all groups. I think that this was a significant achievement and we don't want to undo that. I think that there's a potential for that if the president looks to increase particular taxes at a time of recovery.

I'm looking at this with open eyes. I want to work with the president on a stimulus package on T&I investment, in particular. I'm also being cautious about potential taxes that may be put into a particular package because I believe it would offset some of that economic growth that, that T&I investment would create.

Brian: How do you read Wall Street in this respect though? I know you and other Republicans are saying with COVID relief bill plus the infrastructure bill as proposed equal to big and threatened the country with rising debt. Therefore, also, the tax increases threaten to slow growth, but those prospects are things that Wall Street typically react to if they were concerned the market would fall, their profits would fall through, but the market continues to hit record highs, so maybe he's got it right in terms of spending in taxation. What does the market reaction tell you?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: Well, last week when it was said that the president was looking at increasing the capital gains tax, so you saw the market lower. I think that there is pushback from some Democrats as well, which may destabilize the market a little bit because there was a belief that the president's proposals would not be adopted in such a slim House where the Democrats have the slimmest majority since World War II, so you just need a handful of Democrats to vote with us and his proposals would be blocked. They could be using this, of course, as leverage.

I know that there's a big push from many of us at the local level, Republican and Democrat are trying to reinstate the SALT deduction, trying to put more money back in the pockets of middle class who have been really hit hard by rising property taxes, particularly here in the city of New York, where we don't have a property tax cap like other municipalities in the state. I think that perhaps right now, the stock market is holding simply because we don't know the facts. We don't even have a bill to work off of just yet.

I think that the reaction you're receiving from both Republicans and Democrats saying that his proposals to increase both the corporate rates and capital gains rates are a bit too high. That is something that's being reflected in the market. We have to just see how we move forward and put together a plan. I know Republicans have also come forward with their own transportation infrastructure plan, which is predominantly focused on actual infrastructure needs, roads, bridges, tunnels, ports, airports, broadband expansion.

These are the things that people would think are traditional infrastructure. In the president's proposal, those things just make up a quarter of the overall package. I think trying to make these bills tailored to the specific needs is very important. That was one of my concern with the COVID relief bill, is that there was still a trillion dollars left over from the previous package. I don't think that Congress had done its due diligence in looking at the areas where we need the resources.

Then, making sure that we spent that trillion dollars first before authorizing another $1.9 trillion because the reality is we are approaching the $30 trillion debt in this country. We need to be mindful of that. It does have an impact on inflation in the long-term. The cost of goods are going to go up. If the cost of gasoline is going to go up, these are things that are going to hurt everyday New Yorkers and everyday Americans. It's like government giving with one hand, but then taking with another.

Brian: Let me follow up on one of those pieces of the infrastructure bill. Listeners, if you're just joining us. My guest is Republican Congresswoman Nicole Malliotakis of Staten Island, and a little bit of Brooklyn as we're getting a Republican pre-action to President Biden's 100 day speech tomorrow night, and his 100 days record, in general. In the infrastructure bill as proposed about $400 billion would be to expand home health care for the elderly, human infrastructure or the care infrastructure, he calls it. He would raise some corporate taxes and on individuals making $400,000 a year or more to help pay for it. Do you think that would be popular or unpopular in your district?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: I think there's various parts that could be popular. Certainly, home care for our elderly is important. I think that there's parts of this that could be popular when you talk about the human infrastructure. It really shouldn't be in the transportation infrastructure package. It should be taken up separately. This has always been my criticism of how Albany had functioned. Where they just created an omnibus bill that dealt with so many different things instead of taking it up by piecemeal. We didn't have an opportunity to properly debate the COVID relief bill. This was a 600-page bill, $1.9 trillion.

The Republicans were given a half an hour simply to debate that bill and expose what was in it, we didn't have an opportunity to ask questions of the sponsor. That's not transparency. When you make bills like this, that are just jamming all sorts of subject matter into one particular bill without giving the members who are voting on it time to read it, time to debate it, to be transparent with the public, and have the media cover it, I think that's problematic. I would urge that these bills be taking up smaller and based on the various topics, and we should be taking it up piecemeal and thoroughly debating and discussing what's the best use of our limited amount of money.

Brian: It sounds like, correct me if I'm wrong, that you might lean toward supporting something like a $400 billion home health care for the elderly initiative, rather than trust today's lower tax rates for corporations and upper-income folks to trickle down to take care of your district and every district increasing very elderly population, or am I putting words in your mouth?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: Well, I think you're sort of putting words in my mouth. I would say that I support a balance. I support a balance, but again, I think that these things should be taking up separately. I believe that we should be looking at areas where we could possibly cut funding if programs are not particularly working to maybe move that money to then support our elderly. Look, the senior citizens have always been a priority of mine. Going back to my days in the assembly, fighting for the prescription drug coverage, fighting against some of these predatory schemes that work against our senior citizens, making sure our senior centers are fully funded.

They've always been a priority of mine because I believe that our senior citizens have worked hard their entire lives, they pay taxes, they deserve to have-- They deserve what they get from our government in terms of services. It's one of the reasons I'm against, by the way, Medicare for all, because it would diminish the quality of care that our seniors receive by allowing everyone in the system, you are going to have longer wait times less quality care, less access to doctors for our seniors. That is why there's a program that should be preserved for them. I think I going to--

Brian: That's, of course, a debate that you and Bernie Sanders and other people can have and hash that out. On another Biden priority, before we run out of time. Then I want to ask you one question about these new census numbers and their implications. On another Biden priority among his top four racial injustice and on the policing end of that, I know you ran quite a bit for your seat on supporting the police. Do you think the Derek Chauvin trial was properly decided? Do you oppose the administration's follow-up action of investigating now the patterns and practices of the Minneapolis Police Department generally to as they see it look under the hood of the system that produced Derek Chauvin?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: Well, I believe that the justice system played its course. That was appropriate. I think that the NYPD is one of the best police-- I would say it's the best police department in the nation and other police departments should be modeling what they're doing after what our NYPD is doing. Because they have made significant improvements and outreach in terms of community policing in terms of programs, that they interact with our youth, the cops and kids boxing program. We have so much going on in the NYPD that I think should be a model for the rest of the nation.

Brian: Something that you and Mayor de Blasio actually agree upon, even though a lot of criminal justice reform advocates would disagree with both of you?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: Well, I would say that I disagree with the mayor actually cutting the budget of the NYPD. Look, a lot of the policies that have come out of city hall, come out of Albany, sadly under the one party rule, have led to the spike in crime that we're seeing, the rush to close Rikers Island, the bail reform, which was a deeply flawed piece of legislation, and the defunding the police, have all led to a situation where New Yorkers do feel less safe.

I think we need to recognize that, and I hope that the next mayor does, and I hope that's actually a major issue in this campaign because I haven't heard many of the candidates talk about the need to protect all New Yorkers and give our police the tools and resources they need to do their job. Now, on the federal level, I do believe that some of the improvements that were made in the state level, the banning chokeholds, for example, body cams for all officers. Some of that is going to be implemented on that federal level in a bipartisan compromise as being led by both Democrats and Senator Tim Scott.

Certainly, some of the bills that we saw, taken away qualified immunity from our officers, it's not something that I support. We need to remember that those officers they're taking away the immunity from-- That's if they're operating within the guidelines of the NYPD, they already lose their immunity. If they operate outside the guidelines of the NYPD or if they violate someone's constitutional rights. This would be a very dangerous step to eliminate qualified immunity at the city level and nationally, and lead to less people wanting to be in the department

Brian: At the Republican convention last summer, and from some of your Republican colleagues in Congress right now, there's the position that systemic racism does not exist at all, and particularly in policing, do you believe systemic racism exists in law enforcement or in the American economy?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: Well, the last time I was on your show, you asked me the same question. I said I don't believe it exists within our law enforcement. As a New Yorker, I could tell you that certainly NYPD has the most diverse police department in the world. Our police department is reflective of the community that it works to protect. Maybe that's something that other police departments around the country should work toward. That's why I say the NYPD should be a model for other law enforcement agencies.

Brian: Last thing, New York lost the house seat in the census, this was announced yesterday as you know because other places grew faster. To not oversimplify these numbers, the city, downstate counties generally, have been growing steadily before the pandemic, upstate counties were losing population over this decade. Our problem is going to be how to house nine million people in New York City in a few years for the first time ever. How do you read the census figures and the cause of them?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: Well, I think it's the lack of economic opportunity presented in New York, particularly upstate. I think some of the governor's policies have been very damaging to upstate communities. They have not done enough to try to bring industry manufacturing jobs that upstate New York used to have and try to preserve them and bring them back. I also think that increases in crime is a concern all around the state. You hear people in Manhattan now talking about leaving because they don't feel safe, but also because the city is so closed and shut down and because people can work virtually from anywhere now and that's having an impact as well.

I think the cost of living is also a problem. That is downstate, upstate, it's everywhere in New York and that is the result of either taxes or just burdensome regulations that drive up the cost of living, doing business in New York. As I said, with increased spending, increased regulations, they are passed on to someone and at the end of the day, it's going to be the consumer who will see increased cost to their day-to-day necessities.

I think that is a concern that we need to be mindful of and this should be a reminder. Losing one congressional seat is unfortunate for New York. We need to have all our members advocating for our state, particularly when it comes to federal funding. Losing that one seat is definitely a blow, but certainly better than the two that was very much anticipated up until yesterday.

Brain: You'll be there for Biden's speech before the joint session tomorrow night, explain how this will work. I gather it's not a full State of the Union Address scene because they don't want all 435 House members, 100 senators packing into one chamber because of COVID so who will be there? How did you get selected to be there and I do have to ask you since you voted against certifying the election on January 6th, do you consider Joe Biden the legitimately elected President of the United States?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: It is the inaugural address. They don't call it the State of the Union because it is his first address to the joint Congress and because of COVID, they've decided to restrict attendance. Look, as you mentioned, and we're here now months later still talking about January, but I did vote against Pennsylvania and Arizona because those two states violated their state constitution and the United States Constitution the way they selected their electoral votes.

However, I do see that the president has been put in office. He's sworn in. He is the president. We need to work together as much as possible where we can find common ground. I understand that we're not going to agree on everything. I've been urging them to go to the border so we can work together to try to address the crisis that has been created there and it's a humanitarian crisis. If you see these children, the way that they're sleeping on top of each other, but it's also a major national security crisis. The cartels are running the show at the border. CBP has had their hand-tied.

I look forward to working with the president to fix this problem and I hope that he will cross party lines to work with us. Transportation infrastructure, I believe there's a lot of opportunity for us to come up with a compromise bill and support America's workers and also support the infrastructure needs in cities like ours. I believe that there's a lot of opportunity to work together. Hopefully, restore the SALT deduction here in New York, but I'm also vigilant in knowing that some of the policies that this President is putting in place, very concerning to me, and I'm going to fight against them if I feel they're going to hurt my constituents and the citizens of this great country.

I want to preserve our freedoms, our liberties, making sure we preserve the American dream for future generations, and I'll work with anybody and everyone who wants to achieve that same goal. I am honored to go tomorrow because it is a historic event. The White House and our leadership developed the list of invitees. I'm honored that I was among the group because there's only 40 members from the house that will be attending and I will be listening closely to hear what he has to say. I will be looking for opportunities to work together, but I will also be speaking out if I hear something that I think will be detrimental to the future of our country.

Brain: You're invited to speak out here as we hope you'll continue to come on with us as you serve your first term in Congress. Just to clarify your answer on Arizona and Pennsylvania, there's a difference between saying that your position is that they didn't follow their state constitutions in how the election was held and saying, you have any serious doubt that Biden actually won those states under the election rules that were followed. Do you have any doubt?

Congresswoman Malliotakis: You know what? We never actually had a formal hearing on it. I would say that the rules were changed in violation of their state constitution, therefore, those made those electorals illegitimate. However, it wouldn't have changed the outcome of the election. As you know, even when those two states combined wouldn't have been enough votes to overturn any election.

That's just something that I think we have to acknowledge, we have to just move forward and try to work together as best as possible. I think that we need to find ways to work together. He's the president. I'm a member of Congress and I'm going to do my due diligence on behalf of my constituents to try to find common ground, but also stand up against what's wrong.

Brain: Congresswoman Nicole Malliotakis, Republican from Staten Island in part of South Brooklyn. We always appreciate it. Thank you so much.

Congresswoman Malliotakis: Thank you, Brian.

Copyright © 2021 New York Public Radio. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use at www.wnyc.org for further information.

New York Public Radio transcripts are created on a rush deadline, often by contractors. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of New York Public Radio’s programming is the audio record.