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Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer on WNYC and a year into the pandemic with high fashion trends nearly non-existent in New York, how rare is that? My next guest says there's a new fashion trend on the horizon and it is unironically, hyper-especially about New York itself. With me now is Stella Bugbee, New York Magazine editor at large, where she has written a piece on this. Stella welcome to WNYC.

Stella Bugbee: Hi, thanks for having me.

Brian Lehrer: You're dubbing this trend Zizmorcore. Did I say that right? What the heck does that mean?

Stella Bugbee: Many of the listeners will maybe remember Dr. Zizmor and his, I'll call them, iconic advertisements on the subway which ran for about 25 years and he was a dermatologist. They were these cacophonous graphics that advertise the beautiful, clear skin. In honor of him and his hyper New Yorkness, he couldn't really have been anywhere else, we decided to name this trend Zizmorcore.

Brian Lehrer: Dr. Zizmor versus your zits, those ads. In your piece, you list things that count as Zizmorcore and things that don't. Let me just, for our listeners' sake, run down a few things and you tell me why or why not. A Zabar's re-usable tote?

Stella Bugbee: Yes. Zabar's has a very loyal following. If you go to certain parts of town, like upper Westside, you'll see their tote bags everywhere and the most notable one recently was Jerry Nadler at the impeachment that got a lot of pickup that he carried his Zabar's tote. It's very representational of that particular part of the city.

Brian Lehrer: How about a sweatshirt from Gem Spa?

Stella Bugbee: There's no other place in the world that has a Gem Spa quite like Gem Spa. It's all about representing a place that couldn't be anywhere else. If there was a Paris Gem Spa, you couldn't wear it. Does that make sense?

Brian Lehrer: Yes. These are about things that are particularly New York. A sweatshirt from Gem Spa, yes. A sweatshirt from Equinox, not so much.

Stella Bugbee: Definitely not. If it was a brand that was designed to be exported or to be able to exist internationally outside of the locality of New York City, even if it's a great brand, it can't be Zizmorcore.

Brian Lehrer: Zizmorcores because the Zizmor ads were so particularly New York that if somebody had a Zizmor sweatshirt, hopefully that doesn't exist, but that would be Zizmorcore because it's so particularly New York in the pandemic, right?

Stella Bugbee: Yes. It's like resistance to the globalization that we saw for so many decades. He was all about New York City and he's given interviews in which he said that he was the first dermatologist to be in the subway. He really wanted it to be something for everyone where it had been this very exclusive dermatology. It's very much about civic activity and the people of New York and the commonality that we all shared and because his ads were so ubiquitous for such a long time, as I said in the article, they form this collective memory for a lot of us who grew up and who lived here during the time that they were prominent.

Brian Lehrer: I love your Jerry Nadler Zizmorcore example, by the way, because I always think of Jerry Nadler as the height of New York fashion.

Stella Bugbee: That's the thing. It's really not about being the height of fashion. It's about being proud to be where you're from. As I also say in the article, it's about supporting businesses that are struggling. We couldn't go to some of these restaurants. We couldn't support in-person, so wearing their logos or their specialty t-shirts is a way of saying, "We still support you. We want you to be here when this is all over. We're very proud of you."

Brian Lehrer: All of these things are the new, "I love New York." I guess I should mention by full disclosure that your article includes a piece of WNYC swag, right?

Stella Bugbee: Yes, exactly. I think it's on the cover. In fact, actually, yes.

Brian Lehrer: I didn't even see it is. Is it the Fanny pack?

Stella Bugbee: We actually put it in several shots. I think the bag is what made it onto the cover.

Brian Lehrer: Which one? That the canvas one, do you know?

Stella Bugbee: Yes, the big one.

Brian Lehrer: That's the most ubiquitous WNYC bag. Listeners, I'll say that next week our spring pledge drive starts and you will have a chance to get your own piece of WNYC merch, but first for today, no pledge drive requests here. Where else have you bought into the Zizmorcore trend even if you didn't know the word Zizmorcore, listeners? Have you recently bought clothing from a favorite hyper-local institution, maybe a Grey's papaya t-shirt or a hoodie from Playground Coffee, 646-435-7280, 646-435-7280? Are you wearing clothes that you haven't worn in a while, but you've owned for a long time, something that shows that you still love New York, maybe an I Survived the 1977 Blackout shirt or an old Village Voice t-Shirt, the Village Voice being no more. Are you're proudly doning New York City theme merchandise, and why now? 646-435-7280. Anybody have a Yankees or Mets mask that you're wearing out there, even though no fans were allowed in the stands last season. We'll see about this season. 646-435-7280. Shout out your Zizmorcore with Stella Bugbee of New York Magazine editor at large, who coined the term.

You're right, at first glance, Zizmorcore could seem like an evolution of Normcore, but don't be fooled. First, for those who don't know what Normcore is, what is it, and why is this different?

Stella Bugbee: We wrote about Normcore I think back in 2014. First of all, the idea of a core is a trendy way of dubbing a style. There's been a lot of "cores" lately. We knew that and we were playing on the fact that Normcore had been something that we had introduced as a term in the pages of New York Magazine many, many years ago. Normcore was about celebrating the style of the suburbs, specifically very blank generic chain stores, or almost no design at all. It's the opposite of what I described. If it was meant to be exported as a multinational corporation, it could be Normcore. This is a literal rejection of that idea. It's not about trying to hide or be fitting into a larger mass of people. It's about standing out. It's very almost block-specific.

Brian Lehrer: Let's take a phone call. John in Prospect Heights, you're on WNYC. Hi, John? What's your Zizmorcore?

John: Hi, Brian. My Zizmorcore I think-- I'm a big music fan and I go to a lot of rock and roll shows in normal times and in an effort to try to get some money to my favorites rock clubs, I went out and bought t-shirts from the Mercury Lounge and from St. Vitus in Brooklyn, one of my favorites, hoping to show my love and get them some money through the hard times.

Brian Lehrer: Good one. Thank you very much. Sam in Ridgewood, you're on WNYC. Hi, Sam? What's your Zizmorcore? Sam, you're there?

Sam: I got a [inaudible 00:08:19]

Brian Lehrer: Oh, you're trying. I think you're going to be funny too. Give it a shot. Go really close to your phone or stand in a different corner of the room near a window. Sorry, not working. Ryan in Washington Heights, you're on WNYC. What's your Zizmorcore?

Ryan: Oh, hi. First, I was going to mention the tote bag, but you brought that up already. Just from running so many races with Road Runners, I feel like most of my wardrobe is New York Road Runners race t-shirts and I've got shirts that say New York, the Bronx, and Staten Island, and I wear them in the city and then other places. It's very, very much New York with the words and the imagery.

Brian Lehrer: Ryan, thank you very much. Here's Catherine in Philadelphia. Hi, Catherine. You're on WNYC. You're wearing Zizmorcore down there?

Catherine: Yes. I have a Fairway hat that I got at a thrift shop in the Bronx. I think it used to be employee uniform stuff, but I got it for $2 and I wear it a lot down here.

Brian Lehrer: Do people give you reactions to it?

Catherine: I used to work at a Whole Foods in Philly and people thought it was weird, but I would wear a Fairway hat there. Some people know what it is, but most people don't.

Brian Lehrer: Thank you very much, Catherine. Somebody tweeted Stella that they had a Zabar's thing that they wore in Havana and somebody stopped and asked if they could take a picture of him.

Stella Bugbee: Yes, that's perfect because this works as a secret handshake almost especially if you're not in New York City and somebody recognizes your Halal Guys water bottle or whatever it's like, "Oh, you're part of that tribe. We're together." It's a warm, fuzzy feeling as Jesus said to me.

Brian Lehrer: Cesar in Fort Lee, you're on WNYC. Hi, Cesar.

Cesar: Hi, thanks so much for taking my call.

Brian Lehrer: What you got?

Cesar: This summer there was a dance group of people that were riding their car all around Brooklyn at random times throughout the night, and they put a speaker on top of the car so they were actually hosting these impromptu dance parties all around Brooklyn. I just want to shout out the t-shirt that I got from them to support that initiative because all of us were so excited to have some time to be outside and dance in a social-distant way.

Brian Lehrer: Cesar, thanks a lot. Justine in Astoria, you're on WNYC. Justine, what's your Zizmorcore?

Justine: Last week, I went to William's Candy Store in Coney Island, and I bought a t-shirt there which I'm wearing. It's a real old-school sweet shop, where they have glass display cases, and glass bins inside the cases with different candies. They make their own popcorn and candy apples. They're right next to Nathan's and I bought the t-shirt. People ask me, "What's that?" I tell them about it because I want to see a place like that survive, especially because there's an IT'SUGAR open right near there, and I think there's a Dylan's Candy store somewhere near it. William's has been there since 1930 or something like that. I like what they have there, and I like the people there, and it's real old Coney Island.

Brian Lehrer: You hope they survive.

Cesar: Yes. It's great when people ask-- It's funny how many people here in New York don't know about them, even if they've been to Coney Island.

Brian Lehrer: Thank you so much. That's a great one. Stella, here's one from Twitter. Bikes and Bolony, somebody's tweeting as Bikes and Bolony tweets, St. Vitus Bar is maybe the best heavy metal bar performance venue in the country, and it's in Greenpoint, wearing their hat and buying their merch, hoping they survive. We're certainly hearing this trend, which I think just means people are getting what this is about in the first place. These are pieces of merch from places that by and large still exist, that people are hoping can ride out the pandemic economy, right?

Stella Bugbee: It's so heartwarming to hear these stories. I'm sitting here smiling, hearing everybody's individual appreciation of their little place that they love, but it's also-- If you do have like one of the old I Survived the Blackout t-shirts, hold on to it. It's very valuable. There's a whole bunch of people who collect the memorabilia of the city, and that's been going on for a long time. This is an opportunity if you do have something in your closet, get it out, wear it, show it all. This is your perfect moment.

Brian Lehrer: You divide the trend into three categories, the old guard, the new guard, and the vintage grails. What's the difference of the old guard and vintage grails?

Stella Bugbee: There's the obvious big guys like Zabar's and the Maman, and New York City cultural institutions and restaurants that have been around for a very long time. They've always had merch and people have always worn it. The new guard are all of these new restaurants and places like that heavy metal bar that the person tweeted about. It's a whole new group of people that you also want to see survive that people have these very hyperlocal attachments to. That's the new guard. Merch 4 Relief has been really a big part of advocating for keeping these little businesses in business by helping them create merchandise for people to buy who aren't able to go. Then there's this whole rich culture of collecting and people who are obsessed with finding it, an old MTA specialty T-shirt that was made as a bootleg thing by a bunch of MTA workers. That's its own niche, and that's fascinating as well.

Brian Lehrer: Here's a Merch 4 Relief. Caller Matt in Crown Heights. Hey, Matt, you're on WNYC.

Matt: Hey, thanks for taking my call Brian, and thanks for mentioning Merch 4 Relief. I'm friends with a couple of the guys who started it and I think it's a really awesome org. I've been wearing my rainbow Marco's sweatshirt now which has definitely become like a pretty enviable piece of clothing. I did also want to shout out like another one of my favorite pieces of Zizmorcore, which is actually this shirt that I found on a GQ article about knee merch, which is pretty much just people making kind of these bootleg inside joke sort of tees.

The girl who wrote the article made one about The Low Post which was kind of this fan-favorite bar in Crown Heights that shut down randomly, and I saw it and I was just shocked because it was my favorite bar. I reached out to her and I ended up just buying one of her shirts off Zazzle too, and it's my favorite shirt on top of everything.

Brian Lehrer: Great one Matt. Thank you very much. Oh, Adam in the East Village has a really old radio thing that he wears. Adam, you're on WNYC. Hello.

Adam: Brian, your show's a New York treasure. Thank you so much. It's a wishful thinking sweatshirt if anyone wants to put up their classic WMCA, I'm a MCA good guy sweatshirt. I'll make a donation to your next FUNDrive next week. Classic yellow, the old radio station WMCA had a smiling face, and it said "I'm a WMCA good guy." Thank you for taking my call.

Brian Lehrer: Thank you very much. You ever seen one of those old AM Top 40 station gave away to listeners exactly what he described, a yellow sweatshirt with a smiley face that said "WMCA good guy."

Stella Bugbee: That sounds that it would be a really good find.

Brain Lehrer: That was before they went conservative talk like all the other AM stations.

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Brain Lehrer: Maybe they've changed three times since. Do you have tips on how to wear Zizmorcore in a fashionable way? Is it good Zizmorcore style to mix and match your New York brands and your New York eras?

Stella Bugbee: I think anything goes as I have found I sometimes will carry my Strand bag, wear my Frick hat, and throw on my WNYC mask. It doesn't really matter. Now is the time to be as New York [unintelligible 00:17:10] put it to me, "It's slightly obnoxious with your pride and your wearing of New York merch." I assume that it will always be something that people have in their wardrobes, throwing it underneath a coat or wherever you happen to be. You're welcome to be wearing Zizmorcore, but right now it's fine to wear it all at once.

Brian Lehrer: One more. Eddie in Coney Island. You're on WNYC. Hi, Eddie.

Eddie: Hey, Brian, this is great. Anything from a small business or a small organization from anywhere I think is great, but specifically for New York, I still wear my high school and junior high school stuff. James Madison from years ago, basically just has a couple of strings left but I can't give it up, and now I wear my son's high school stuff. Excuse me. Excuse me not high school. He's only in the in fourth grade by I wear his school T-shirt. I still have my TechServe T-shirts that I wear proudly.

Brian Lehrer: TechServe, before there was the Apple Store. There was TechServe fixing Apple products. We have to leave it there because we're out of time Eddie, thank you very much. You know you can buy, Stella, as we go shirts that say I stayed in New York City during COVID-19.

Stella Bugbee: Yes, and did you know that those are made by someone I knew growing up, so I feel very proud of him. You should support him.

Brian Lehrer: I stayed in New York City during COVID-19. I can tell you that.

Stella Bugbee: Get a T-shirt.

Brian Lehrer: Stella Bugbee, New York Magazine editor at large her latest piece is thank you Dr. Zizmor, the newest fashion trend in New York is unironically, hyper-specifically New York itself. This was great. Thank you so much.

Stella Bugbee: Thank you, Brian. Have a nice day.

Brian: Have a great weekend everyone. Brian Lehrer, on WNYC.

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