[music]

Brian Lehrer: It's The Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. Good morning, everyone. Today's day nine of the Biden administration and things are either moving forward, getting dangerous, or getting weird depending on where you look. The president himself is not taking the bait on the weird or dangerous and is plowing forward with fighting COVID and other policy items but at the same time, there is the dangerous. The Department of Homeland Security is warning of a heightened threat of violent extremist attacks right now because some people seem to feel emboldened rather than chastened by the attack on the Capitol and how that turned out.

The weird, if I can call it that in light of the attack, and despite Mitch McConnell and Kevin McCarthy and others, blaming Donald Trump in part for the attack, but weird in that context is a renewed loyalty to Trump being shelled by Republicans around the country right now. Like in Arizona, did you hear this? The State Republican Party didn't censure members who voted to overturn the election or support QAnon this week. They censured their Republican Governor Doug Ducey for certifying the election and they censured Cindy McCain.

The state party in Oregon has declared the insurrection to be a false flag operation staged by the left, despite all the evidence showing the opposite. In the senate, 45 of the 50 Republicans voted not to proceed with an impeachment trial even though one is coming but Biden isn't commenting, rather he's keeping his head down and sticking to business.

He has now issued 31 executive orders on policy, most having to do with COVID, racial justice, immigration, and the climate.

Some highlights, as described by the New York Times editorial board this morning, he has committed to rejoining the Paris Climate Change agreement, ended the Muslim travel ban, canceled the permit for the Keystone XL pipeline, rescinded funding for and halted construction on the wall at the southern border, reaffirmed the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program, DACA, mandated mask-wearing on federal grounds, moved to end the federal government's reliance on private prisons, reversed the ban on transgender military service and called for agency assessments aimed at advancing racial equity, just to name a few.

That from the Times in an editorial that's headlined, Ease Up on the Executive Actions, Joe. We'll get to that. Here's Biden yesterday, pushing back on the standard Republican line that fighting climate change means destroying jobs.

Joe Biden: When I think of climate change, I think of the answers to it, I think of jobs. A key plank of our Build Back Better recovery plan is building a modern, resilient climate infrastructure and clean energy future that will create millions of good-paying union jobs, not $7, $8, $10, $12 an hour but prevailing wage and benefits.

Brian Lehrer: President Biden yesterday. With me now on that and more, New York City congressman Adriano Espaillat, who represents Upper Manhattan and parts of the Bronx, among other things. he is the first Dominican American member of Congress. Congressman, always good to have you with us. Welcome back to WNYC.

Adriano Espaillat: Thank you so much, Brian. Thank you once again for having me.

Brian: Can I start on the Department of Homeland Security's warning that there's a heightened threat of attack from white supremacists and other domestic extremists right now? They didn't get very specific. How do you understand what they're warning about?

Adriano: All right. This is not surprising. We saw how Trump for some time egged them on, agitated them, and finally incited them to attack the Capitol. The fact that this is still festering is not surprising to me or should not be surprising to anybody. Racism was not created by Donald Trump, although he thrived on it. It was around before he was there, and it will be around unfortunately after he's gone. We must eradicate it. This is being fueled by obviously very, very radical right, racist sectors of society that have been around all alone, Brian and just decided to take their hoods off when Donald Trump came to power.

I'm not surprised that this is happening. We must continue the effort and we must [unintelligible 00:04:43] law enforcement's feet to the fire to ensure that as many people that broke the law during the January 6 insurrection are held to the letter of the law and that they're prosecuted.

Brian: I understand, obviously, that they've been emboldened by Trump for four years, but if the premise here is that these groups feel emboldened by the attack on the Capitol, what's your understanding of why that would be true? Everyone from Trump on in has condemned that attack, hundreds of people are being charged as criminals for taking part, and obviously, it failed. They're not going to violently overthrow the federal government. What's to feel emboldened by?

Adriano: Well, these are remnants of Jim Crow, these are remnants of the Southern Dixiecrats that change really the way we do politics in America by holding the process hostage unless these very, very aggressive right-wing policies will be considered. This is the history of America, I'm not surprised. Why should we be surprised when in fact Donald Trump called the folks that marched with torches in Charlottesville, at the very beginning of his administration, he said that there was some good people there? This is reminiscent of Nazi Germany, people with torches shouting antisemitic slogans.

I'm not surprised that there are these very fringe elements in society that are armed, dangerous, and emboldened by the attack on the Capitol. Of course, the rest of society has condemned them but they're still there. Geographically, they're very much centered in certain regions of the country, states like Arizona and the South.

Brian: One report I saw yesterday before we go on to other things, said one target could be members of Congress when you leave heavily fortified DC and go home to your districts. Do you feel safe? Or are you taking any new precautions?

Adriano: Look, I always felt, particularly when I walk down the steps of the Capitol after taking the votes that we were pretty much wide open there. I always felt that there was very lax security in the Capitol compound. On the day of the insurrection, as I walked into my office at about 8:30 in the morning, I was walking on the sidewalk right next to some of the protesters. They were already there early in the morning and they were going right through security with very little action to impede them.

I thought that we were wide open perhaps because we want to be an open government, we want to preserve the mystique of being an open society and open government, but we were wide open. The fact that they will now try to go individually after us, we saw how one member at least if not more of the seditious insurrectionists wanted to assassinate AOC. They went there looking to lynch Vice President Pence and assassinate Nancy Pelosi. I feel very strongly had they breached the floor of the house or had they gone there when members of Congress were there, it would have been very ugly. Members would have gotten killed.

This is a serious event in the history of the United States and I think we should not underestimate it or treat it lightly. I think we should treat it as what it is, a seditious insurrection by folks, some of which are members of our armed forces, or some of which have or are currently members of law enforcement agencies across the country. This is very serious. Had it been Black Lives Matter they would have been thousands of arrests by now. I think that they've been very lax, law enforcement has been very lax in following up on who perpetrated these very serious crimes.

Brian: My guest is New York City Congressman, Adriano Espaillat. We can take phone calls for him on any area of policy. This is not all going to be on the insurrectionists and what might come next from insurrectionists. We're going to try to get to immigration, climate, and COVID at least, so any question on anything relevant to Congressmen Espaillat that you want to call in with, 646-435-7280. 646-435-7280. Or you can ask a question or make a comment on Twitter, we'll let your Twitter feed go by @BrianLehrer.

You're the first Dominican-American member of Congress in a largely Dominican district. Can you personalize for non-Dominican listeners how President Biden's early actions on immigration might affect people in your district?

Adriano: Oh, it's very important, the DACA executive order, but also his comprehensive immigration plan that's put forward. We're going to be comparing it to the work that we've done in the Congressional Hispanic Caucus. I co-chair in the Hispanic Caucus, the task force that's looking at our proposals and comparing them to the Biden proposal to strengthen it if we see some weakness instead.

To us, it's very personal. It would fast-track family reunification, meaning that moms and dads that came from the DR, for example, sometimes have to wait 7 to 10 years before they reunite with their children. By the time that happens, they're adults. This strikes right at one very important factor in the success of individuals and that's, how do you bring your family together? This will help with that.

Naturally, it would put people on track to get the green cards, eventually, get their citizenship. These are all so important to 11 million people across the country, but also very important to our economy. These are folks that do jobs that many Americans don't want to do. These are folks that were out there during the pandemic, helping communities across the country. We must finally do a comprehensive immigration reform. I'm very encouraged that the Biden administration is taking this up.

Brian: Why do you think this would succeed in Congress this time when it's failed in the past? Some of the history for listeners who might not know, not only President Obama but also President George W. Bush was for this kind of comprehensive immigration reform. John McCain was for it. Marco Rubio was in a bipartisan group that was for it. Same basic idea, but each time it didn't have enough Republican support to pass, they'll call it amnesty, they'll call it a plot to get 11 million members of a larger Democratic voter advantage, and there are enough Republicans to kill it. Is there any reason to believe politically this time would be different in the Senate where they need 60 votes?

Adriano: The economy needs it, Brian. I think that any resurgence of the US economy in history has witnessed the hand of immigrant labor, if you may. The economy needs it, but politically also, I think they failed. President Trump, when he walked down that escalator and called all Mexican rapists and criminals, felt that he will be able to tout his anti-immigrant feelings and leave them to this political [crosstalk]

Brian: It propelled him to the nomination. Why think you're going to win on this, this time?

Adriano: It propelled him to the nomination, but ultimately, it failed. I think ultimately, it failed. If you take a look at the polls, for example, for Dreamers, that 80% of Americans were for Dreamers and TPS recipients in red states and in blue states. They understood how someone that came here when they were one, two years old, maybe didn't even speak the language of the home country, didn't have any connections back home, lives and play by the rules and went to school and did well for themselves and their families, should stay here. They're Americans.

Brian: The Dreamers should be the easy part.

Adriano: People understand that, and I think it failed. They may not want to go back to that political strategy again.

Brian: Let me get to the coronavirus and vaccine rollout. Congressman, we talked on the show yesterday about news from your district that the Washington Heights armory, which of course, is in the largely Dominican district that you represent, and which I believe is the only vaccination site in Upper Manhattan, and correct me if I'm wrong, is seeing an overwhelming percentage of white people coming in for the available appointments, including some from New Jersey. I'm curious if that's something you know about, and how much you consider it a problem of access or vaccine hesitancy, or what?

Adriano: Yes, that is a big problem, and my office has been working very hard for the last 48 hours to fix that because these are the neighborhoods that got hammered by the pandemic, Northern Manhattan. The West Bronx get devastated by the pandemic. They don't have a major site like we have in the armory. Now we fixed it. 100% of the vaccines are going to be for New Yorkers, and 60% will be for people uptown, including West Harlem, Hamilton Heights, Washington Heights, Inwood, Northern Manhattan.

That's what it was intended to be, not some lady driving and rolling in on a limousine with her pet poodle, which I saw a photo of someone from the East Side of Manhattan rolling in a limousine with a pet poodle.

Brian: Did the poodle get a shot?

Adriano: I hope not. Nothing against the folks. Everybody should get vaccinated. I believe very strongly that those neighborhoods that got disproportionately impacted by the pandemic, that got hammered by the pandemic in the months of February, March, and April that are still facing great challenges because of the pandemic health-wise, because of our disparities, because there's high rates of diabetes and asthma and cardiovascular problems in our population deserve to get the shots first. Unfortunately, we don't have enough shots. As of yesterday, New York City only had 8,000 COVID vaccines available.

One of the big problems is, I spoke to the governor, and I conveyed to him, I thought that it will be important that we get these major venues like Yankee Stadium, Citi Field, Madison Square Garden, Barclay, all the armories. You have an armory in Harlem. You have the Kingsbridge Armory, which is the biggest armory in the country. These are venues that are really perfect for this kind of massive vaccination campaign that can put us in a good place four weeks for now, but we got to have the vaccines. We got to have the vaccine to-

Brian: One more thing on this, and then we'll start to take some calls. I saw a stat from Colorado yesterday that 22% of the population there is Latino, similar to New York City, but only 4% of those vaccinated in Colorado so far. Do you know if it's that [crosstalk]?

Adriano: Brian, I always felt that this was going to be a problem, the vaccination, the ethics of vaccination was going to be a problem. I think that we need to prepare ourselves as a country to do this fairly and equitably.

Brian: Also, vaccine hesitancy seems to be more prevalent among Latinos than among African-Americans, or any other group from the surveys that I've seen. How do you explain it? How do you fight that aspect?

Adriano: As you know, I vaccinated myself, and I came out positive, and that was a problem because I had to explain it to my district. I think that the fact that I got the vaccine, even though after my second vaccine, a few days after my second vaccine, I tested positive, it saved my life. I spoke to Dr. Fauci, he said had I not received my first vaccine, I may have landed in the ICU of my local hospital. It saved my life. I never had any symptoms, I never had any fevers, or I never had any coughs. I never had any of the symptoms that show up and complicate people's health. I think that people should go out there and get the vaccine, absolutely. Save your life. It saved mine.

Brian: That's exactly how they say the vaccine probably works. It doesn't prevent you from getting the virus, it prevents you from getting sick from the virus. What was the timeline of your experience? Did you have your first shot before the insurrection and then you got exposed at the insurrection like some of your colleagues?

Adriano: I got my second shot the day after the insurrection on the 7th. I had gotten my first shot on the 19th. I was 20, 21 days into my first shot.

Brian: Of December?

Adriano: Yes. Again, the vaccine at three weeks after your second shot, it should really help prevent you from getting it, not 100%. It will prevent you from landing in the intensive care unit. That's what it will do. It's very much like the flu shot that it doesn't necessarily 100% prevent you from getting the flu, but it will prevent you from getting really sick.

Brian: Betty in The Bronx, you're on WNYC with Congressman Adriano Espaillat. Hi, Betty.

Betty: Hi, Brian. Hi, congressman. Very quickly. I filed my income tax for 2019 on July 15th. It is now January 29th, I still have not received my refund. I contact IRS, or I can do it online, and all it says is, "We've received it, but because of COVID they have not been able to process." As a result, I can't get my stimulus because it's based on my income tax and now we're heading into a new income profiling time, and I'm concerned that I'm not going to see my refund. Is there anything that can be done to get IRS to move on processing not only mine but probably other Americans who have filed?

I did it by paper, I didn't do it online so it's being held up and as a result, I'm not seeing anything. I'm a senior citizen, I'm on a fixed income, my refund is important to me as well as the stimulus would have been helpful too.

Brian: Betty, he's your congressman? Congressman Espaillat is your congressman?

Betty: That's correct. Yes. I called your office, I left a message and I also sent an email and I haven't received any response.

Brian: Congressman, you know a lot of people are in this position, we did a segment on it last week. People who, because of the kind of situation with the tax filings that Betty is explaining about herself, should be eligible for a stimulus check but haven't gotten them.

Adriano: I'll tell you what, Betty, I'll just give you my personal cell number, is 917-684-4957, again 917-684-4957. I like to be accessible to everybody and we'll help you. We'll try to get to the bottom of it and find out what's going on with the IRS and your returns. By the way, today's been the Earned Income Tax Credit Day, Brian. I encourage everyone when they do their taxes to ensure they benefit from the earned income tax credit, which is designed to help working-class families and working-class workers.

We're trying to raise the actual funding for it with the Biden Administration so look out for this debate on the earned income tax credit, which I think is a good measure to help working-class families.

Brian: Oh, screeners, could we take Betty's contact off the air in case she didn't get that cell phone number. We'll just put her in touch directly with the congressman's office after that. I promise. Let's take Betty's contact off the air and help her out. Rami in Jersey City you're on WNYC with Congressman Adriano Espaillat. Hi Rami.

Rami: Hi. Good morning, Mr. Brian, and good morning, congressman.

Brian: Good morning.

Adriano: Good morning.

Rami: Long-time listener and first time calling. Yes, sir.

Brian: Welcome in.

Rami: My question about the immigration policy, what's Biden Administration going to bring to the legal immigrants that have a pending case almost six years now since Obama?

Brian: What kind of case? Do you want to explain it a little bit more and then-

Rami: Asylum case.

Brian: Oh, an asylum case?

Rami: Yes, sir.

Adriano: Oh, an asylum case.

Brian: Congressman, is that enough information to help Rami a little bit?

Adriano: We have to really get the details regarding the asylum application to make a determination of where he stands. Again, we will take care of you. If you call our office, we will be able to address your individual cases, asylum cases, immigration cases. We have a specialist, an immigration specialist that is there to assist all my constituents.

Brian: We played a clip of Biden on climate protection and jobs in the intro to this segment. I see you put out a statement supporting him on climate. How do you see the threat as most relevant to your Bronx and Manhattan district?

Adriano: Obviously, districts like the one that I represent contribute less to climate change problems and are impacted more. Most of the folks, for example, that I represent take public transportation to go to work yet we have a high rate of asthma in our district, we have very chronic respiratory diseases with our senior population in our district and these are all climate-related illnesses.

Very often people that contribute less to the problem are impacted disproportionately. For that reason, I've introduced a climate change, environmental justice amendment that says that anytime we agree on anything regarding climate that the funding that comes through, the resources that come through should come to those communities that are impacted disproportionately first. This is something that will help my district.

Biden, of course, his administration has shown an interest in environmental justice. Environmental justice is an important issue that must be at the table. Anytime we talk about fossil fuels, anytime that we talk about climate change, even as we speak about our international position on climate change and going back to the Paris Accord, we must consider that.

Even in countries like the triangle countries in Central America, immigration is generated by climate issues, by droughts, by food security issues that propel women, for the most part, to travel thousands of miles with their children to the Southern border.

We must take a look at these disparities in the environmental debate that impact communities of color in a different way.

Brian: Question on climate and jobs and the economy. Scott in Ridgefield Park, you're on WNYC with Congressman Espaillat. Hi Scott.

Scott: Hi Brian. Hi congressman. I just heard you say something about drought in Central America. People are leaving Central America because there's turmoil, there's people getting threatened by gangs, that's why they're leaving mostly and no opportunity, but I was going to get back to climate change. The energy costs, the new policy, the Green New Deal is going to drive up oil prices, gas prices, electricity prices for every American. $100 to $150 a month will probably go up in each person's bill depending on where you live. That's over $1,000 a year that poor and middle-class people have to absorb.

I guess you like to support the poor populations in the US and try to help, but it seems like that's a bad policy because really you're punishing them because of our overall energy policy in the US. The other thing is immigration. When you add 11 million people to the workforce, it drives down wages if these are entry-level jobs. The people that get hurt for that are the people that have those entry-level jobs and lower wages. It just keeps them depressed. It benefits the really wealthy people that own the factories that don't have to pay people a great wage.

Brian: Sure. A class-based question from a conservative viewpoint, but a class-based question, congressman how would you answer on each?

Adriano: First under migration, violence and the gangs are one of the factors that drive migration to the Southern border but there's no question that food security is another one. At the center of food security is this horrible drought that has been lurking around Central America for seven years. That propels women with small children to travel from Guatemala to Mexico, from Mexico to the US and that's a factor. It's not the only factor but it is a factor.

With regards to 11 million immigrants, they're already here. They're already working. They pick our fruits, they take care of our elderly, they're nannies to our children. They do many jobs that are integral to our success as a society. What could be more important than having your children well taken care of when you go to work? What could be more important than someone really taking real good care of your elderly, frail parents in the golden years of their life? What could be more important just as-

Brian: I'll move you along because we're going to run out of time soon. What about his question on, what do we do to energy prices to enact all these restrictions on fossil fuels for poor and working-class people?

Adriano: We should be innovative at dealing with that particular issue, but what I do know is that this fossil fuel problem is not sustainable. We're looking to save the planet, we're looking to really revamp the economy because this is really ultimately also about creating new green jobs that will be good-paying jobs and we'll be able to train the workforce for these thousands of new jobs that will become available.

Brian: Also on jobs, I see you issued a release about helping small businesses. Is that about a new round of COVID-related PPP loans?

Adriano: That's correct. We had a round table a couple of days ago with the SBA to make sure that small businesses understand the details behind the new PPP. There are some changes. For example, restaurants will get three and a half times their payroll, as opposed to two and a half times for other businesses, that's because restaurants have been hit harder by the pandemic.

In addition to that, you must establish that you have a 25% decrease in your revenue. You could apply again even though you applied the first time. There's also a significant number of grants which are not the forgivable loans also like PPP that you're eligible for to apply as well. We're working hard to increase the number of businesses that apply to the PPP program.

Brian: Last thing. I mentioned the Times editorial today asking Biden to ease up on executive orders after 31 of them in his first week. They argue that to really build the bigger political base he wants the unity that he wants, he's got to start keeping his promise to be a good legislative negotiator. Republicans say Biden hasn't offered anything yet that gives them something they want in exchange for something Democrats want. Are they wrong? Or what would you say to the Times editorial board?

Adriano: President Trump did a lot of damage to our country. He pushed us back several decades and we must do a rapid repair. This is like a rapid refund from the PIRS. This is rapid repair. It must happen as quickly as possible. There are some low hanging fruits that don't require much work that we should do immediately. I think that that's what he's doing.

Of course, there was one particular initiative that I think will attract the attention of the other side of the aisle. That's a major transportation infrastructure bill. I think that both red States and blue States, Republican districts and Democratic districts have bridges that are virtually collapsing. They have major road issues, they need tunnels, but they also need a new infrastructure. They need broadband. Also, the water system is dilapidated all and dangerous. We need to give a major facelift to our nation, and that will require a major transportation infrastructure bill. I think it will help both sides of the aisle. It will drive up employment and the economy. It will be good for everybody.

Brian: All right. Congressman Adriano Espaillat, Democrat from Upper Manhattan and the Bronx. By the way, you mentioned that photo of the woman from out of state with her poodle and a limousine coming for a vaccine at the armory. Listener tweets, "The poodle did not get a shot, but he does wear a face mask." Just so you know somebody has a sense of humor out there and even dogs can be good citizens. Congressman, we always appreciate it. Thanks a lot. Stay safe.

Adriano: Thank you Brian, have a good one. Bye-bye.

 

Copyright © 2020 New York Public Radio. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use at www.wnyc.org for further information.

New York Public Radio transcripts are created on a rush deadline, often by contractors. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of New York Public Radio’s programming is the audio record.