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Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer on WNYC. With us now two Newsday reporters on the race to replace the lying liar to top all lying liars, George Santos. The 3rd Congressional district includes parts of Northeast Queens, Bayside, Little Neck, Douglaston around there, and the whole north shore of Nassau County, all those north shore towns, and down further south in parts of the county such as Massapequa.

It's a little more of a conservative the district with the current lines than when Democrat Tom Suozzi was in office from there, but still a swing district. Biden beat Trump there and 2020 by a good few points. Suozzi is trying to win the job back. The Republican nominee is a member of the Nassau County Legislature, Mazi Pilip, whose biography and demographics are getting a lot of early attention.

Black Jewish woman born in Ethiopia, emigrated to Israel, served in the Israeli Defense Forces there, then came to New York. Mother of seven. Was a Democrat, originally still officially registered as a Democrat. Suozzi, for his part, three-term congressman, member of the bipartisan Problem Solvers Caucus, formerly Nassau County Executive, and Mayor of Glen Cove before that.

Ran against primary Governor Hochul for the Democratic gubernatorial last year, lost. Father of three. With us now Newsday's Paul LaRocco, Investigative Reporter for the Long Island newspaper, and Scott Eidler, Newsday political reporter. Paul and Scott, Happy New Year. Thank you very much for joining us today on this important race.

Paul LaRocco: Happy New Year. Thank you, Brian.

Scott Eidler: Same to you.

Brian Lehrer: Let's jump right in with clips from the candidates that will let the listeners know a little bit of how they're running. Here's Mazi Pilip on the conservative TV station Newsmax on December 21st on why she's now a Republican.

Mazi Pilip: Yes, I was registered as a Democrat. I was a Democrat, guess what? The Democratic Party left me and many others. The Republican Party is the one that shows my values, the Republican Party is all about protecting the residents, okay, from border security that President Biden, and Tom Suozzi responsible for all migrants coming in without nobody really checking them, and we're talking about national security.

We don't know if the terrorists making on their ways here, the amount of drugs coming from the borders. Bringing migrants, those people coming for a better future. They're looking for the American dream, and by bringing them and let them sleep in tents, that's unacceptable, irresponsible.

I immigrated twice in my life. If the country is willing to help, you have to have a plan. You cannot bring people here, just throw them in the streets. This is exactly what they're doing. They are not helping them, and they are not helping the American people.

Brian Lehrer: All right, there's Mazi Pilip on Newsmax a minute of her. Here's a Tom Suozzi TV commercial that is now up and running to represent him.

Announcer: The ballot says Tom Suozzi is running to represent Syosset, Levittown, Douglaston. The record says Tom represents a place he can't find on a map called, Common Ground.

Tom Suozzi: Let's work together to solve the problem people face.

Announcer: Tom wore a path across the aisle to provide better health care for our veterans, took on polluters to clean our air and water, and lead the fight to bring economic relief to suburban families. If you feel like saying "hi", you know where to find him.

Tom Suozzi: I'm Tom Suozzi, and I approve this message.

Brian Lehrer: All right. Listeners in the district, this is a swing district. Do we happen to have any undecided voters out there in this district at this early date, although it's going to get late early in this race? 212-433-WNYC, 212-433-9692. Anyone else on this race with questions or comments for our two guests from Newsday? 212-433-WNYC, 433-9692, call or text. Scott, let's talk about those clips. Suozzi is trying to position himself, we hear it there as Mr. Bipartisan, was that his reputation in Congress, and why that kind of campaign?

Scott Eidler: Right. Tom was part of the Problem Solvers Caucus, which was created a couple of years ago when he first came in, so he always positioned himself as a moderate. He made a comment that the Republicans are picking up on, when he said he'd like to be an honorary member of the squad. This was after former President Trump attacked members of the squad in a tweet, his family immigrated from Italy, and so he felt strongly about that. He felt very angry about the anti-immigrant sentiments.

By and large, Tom Suozzi's voting record has been very moderate. He has condemned parts of the progressive movement. His message is, "Let's fix this." He did fix Albany. He's tried to knock out incumbents. He ran a little bit to the right of Kathy Hochul last time when he primaried her in democratic gubernatorial primary. He's campaigning in areas like Levittown, Massapequa, very Republican areas, because he thinks he can run on his reputation. Long Island is very moderate, and that's why the party picked him.

Brian Lehrer: I happened to be in the district over the weekend, and I saw some Suozzi flyers. I mean, he is not running as a proud Democrat. One of these flyers, big picture of Suozzi on the front, this is a four-page flyer that was mailed to people in the district that opens up and everything, and the front has a picture of Suozzi, and the language, "Partisan politics doesn't drive him. He only cares about delivering for us."

Then, you open it up, and it says, "It's never mattered to him if you're a Democrat or Republican, Tom Suozzi is always willing to work with anyone. In Congress, Tom Suozzi bridge the partisan divide to deliver for us." Paul, why do you think he thinks in a world where people are so polarized that, that's the way to campaign for this seat this time?

Paul LaRocco: Well, to understand his tactics, you have to look at every local election on Long Island since 2021. The Republicans have flipped the Nassau County executive seat, they flipped the Nassau County District Attorney's seat, they flipped a few county legislative seats including Pilip's. You go into Suffolk, which obviously the district doesn't include now, but it did at some point, and the Suffolk County executive and the DA flip there. I think they see the current trends, and realize that to stem that wave a little, or perhaps, he really needs to play up the bipartisan credentials that he feels he has.

Brian Lehrer: Let's take a call from the district before we go on to talking about Mazi Pilip, in particular. Camille in Roslyn, you're on WNYC. Hi, Camille, Happy New Year. Thank you for calling in.

Camille: Hi, and Happy New Year to you. I'm sorry to be so negative on January 2nd. I think the Democrats are making the same mistake they made in 2022. I know I'm not the only person who called you about this, because I remember hearing others even on the South Shore. We see today three signs for Tom Suozzi, while you see dozens for Mazi Pilip. I don't know what's going on.

I left them a message this morning, Nassau County Democrats, to say, "What's up here? I will vote, and I am volunteering for Mr. Suozzi, but I am still quite angry with him for causing this whole debacle." As I told the screener, unless my husband thinks it's about-- It was a backroom deal, whereby, he was told, "This is what's going to happen now." I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but I just don't understand why he did it when his poll numbers were so abysmal.

It's not like he ever really had a chance. Anyway, I do think Jay Jacobs should be fired. I have bought this since 2022. Again, sorry to be so negative. Oh, also, last thing I'll say, is that if you go on Mr. Suozzi's campaign website, he lists his 10 points of what he's for, and I think that's great. Whereas Pilip refuses to answer certain questions, and that's also on the website. She has refused all debates, except one five days before the election. Thank you for letting me rant.

Brian Lehrer: Camille, thank you very much. Anyone else from within the district? Democrat, Republican, independent, undecided, 212-433-WNYC, 212-433-9692. Democrats, Republicans, independents, registered in one party, but going to vote for the other, whatever you want, 212-433-9692, or with questions for our two Newsday reporters covering this race. Scott, what Camille touches on there really is that, it was incomprehensible to her that Tom Suozzi left this seat in Congress to Primary Kathy Hochul. I guess that's what she meant by, "He caused this debacle." He vacated that seat, and then it was open, and George Santos won it against the previous Democratic candidate Robert Zimmerman.

Does the primary challenge against Hochul, and as badly as that went for him, or the fact that he positioned himself to her right in that campaign, even though he lost. Do you think that informs this race at all, or is it completely irrelevant to it, in terms of the political dynamics that you can see shaping up?

Scott Eidler: This is such an interesting question, and I do think it gets into the heart of the psychology of this whole race, which is just fascinating. If Tom didn't run for governor, would he have beat George Santos in 2022? Would this never have happened, or is that premise wrong? If you look at some of the data, the Republicans, Lee Zeldin came very close to defeating governor Hochul.

Would Tom Suozzi, would Kathleen Rice, who also gave up her seat in the South Shore, would they have held on? People like Chuck Schumer, statewide folks, they did not win Long Island. Zimmerman outperformed the governor in this district. He was doing a very good job of retail campaigning, but the Republicans prevailed in Nassau County. It's just a fascinating question.

To think about Tom Suozzi, you have to go back many years ago. He ran against Eliot Spitzer in the Democratic primary in 2006. He has wanted to become governor for many, many years. He's had very high ambitions, and many people tried to talk him out of running for governor last year, including Jay Jacobs, the Chairman of the State and the Democratic Nassau County Party.

He ran Tom's campaign, first campaign for county executive in 2001, and Tom lost. He was in the political wilderness for a couple of months, and as the special election geared up, there were a number of people who wanted to get the Democratic nomination for the special, because the chairman picks, whether this was a conspiracy theory.

Some people think that it was always going to go to him, but we spoke to him and Greg Meeks, the Congressman from Queens, the Chairman of the Queens Democratic Party, and they basically thought Tom was an incumbent, and having him run, did give him incumbency status. We don't know if the average voter is so as clued in as our caller was, whether they blamed Tom for causing this, whether they know he stepped aside, he might just have so much name recognition. Running to the right of the governor may help him slightly.

Brian Lehrer: We continue to talk about the Tom Suozzi, Mazi Pilip special Congressional election to replace George Santos in parts of Queens and Nassau County with Paul LaRocco and Scott Eidler from Newsday, and many of you calling in 212-433 WNYC. Let's take another call from the district. Vince on the Queens side in Douglaston. You're on WNYC. Hi, Vince.

Vince: Hey, good morning, Brian. First time in a long time. I just wanted to chime in on this as well, adding to what the caller had already mentioned. Tom has been around, Tom Suozzi had been around for quite a while, and your guest has already addressed the fact that he's been a long-time politician in that area. The Democrats just fumbled the ball so badly in allowing George Santos to come, a virtual unknown entity, who was easily debunked by the press by just checking his background, and making some simple phone calls. You could see that this guy was lying through his teeth, and the people in the district saw that.

He came from out of nowhere, and walked right into the United States Congress. Suozzi opened the door to that as the incumbent, who really was in the best position to hang onto that seat, at a time where it was critical for the Democrats to keep a very slim majority--[crosstalk]

Brian Lehrer: Sorry, you're making the same point.

Vince: I think we're going to pay, because we're going to end up getting more of the same here.

Brian Lehrer: Vince, thank you very much. Let's talk about Mazi Pilip, Paul. One of the texts that we're getting, let's see if I can find the exact one, "Will the Republican candidate be vetted more carefully and thoroughly than Scamtos was?" Listener spells it "Scamtos". Here we again have a candidate who's running largely on her bio, a Black Jewish woman, immigrant from Ethiopia to Israel, fought in the Israeli Defense Forces there, then came here, was a registered Democrat, or I think is a registered Democrat, but got turned off by the party, and ran for the Nassau County Legislature, and won as a Republican. Now, running for Congress obviously. Has there been investigation of anything in her background, and anything suspicious being turned up?

Paul LaRocco: Well, yes, I mean just naturally anybody, and not just myself and Scott, but pretty much everyone after George Santos is being extra vigilant to look up even the most basic details, and obviously, checking her schooling in Israel to confirm that her service in IDF, which unit she was in, and when she was in it, that kind of stuff.

Maybe you get more attention earlier on on things that might have not come up in the campaign, or might have come up later like, "Oh, if her husband's business where she worked, a medical practice got a PPP loan, while it was alleged not to pay rent in a landlord-tenant dispute lawsuit," like that kind of stuff. Just in terms of broad strokes on the bio, nothing has come up like George Santos.

Obviously, George Santos was a very unique situation in the depth of the lies, and the fiction. We continue to dig into her. I think, as far as politically, the Republicans see her lack of record, and her distinct biography as an opportunity, rather than a weakness. She's a candidate of the moment, and there's not a lot of baggage they have to deal with to get their message across.

Brian Lehrer: With Pilip's background in Israel, does she seem to be making the war there a central issue, and is Suozzi any different from her on Israel issues? Obviously, she's got a different background, but on the issues, are they different from each other, as pertains to Israel, Gaza, or Israel in general? Do we know?

Paul LaRocco: So far, they're each both very staunchly strongly pro Israel. Tom has always been, in terms of a member of Congress, has had roots to the Jewish community in the district. I think he's maybe tried extra hard to play that up a since knowing who his opponent is. Scott could talk about this. A week or two ago, he went to Israel and publicized it. I think they both see it as a big issue in this condensed eight-week or less than eight weeks, a race here with all the attention on the topic these days.

Brian Lehrer: Jeff in Queens has a Mazi Pilip question. You're on WNYC. Hi, Jeff.

Jeff: Oh, hi, good morning, and Happy New Year. Less a question, more a comment than observation, in that, frankly, I think it's the height of chutzpah. Maybe she'll understand that, as an Israeli immigrant. It's not hypocrisy to say that you are a Democrat, and the Democrats represented your beliefs, but then you're going to switch, and you're going to switch on all issues because of immigration, when for better, or for worse, Democrats, are not only are the party of immigration, but have actually put forward in Congress, plans to address the immigration situation. It's the Republicans who block it.

It doesn't mean the policies are good or bad per se, but it does mean that Democrats have actually tried to address it and fix it, but the Republicans block it, because they would rather have a talking point than actually try and attempt to solve the problem. Then, she goes out and says that's the very issue she's switching on as an immigrant, because she wants to solve and fix it. I think she's being used and played, and possibly, with due respect, maybe isn't as bright, or as informed of American politics, as she may think she is.

Brian Lehrer: Well, I never liked that argument. Jeff, thank you very much. To disparage her intelligence. I imagine she knows exactly what she's doing. Scott, if you want this one for Mazi Pilip as an immigrant, but running on the Democrats, as we heard in the clip of her, the Democrats not having enough control of the border. She herself is an immigrant. Has she articulated any kind of a nuanced position on immigration, or is she no different from Donald Trump when you get down to policy?

Scott Eidler: We haven't heard her speak specifically to immigration, other than echoing a lot of the same talking points from the party, the migrant crisis, the Republicans in New York on Long Island, you said, somewhat in the local elections. I will say a few things about her background and the party registration. A number of town supervisor and other county legislator are Democrats.

The Republicans run them. They don't see an issue with that. They think that actually helps them, it gives them some bipartisan appeal. That became a little bit of an issue a few weeks ago, but the Republicans said, "Hey, we knew about this, and we don't care." Another interesting thing to talk about is that, the district has one of the heaviest Jewish populations in the country, the North Shore of Long Island, and it's also very split.

This is where you're going to see Tom Suozzi and Mazi Pilip probably campaign differently. On the one hand, there's a very strong Orthodox Jewish population in areas like Great Neck. That's where Mazi is from. She is Orthodox. The Republicans have been using the Orthodox population on the North Shore and the South Shore, which is not part of this district, but as part of their coalition.

They've really cultivated a great organization, and they've mobilized that base. Joe Cairo, the Chairman of the party, he goes to Shabbat in Kings Point every now and then. He took a trip to Israel even before the war. That's essential to their strategy. There's also a very heavily reformed Jewish population in places like Plainview, Port Washington, Syosset, Jericho.

You're going to see Tom Suozzi focus on those members of the Jewish population that lean Democratic. The Jewish vote, the Israel War, they have the similar positions on supporting Israel. Tom Suozzi just went there, but they're going to appeal to different sections of the Jewish vote, and that's going to be interesting, is who's going to mobilize who to the polls.

Brian Lehrer: Listeners, we're running out of time in this segment. I apologize. No more calls. We're getting a lot of calls from the district. Glen Cove, we see you. Little Neck, we see you. Great Neck, we see you. Let me promise you that we will be doing plenty of coverage on this race on this show between now and election day, February 13th. Early voting starts February 3rd. Mail-in voting even earlier than that, once you get your ballots in the mail.

To wrap this up with our two guests from Newsday, obviously, covering this race closely. Just one more thing about Pilip that keeps coming up in text messages as well as from the callers, listener writes, "Pilip has refused to answer critical questions, and will only do one debate. Dems have few signs again, and Pilip has tons. Jay Jacobs, the Democratic Party chair should be fired."

I've got at least three people. We heard one of the callers earlier, and at least two others saying a lot more Pilip signs out there than Suozzi signs. It reminds them of when there were so many more Lee Zeldin signs than Kathy Hochul signs in 2022. On this question of, if Pilip is answering questions, I'm just going to ask you one position, because abortion has been such a defining issue in the country since the Dobbs decision, and obviously, it has favored Democrats. Here's a Republican woman running for Congress. Has she taken a clear position on abortion rights? Scott.

Scott Eidler: She told us that she does not support a national abortion ban. That was an interview with her recently. She wouldn't say whether or not she supported Roe v Wade. She also wouldn't weigh in on any specifics about policies. She also told us she was pro-life, but she wouldn't want to put regulations on individual women.

Brian Lehrer: Although pro-life generally means you want regulations on individual women from the government. I guess people sometimes make the distinction, what they call personally pro-life and politically pro-choice, I guess. I guess further to be flushed out on that. Listeners, as I say, a lot more to come on this race, on this show, so much at stake for control of Congress right now, as well as all the implications for the swing districts all over the country, as this very contested congressional election year, as well as presidential election year gets underway.

For today, we thank Scott Eidler, Political Correspondent, and Paul LaRocco, Investigative Correspondent for Long Island's Newspaper Newsday. Thank you so much for starting the year with us. We really appreciate it.

Paul LaRocco: Thank you, Brian.

Scott Eidler: Thanks, Brian.

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