Brian Lehrer: It's The Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. Good morning, everyone. The election to replace George Santos in Congress from Queens and Nassau counties finally saw its only televised debate last night with six days of early voting all already done. If you live in the district, you can still vote today through Sunday and on election day itself next Tuesday for Democrat Tom Suozzi or Republican Mazi Pilip. The Suozzi versus Mazi race is in its home stretch.

We'll talk about the state of that race now and play some excerpts from the debate which reveal policy differences on issues including abortion rights, banning semiautomatic assault weapons like AR-15s, and the bipartisan Senate border and aid to Israel bill. We're delighted to have with us for this the moderator of the debate, Rich Barrabi, whose day job is to anchor Mornings on News 12 Long island and to host their show, Power & Politics.

Also, Errol Louis, host of Inside City hall weeknights at 7:00 Spectrum News NY1, and a New York Magazine columnist. NY1 airs in the five boroughs. News 12 airs in Nassau and Suffolk. We've got the whole district covered. Errol, always great to have you. Welcome back. Rich, thanks a lot for joining us. I know you're taking time out from your own show to do this, so thank you, and welcome to WNYC.

Rich Barrabi: Thanks for having me.

Errol Louis: [crosstalk] you, Brian.

Brian Lehrer: I'll dive right in here with one of the biggest issues in this race, the asylum seekers who've been coming to New York in large numbers since 2022. In this clip, republican candidate, Pilip, says what she wants Congress to do about the southern border. Democratic candidate, Suozzi, criticizes her for opposing the bipartisan border bill that the Senate took up this week. Pilip speaks first.

Mazi Pilip: Building the wall, increase more control, border control members. On top of it, we have to make sure we need to be tight when it comes to asylum seeker. I want to secure the borders because at the end of the day, this is our country. We need to make sure, we need to know who's coming here and if we decided to bring more people, we have to have plan in place in order to help those people.

Rich Barrabi: Quick response, and then I want to get to our viewers.

Tom Suozzi: Yes, I'd like to. Right now, there's a bipartisan solution that's been negotiated in the United States Senate that builds more wall, that gets more border patrol agents, that speeds up the process for looking at asylum seekers. It now has a 10-year backlog. I say bring it down to a matter of weeks.

The Wall Street Journal said it has reforms that Trump never came close to getting. They were so close to getting this deal done. Then President Trump, former President Trump, came in and said, '"I don't want you to give a victory to Biden." After looking for this. All these problems, terrorists are coming over fentanyl, all these problems. I agree there's problems. We finally have a chance to have a solution, and we're not going to do it because President Trump said it will help Biden, as Mitt Romney said, "That's appalling."

Brian Lehrer: One addendum to that exchange about a minute later, Pilip dismisses the idea that Suozzi was pursuing there, that there was a meaningful bipartisan bill.

Mazi Pilip: The Senate Bill that came, it didn't even pass. I don't know which bipartisan bill are you talking about. It didn't even come to the floor because it did. The reason for that, it doesn't really hear our borders.

Brian Lehrer: Tom Suozzi and Mazi Pilip from their News 12 debate last night. Listeners, anyone out there right now who watched the debate, give us any of your impressions on that or these campaigns generally, or ask questions of our guests. Rich Barrabi from News 12 who moderated the debate, and Errol Louis from NY1. 212-433-WNYC, 212-433-9692. Call or text.

Rich, first of all, what was it like to moderate this debate? As we heard in those first clips, it was a slugfest of accusations in both directions.

Rich Barrabi: It certainly was, Brian, and I think we knew that's how it was going to go, going into it because of the fact that this is the only debate. It is this close to election day. Early voting, of course, well underway. Both candidates not only were seeking to define themselves against the ads that are running against them, but also to define their opponents.

We certainly saw that on this issue, among others, because the migrant crisis really has emerged as the number one issue in this race, which I'm not sure everyone recognized would be the case six weeks ago but here we are, and they are digging into it.

Suozzi tried to get on the offensive because throughout this campaign, he has been painted as someone weak on borders. They've called him Sanctuary Suozzi in some of these ads. He got on the offensive early, but Pilip was able to stand her ground and reiterate the same talking points that are resonating with so many voters in this district.

Brian Lehrer: Well, give me your sense as a Long Island politics show host. Is this as important an issue to voters in the district as all this makes it seem? Almost all the asylum seekers are in the city and very few in Nassau County, I think. Or is that wrong?

Rich Barrabi: It's 100% right in terms of it being the number one issue when you walk the district, when you talk to voters, even though, as you said, rightfully, that the migrant issue at this point is more of a New York City issue. Long Islanders, especially in this district, are very concerned about it.

This third district is not the third district of Tom Suozzi's first go around. There are different lines here. This district now incorporates much more Republican territory in places like Levittown, Beth Page, North Massapequa. That is why the Pilip campaign from day one has sought to define Suozzi as weak on borders and tying him to President Biden and his policies on this issue.

Brian Lehrer: Errol, listening to those exchanges and following the race generally, would you say they have actual policy differences on the border or only on how to achieve policy goals that they have in common?

Errol Louis: Oh, I think there are some policy differences, although they were muted. Everyone agrees that there has to be some federal action. The only question is how and when. To the extent that we have this deadlock in Washington over the question of when, it's a deeply political question. There are, really, a lot of signs that people are simply trying to game the politics of it so that certain bills are not making it to the floor or are declared non-starters, not because there's anything substantively wrong with the bill, or at least we don't hear that.

What we end up really seeing is that people are saying, "Well, we'll do this, but we'll do it later when we have a different president. Let's not help the current White House. Let's see if we can get a reset on this." It's a legitimate tactic, although a somewhat unprincipled one on some level. You can delay legislation if you think you can get a better deal later. To the extent that you would call it a policy difference, I think that's really what you're looking at.

Brian Lehrer: Well, Errol, we heard Mazi Pilip deride the idea of a bipartisan Senate bill since, as it turned out, there were not enough Republican votes in the Senate to actually pass it, even though a group of Republicans worked with a group of Democrats to write the bill.

This week, and I want to get your comment on that, this as someone who also talks about national politics, this week we saw the spectacle of Senate Republican leader, Mitch McConnell, before the bill, before he was against it. A blatant flip in a very short time frame of just a matter of days. Was this just fealty to Donald Trump so Trump could have a campaign issue instead of progress actually being made, like Suozzi was claiming there, or can it be seen any other way?

Errol Louis: Well, there are a number of people in the Senate who did exactly what you just described, that it was fealty to Donald Trump, period. Now, what goes with that when you get to the level of a Mitch McConnell is he wants a majority. He wants to win control of the Senate. He wants his old job back as majority leader. That means making sure there are enough Republicans that survive this election to make him the leader again. That means listening to what they say.

If they're doing what Trump wants, and they would constitute, in theory, the majority, that might make him the boss of the Senate again, then Mitch McConnell's going to play along. That's been the story all along. There are those who think that it is a shameful use of politics to put those political considerations above the substance of a really important, really urgent issue, whether it's the border itself or some of the other aid packages that were tied to it, like aid to Ukraine or aid to Israel but we take the politics the way we find them.

I think that's exactly what we've got. We've got a really hyper political environment. That really came through during the debate as well, where it was almost like a European-style debate at times, where it was just kind of look, you're a Democrat, so this is what you stand for. Regardless of what you've done, regardless of what you've said, regardless of what you believe, if you have this label, you're going to have to be credited or blamed for anything that that party does. Very unusual.

Brian Lehrer: And vice versa, right?

Errol Louis: Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. Suozzi over and over again said, especially on abortion and a number of other issues, said, "If you're with this Republican majority, this is what you're going to do is provide one more vote and possibly the margin of victory on a lot of key issues." It's really what voters are being asked to choose from.

Brian Lehrer: It's true in this race as it will be in many in this whole election year for Congress. The old cliche that all politics is local is getting flipped to all politics is national. Let's take abortion rights as the next issue with another clip from the debate. Spoiler alert for those of you who haven't been following the race, they do have a difference on what Congress should do on abortion rights. Suozzi has been running attack ads claiming or highlighting that Pilip is being supported by backers of a national abortion ban with no exceptions, even for rape or incest. It's not Pilip's position that that should be the law of the land, and Pilip accused Suozzi of lying about her stance on abortion rights, which she states here.

Mazi Pilip: It is a personal decision, a personal choice. Every woman should have that choice. I'm not going to tell her what to do. I made it so clear. It's so personal to me.

Tom Suozzi: You're pro-choice?

Mazi Pilip: Again, this is a personal choice. Every woman will make that decision. You have been lying to the public.

Brian Lehrer: Mazi Pilip there from last night's debate. Rich, she would not use the term pro-choice as you heard Suozzi trying to get her to. In fact, she said she's pro-life, but believes that a woman has a right, as she was describing there. To my eye, the Suozzi ads and fliers are misleading on this topic, but what I think you brought out last night in the debate was that they do have a significant disagreement still. Suozzi would vote to codify Roe versus Wade abortion rights into US law. Pilip would not, and supported the Supreme Court decision overturning Roe. Did I get that right from the back-and-forth they had?

Rich Barrabi: I think that's right, Brian. I think Pilip tried to walk the line of making it clear to voters in this district where this is a very important issue, that she would not infringe upon their pro-choice abilities. However, she would not say she is pro-choice. Her stance is not all that different from what we've heard in the past from some Democrat lawmakers. Even President Biden has said in the past, "Personally, I'm pro-life as a Catholic. However, that is not my role as a legislator." That's what Pilip is saying here. However, I don't know if it's enough.

If this is your number one issue, if you are concerned about abortion rights, and you want Roe versus Wade codified into law, I don't know that Mazi Pilip told you something last night that makes you say, "Okay, I'm with Pilip." However, on the same point, I don't think she showed any kind of extremist agenda as has been portrayed in some of the ads against her on this issue. It's up to the voters then to determine if she walked that line well enough, but Tom Suozzi, again, was certainly on the offensive on this topic.

Brian Lehrer: Errol, she was walking a line there, as Rich just put it, an act of needle threading. Another way to look at it that Pilip is doing there, supports the Dobbs decision, does not support a national ban, but also does not support codifying Roe and won't call herself pro-choice, which is about policy. It's not about your own personal relationship with your own pregnancies.

Suozzi's position is, we can say, at least more consistent and therefore maybe more predictable once he is in Congress compared to how predictable Pilip might be. He opposed the Dobbs decision, supports Roe versus Wade as national law if Congress can vote on such a bill. How did you hear that act of needle threading?

Errol Louis: Well, she got frustrated because it's a difficult line to take, but she had to go to what was frankly a mainstream Republican position not that long ago, and so now not say that she's pro-choice. In the end, my wife and I were kicking it around. The closest, I think, that she could have come to saying exactly what she meant was to say, "I am pro-choice and I choose life." She thinks that as the mother of seven kids, women can and should make their own decision, and she personally has made a decision to have seven kids. She does not want to deny women the right to make a similar or different choice.

She says on her website, she will not support a national abortion ban, but it's very hard to carve out that position at this point to say, "I wanted Roe versus Wade struck down. I believe that a pro-life position is a principled one and I happen to hold it. However, I don't want a national ban on abortion." That's just a very narrow piece of political turf to try and stand on. You can see her visibly getting upset as she tried to occupy that increasingly, or this shrinking little piece of political turf that doesn't have a lot of standing right now in national politics or in the 3rd District.

Brian Lehrer: If people are voting on that issue, it's going to come down to who do you trust. Another issue on which Pilip seemed to be threading the needle, or maybe in this case, actually trying to obscure her own position, assault weapons. As you'll hear in this clip, she's been saying she supports a ban on automatic assault weapons, but they're already banned in the United States. It's semi-automatics like AR-15s that most Republicans are protecting now and the Democrats want to see banned, those rifles that are used so often in mass shootings. We'll hear both candidates in this clip.

Tom Suozzi: I have an F rating from the NRA. That's the one F in my life that I'm proud of. The reality is, is that I've sponsored every piece of major gun safety legislation in the Congress. I would like to know from Ms. Pilip when she answers this question, will she vote to ban semi-automatic weapons like AR-15? It's a very simple, straightforward question. Her conservative party that she disagrees with says, "No, we got to keep it the way it is." Let's see what she says.

Moderator: Go ahead.

Mazi Pilip: As a mother of seven children, I do worry, again, about mass shootings. Absolutely. We have to do better to make sure that guns stays in the hands of people with no mental issues, people not with the criminal record, or terrorists. We need to do better. We have to make sure we have background check. We have to make sure we have a training. We have to make sure we're following the rules and regulations. I support waiting time period. It's very important for us to follow the regulation. I don't see any reason why average American or individual we should have more powerful weapon than our cops. I don't see that. Therefore, I'm not going to support assault automatic weapon.

Rich Barrabi: Would you support a federal ban on assault rifles?

Mazi Pilip: I said I'm not going to support. I'm going to ban automatic assault weapon.

Tom Suozzi: Automatic are already banned. It's semi-automatic. Will you ban semi-automatic AR-15s?

Mazi Pilip: Anything that's more powerful than our cops holding-

Tom Suozzi: It's a very straightforward question.

Mazi Pilip: -I'm not going to support that.

Brian Lehrer: Rich, for you moderating the debate last night and covering the race generally, it did sound to me like Mazi Pilip refused to come out there against AR-15s and was using the category of automatic assault weapons to hide her actual position on the current issue, which is the semi-automatics like AR-15s, or did she leave a misimpression in the debate somehow?

Rich Barrabi: I think this is one of those issues in the debate where she would go only so far. She would go right to that line without actually saying what she would do if elected. We saw that on the migrant crisis. She talked generally about the broader talking points, when you're talking about sealing the border adding more agents. We talked about the same thing on abortion and here we are, again, on this issue of assault rifles, and she didn't quite get there.

There's another part to this from Mazi Pilip. Mazi Pilip is a registered Democrat, and so while, again, she's trying to walk this line in what is a purple swing district, she is, I think, also sensitive to the idea that if Republicans are going to win this race, if she's going to win this race, it's going to be based on GOP turnout. The Republicans have turned out so well over the past two or three years in Nassau County. You have talked about it. It's been a red wave, whether they're countywide election, state races here, or now in this congressional race. Even George Santos's race, honestly, was swept up into that. For Pilip, she doesn't want to lose that right flank either, so it seems she'll only go so far at this point because she is sensitive to the idea that she is hearing from some conservatives who are saying, "Why did we nominate a Democrat? We're the Republican Party." I think she's sensitive to it.

Brian Lehrer: Errol, I know you come from law enforcement family. Can you give us any context on the standard that Pilip was trying to set there, no weapons more powerful than the cops have?

Errol Louis: Yes. Look, the position of law enforcement, and including of a New York area, has been that nobody should have automatic weapons. If you push them a little bit, probably most of them would say both organizationally and personally and professionally, that semi-automatics are a problem as well. Yet that's at odds with where the National Republican Party is.

Once again, you have this odd place where Mazi is trying to make sure that she holds her endorsements in place, make sure that she's in tune with the National Party since they also are funding and supporting her campaign in a big, big way.

Mazi Pilip has to say, well, yes, I don't want to necessarily deal with the semi-automatic issue. Let me just revert to taking the stance that my local supporters have taken, which is that semi-automatics are a problem. Now, she couldn't come out and say that because that would put her at odds with the National Party. Suozzi tried to pounce on that. It's very tough to suss out in the heat of a debate but that I think is why she ended up there.

Brian Lehrer: Rich, I know you have to go back to work on your own show now on News 12. Thank you very much for taking this time. Just give our listeners not on Long Island your quick take on why the voters of Nassau and Suffolk have gone so Republican in the last few years. Both county executives have flipped from Democratic to Republican and in the congressional delegation, it used to be two and two. Now all four are Republicans. What has happened in these suburbs just outside super blue New York City?

Rich Barrabi: Well, it's a great question, Brian. I think on Long Island, we've seen this be a cyclical thing that takes place. You mentioned earlier, all of a sudden now all politics seem to be national. When Donald Trump was president, Democrats were winning on Long Island. When President Biden was elected, Republicans had been sweeping through offices when we're talking about village or town-level races.

Even in the governor's race, Lee Zelin did very well on Long Island. And Republicans have seized on frustration with measures in Albany, whether they're tied to Governor Hochul, whether it's tied to crime, inflation, and President Biden. I really believe that Mazi Pilip and the Republican Party in this race are once again saying, listen, if we stick to what's worked for us, if we turn out our people, if we don't make any big mistakes, we can win this thing again.

It's the Santos Playbook from two years ago. Obviously very different candidate. I'm sure she'd be the first to point that out. The playbook has worked in all of these different races and it looks like they're going to stick to it. We'll see if it works on Tuesday.

Brian Lehrer: Rich Barrabi does have to go. We'll continue in a minute with Errol Louis and your calls Rich Barrabi moderated last night's debate, his co-anchor of mornings on News 12, and host of their show, Power and Politics. Rich, thanks so much.

Rich Barrabi: Thank you.

Brian Lehrer: More with Errol in a minute.

[MUSIC - Marden Hill: Hijack]

Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer on WNYC. We'll continue now on the Tom Suozzi-Mazi Pilip race to replace George Santos in Congress for Queens and Nassau County. If we have time which I hope we will, we'll touch on some other New York City politics with Errol Louis that he's been writing about a New York magazine. Errol is the host of Inside City Hall weeknights at seven on Spectrum News New York 1 and a New York Magazine columnist.

Listeners, we can take a few phone calls and comments or questions via text message on the Pilip-Suozzi race, Mazi versus Suozzi. 212-433-WNYC. 212-433-9692. In fact, let me take a phone call right now. Here's Ray in Seaford. You're on WNYC. Hi, Ray. Thanks for calling in.

Ray: Hi, Brian. Thank you so much. Thank you, Errol. I really appreciate the job Rich did yesterday with hosting the debate. My concern though, was this district got so much attention even before the Santos situation because it was so gerrymandered. Even now, we've got Queens to Massapequa. Many of the people I know, many of my friends in Queens were complaining that they weren't able to get the debate last night. I guess my question is that does Errol fee its fair that parts of the district couldn't even see last night and what does that mean in terms of representation? It seems like these gerrymandered districts are crazy but CD3 going from Queens to Massapequa is particularly crazy. I just wanted his thoughts on that.

Brian Lehrer: Ray, thank you.

Errol Louis: A sore point with us, actually. We asked to moderate a debate. I don't know why they couldn't have done at least two, at least one in the city because there are some city voters that are in this district but Mazi Pilip did not agree. In fact, she wouldn't even come on our show to be interviewed. She was running a, you could call it low key or even stealth candidacy and that's her right. You can't make people talk if they don't want to talk on camera. I think it is a shame for the voters.

Consider this. The Creedmore Psychiatric Center which is one of the sites where migrants have been housed and so forth, it's a voting location and they spent more time and passion on that than almost any other issue during the one debate that Mazi Pilip agreed to. Really, it would've been a great thing if they had really included the New York City portion in particular and had more debates in general so that people could hear more about the different issues.

You can say that, well, maybe we don't necessarily need to do that, but I think it would've been better for everybody if we had. As far as the actual boundaries of the district, I'm not so sure about that. I think Eastern Queens has a lot in common with the suburbs both in voting behavior as well as, look, frankly, the terrain, if you drive. I spent a lot of time out in Great Neck. Unless I'm paying attention, it's not entirely clear when I've gone outside the city limits.

Brian Lehrer: Right. As some listeners have heard me say before, I grew up in the Queen's part of that district and that is certainly true the way it's trending these days. We recall that part of Queens elected a pretty maga Republican to City Council, Vicki Paladino.

To Ray's point, here's another text from a listener who says, "The reason we got George Santos is because we didn't vet him.

She, Mazi Pilip, is not transparent and refuses to debate in bigger media or go on this show, which is true. She declined our invitation to come on here, one-on-one, just as I guess she declined yours, Errol. I will say that that's a contrast with other Republican members of the Congressional delegation who've been elected recently. George Santos, for example, himself from the same district did come on the show for a candidate interview.

We've had some of the other newly elected Republicans from our region, di Esposito from Long Island, Lo Loda from Long Island, Lawler from just north of the city. It seems like and I think it's worth one more comment on, Errol, that it is a strategy. Rich said earlier that their strategy is to turn out the Republican vote. I guess they're doing this with lawn signs. They're doing this with social media. They're doing this, I assume, with targeted mailers. For whatever reason, they don't think it's to their benefit to have her even be seen with wider exposure. Why do you think that is?

Errol Louis: Well, it's not a crazy idea. I think you're implying exactly what the logic might be here which is if you get your base out and everybody else goes to sleep, then you win. It's not much more complicated than that. One reason that they've done so well, the Republicans have over the last couple of years is that the county chairman, Joe Cairo, is a very, very savvy guy. I've heard nothing but amazing phrases for him, not just from Republicans either but from Democrats who are in awe of his ability to maneuver out there.

This district, by the way, apparently, Chuck Schumer did not win in this district. Apparently, as well the State Comptroller, Tom DiNapoli, did not win in his last reelection campaign, did not carry the district, and he's from out there.

Brian Lehrer: Although Biden did, though, we should say.

Errol Louis: Biden won by eight points. Then again, consider Tom Suozzi saying specifically, while Biden was in town, just earlier this week basically said publicly, I don't want him in the district. Don't come by here. The Republicans are going to try and turn out every bit of their base, even if they have a registered Democrat as their candidate.

By contrast, the Democrats are, I think, a little skittish. They've been bruised over the last couple of years and they're not going to do what you would normally expect them to do which is bring in the President, play up the fact that I know the president and we can get some goodies for the district, if nothing else and turn out every Democrat in the district. They're actually

Errol Louis: Stop doing that. It's really quite striking.

Brian Lehrer: In fact, just as Rich earlier was talking about the strategy by Pilip to turn out the Republican base, it looks to me like a risk for Suozzi is that he's playing it so centrist that I wonder if there are enough swing voters who are actually undecided and weighing these choices to give him a victory when he's not playing two liberal democratic passions all that much to turn out the Democratic base.

He talked about, we're going to play a clip in a minute of him and one of Pilip talking about antisemitism, which he talked about passionately, but he didn't mention Islamophobia or anti-Palestinian hate when the recent news has things like Palestinian in Americans being shot in apparent hate crimes in Austin this week, and in Burlington last fall, some kind of chemical attack on some pro-Palestinian protestors at Columbia University last month.

Neither candidate specified that this is a problem both ways. Just talked about hate generally and antisemitism specifically. Suozzi needs strong Democratic turnout as well as swing voters. I wonder if you, as someone who watches these politics closely, think he's taking a calculated risk there.

Errol Louis: He is very much taking a risk. Look, I will defer to Tom Suozzi, former mayor of Glen Cove, who's the son of a former mayor of Glen Cove, who was the Nassau County executive ,and who represented part of this district in Congress for years. I will defer to him as far as where the wind is blowing, and whether it makes sense to try and do a base strategy, or whether it's better to lay low with the base and try and pull in some independence, or bring home some of the Democrats who have started to vote Republican, of whom Mazi Pilip herself is a prime example.

Putting aside everything else, there will be a lot of finger-pointing if Tom Suozzi loses this race. The National Democrats, the DCCC, the Democratic Congressional Campaign Committee, they put in a lot of time and resources. The minority leader, the head of the Democrats in Congress, our own Hakeem Jeffries, went out there to campaign for him. If all of this blows up in their face or it doesn't work out the way that they're hoping that question will be squarely on the table.

How do you expect to win as a Democrat if you're acting like you're ashamed to be a Democrat? What do you stand for? What does the party stand for? Why are you in this party if you're not willing to go out and carry the flag for the party? It's a perfectly legitimate question.

think this of all of the districts really almost in the whole country, if you were going to make an exception, this might be it because, as you were talking about before Brian, not just this area, but, really, all of Long Island, it's a swing area. When they swing, they all swing together. Some of those swings can last a couple of cycles, can last several years. Right now, we're clearly in a red phase and there's a question of whether or not Suozzi with all of his gifts and all of his history could be the exception to the rule.

Brian Lehrer: Well, here's maybe a very relevant caller to this point. Diane, who was out canvassing for Suozzi, I believe, in the district last Saturday. Diane, do I have that right? Hello?

Diane: That is correct. That's a perfect introduction, and thank you for taking my call. That was one of the swingiest canvases I've ever been on. I think if I had gone back and talked to the same person five minutes later, they might have given me a different answer in terms of their motivations and their inclinations.

The next few days for any of these candidates is going to be making the case and getting out the vote. People want to engage, they want to learn, they want to be active, but the candidate needs to deliver the bonafide and motivate people to get out to the polls. As a reminder, there's early voting today and Saturday and Sunday, the polls are closed on Monday, and then regular election day on Tuesday.

Brian Lehrer: Good to remind people again. Diane, was there any particular issue that jumped out at you that had people still on the fence?

Diane: The area that I canvased had very many people who were first-generation from other parts of the globe. They were naturalized voters and they felt very passionately about the immigration issue. They had some very strong thoughts about that, and I think it's very interesting in the last few days what's happened around that issue in Congress. I think there are very many and relevant talking points about what's happened in Congress that the candidates can really have authentic dialogue with their potential constituents. It's an important issue. Certainly, it's a political one, but it's something I think both candidates should address if they are truly running to represent their potential constituents in the last few days.

Brian Lehrer: Diane, thank you very much for chiming in. Interesting in the way that Diane helped us report that story with her experience canvassing last weekend. I'll touch one more issue from the debate with clips. In this case, it was one that they agreed on that antisemitism is a problem in the district and in the country right now. First, here's Tom Suozzi.

Tom Suozzi: Antisemitism is very real. The fear people are feeling is very real. I empathize with young people especially that are being subjected to this hateful rhetoric as we speak. There's a problem in our country with division and with hate. When everything is just an attack and attack and attack and no actual solutions, it raises the temperature and makes things worse for people. When I was in Congress, I supported a piece of legislation, actually built it with the problem solvers called the 25 Democrats and 25 Republicans to build support for it throughout the country for The Never Again Education Act to teach people about the realities of the Holocaust.

Brian Lehrer: Here's Mazi Pilip.

Mazi Pilip: As a Black woman, as a Jew, as mother, I hear you. I have been fighting antisemitism in the last three years because my son-- I have seven children. My son wanted for his Bat Mitzvah, he wanted a star of David necklace. When he wanted that, I wanted to give it to him as a mother, but I was very concerned, should I give him or not? Since October 7th, we are seeing antisemitism out of control. I feel the colleges. I was in the rally in front of Columbia holding students' hands and demanding that Columbia will do better to protect the Jewish student.

Brian Lehrer: Errol, they agreed on the issue as we can hear. I think this gets to one of the reasons that the Republican county party leaders chose Pilip out of many Republicans who wanted to be the nominee for this seat in the post-October 7th world, in a district with a large Jewish population. Here they have a newcomer for most voters who is an Ethiopian immigrant to Israel and served in the armed forces there before moving as a legal immigrant to New York. That checks a very unusual and relevant combination of boxes demographically in addition to her views on the issues, right?

Errol Louis: Absolutely. Look, I take all of those demographic unique qualities and put it together as an outsider. Even frankly, as an Ethiopian going to Israel, the whole issue with Ethiopian Jews that's been going on for decades they're not entirely accepted there. There's an outsider status there. She then comes to this country and immigrants are often not exactly welcomed even in New York City or the surrounding suburbs, and so you've got that.

You've got somebody who, as a Black American now is in another minority category, and women have gotten the short end of the stick in politics and elsewhere for a long, long time. This is somebody who, when she speaks, the passion comes right through. The experience is real. It doesn't hurt in a district that has a lot of Jewish voters that she was not just Israeli, not just Jewish, but an IDF paratrooper. She's got, on paper, a lot of the qualities that you want and a lot of that did come through in how she spoke, including that clip that you just played.

Brian Lehrer: The district is demographically interesting, very few Black or Latino residents, but about 18% Asian American as well as around 70% white. The Asian American population in the district includes many Chinese and Korean American families in the Queens part of the district and many South Asians in the Nassau part. I don't know how many of those Indian Americans or other South Asians are Muslim, but there are various Asian American groups who are apparently included in the real swing voter demographics in New York politics right now. Errol, I want to give you a quick shot at a comment on your latest article in New York Magazine, headline, "Andrew Cuomo wants the kind of redemption that comes from winning an election." What?

Errol Louis: [laughs] Look, I wanted to say in the column, what I have said to a lot of people, including Andrew Cuomo himself privately, which is that it's an odd situation, but he has no forum in which to argue the case that he wants to make. He wants to make the case and is trying in court, which is not the greatest forum to say that all of the women who accused him of sexual misconduct are either obviously lying are not credible.

He's also trying to make the case that the people who presented these cases ,and by that he means primarily Attorney General Letitia James, as well as some of her allies in the State Assembly, have all been unfair to him as well. He additionally wants to make the case that the press has been unfair to him.

Look, if you don't have any place else to go, as far as I can tell, the place where he can make the case that he has been wronged, that he still has something to offer, that he should be returned to public life is, well, look, go out there and have somebody elect you. That can silence all of the critics or at least hold them at bay long enough to get you back in the game if that's what you're determined to do.

Brian Lehrer: There's been a little buzz that he might primary Eric Adams for Mayor next year. Do you think that's a real possibility?

Errol Louis: It depends. It depends. I think look, I would say this as a blanket statement that nobody would quarrel with, which is that, if Andrew Cuomo sees daylight, he will run toward it. If he thinks there's a reasonable chance of him becoming mayor of New York, running for governor, I would even throw in Congress, he will take that shot. There's polling that showed that he would be a contender if Eric Adams were to go away. That's enough to get anybody's appetite whetted.

He's also got millions of dollars that can be deployed. He left office with a campaign fund that wasn't super full for a statewide race but was pretty formidable for a citywide race. He's in a position to do it if all of the stars lined up. Like any good politician, he's going to keep his eyes on the stars and see if they're lining up for him.

Brian Lehrer: Errol Louis, hosts Inside City Hall weeknights at 7:00 on Spectrum News NY1, and he is a New York Magazine columnist. Errol, thanks as always.

Errol Louis: Thank you, Brian.

 

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