[music]

Brian Lehrer: It's The Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. Good morning, everyone. There's been no gradual ramp-up period for Mayor Eric Adams. He came into office just 12 days ago as Omicron was exploding in the city. He immediately had to make crisis-level decisions about schools and tests and vaccine mandates. His new police commissioner immediately got into a public disagreement with a new Manhattan DA, Alvin Bragg, over what defendants to seek jail and prison time for and a few other things.

Adams' preferred choice for city council speaker, Francisco Moya, did not get in. He's had to deal with the horrific Bronx fire, the city's deadliest in more than 30 years. He's facing blowback on a few of his appointments, including his brother, Bernard Adams, to run his security detail. Here's the mayor defending that decision to reporters last Thursday.

Mayor Eric Adams: I trust my brother, my brother understands me, and if I had to put my life in someone's hand, I want to put in the hands of the person that I trust deeply, because that is a very personal process of your security.

Brian Lehrer: The mayor also said on Sunday that anarchists and white supremacists being on the rise is a reason he needs the person he trusts most in that position, but is that okay or is that nepotism that violates city ethical standards? We will talk about that and much more with two leading city hall reporters now, Jeff Mays from The New York Times and Katie Honan, from the nonprofit news organization, THE CITY. Hi, Jeff. Hi, Katie. Welcome back to WNYC.

Katie Honan: Thank you.

Jeff Mays: Morning, Brian.

Brian Lehrer: Can we start with the big picture? When Mayor John Lindsay took office in 1966, a transit strike began that day. I don't know if there's been a more intense day one crisis for a mayor to deal with between then and now and maybe this is worse. How would you characterize just the challenge from Mayor Adams in his first days in office before we even get to his policies? Katie?

Katie Honan: It isn't a transit strike, but facing the Omicron variant really raging and then unfortunately, what we saw last week in the historically deadly fire in the Bronx, it's been a lot. Of course with the Omicron variant, there come lots of other challenges, there come the issue of what to do with schools. Mayor Adams has even before he was sworn in, in Times Square, talk about intense right after the ball dropped. There was questions of who can return to work, will there be full offices? It's something that he's pushed, and he's pushed all that as the Omicron variant has continued to really spread across the city, so there's that tension.

Then there's just the picking up the pieces of what Mayor de Blasio left as well. Last fall, things had quieted down for Mayor de Blasio, and I'm sure he was hoping in the last month or two of office, it would be a lot calmer, but that's what Eric Adams has inherited. He certainly is a much different politician than Bill de Blasio. He's been a lot more active and out and about, but I will note he hasn't done public question and answers in a couple days, especially after a lot of these stories about his brother and other appointees has come out, so it's been intense. I don't remember the 1966 transit strike, but it seems like it's not as intense, but it certainly has its issues.

Brian Lehrer: We'll get into the issue about his brother and other particulars but, Jeff, anything to add to that about the moment? I think there is a tendency on the part of us in the media to focus on the micro right away and say, "Oh, what about this?" and yet, here is this environment into which Adams has stepped. Katie mentioned taking the oath at Times Square is the ball dropped. He even had to cancel his inauguration because of Omicron.

Jeff Mays: I think what we've seen with the mayor is that he is very frenetic, he's kept a very busy schedule these first few weeks, wanted to be out, wanted to be visible, but that still doesn't change the fact that he had these huge crises like, as Katie has mentioned, Omicron, by itself, would have been a very huge issue to deal with just coming into office and trying to figure out all the details in terms of vaccinations and employee mandates and some of those other issues.

I think what has happened is things just keep happening. We see what's going on at Rikers Island, that's another crisis. I think we're going to have to see how he manages all of these issues going forward. That hasn't stopped him from going out and trying to introduce some policy. He talks a little bit about crime on the subway, so he's trying to push forward, but that's what being the mayor of New York City is, is having to deal with multiple crises at once.

Brian Lehrer: Let's get into some of these policies. On Omicron, he seems to mostly be continuing what Mayor de Blasio was doing, and de Blasio wasn't always so popular, which doesn't mean he wasn't right on a lot of things, that's up to everybody to decide for themselves, but insisting on no remote option for schools, arguing that office workers should return to their desks, ramping up testing as much as he can in the face of supply shortages, and keeping the all-employer vaccine mandate that just took effect under de Blasio on December 27th. Am I missing any significant differences, Katie?

Katie Honan: No, it has been a continuation of Bill de Blasio's efforts, I think, especially Mayor de Blasio's what some people might say a stubborn lack of understanding of the way that the variant was spreading inside city offices and being very inflexible about any remote work option for workers. I think it reflected really to those workers. I've heard from so many of them, they were not happy, obviously, with what Bill de Blasio did, and they haven't been happy with what seems like that, a similar inflexibility from the part of Mayor Adams to just not even allow people to, if they feel like it, work remotely for a week or things like that. It seems to be much of the same and a continuation. Even the Health commissioner staying on before the new appointee comes on just for that transition.

Brian Lehrer: Anything more on than, Jeff, including what Katie pointed to, continuing to make all the municipal office workers work in person five days? I can't tell you how many phone calls I got from city workers furious about that. At least a lot of private companies that are bringing people back to the office went hybrid, a few days in, few days out, and Omicron changed the game for even a lot of them. Is Adams digging in on five-day municipal worker? What's the various unions saying about that?

Jeff Mays: Well, he seems to be stuck on that at this moment. I think though his larger message is that we are going to have to learn to live with the Coronavirus and its new variants, every variant that comes out, that the city cannot shut down. That is not that far-flung of an idea because you see on the national level President Biden and his advisors are also trying to come up with a strategy and idea to tell the public that this is going to be ongoing, this may be endemic eventually and so we have to learn how to live with the virus.

The one thing that I think the mayor has in his favor is that businesses have certainly moved ahead and have already sent their workers hybrid. He can continue on with that message that the city can't shut down. Obviously, he has control over the municipal workforce. That's something, a detail that they're going to have to work out. That was a difficult situation under Mayor de Blasio, who initially did not want workers to go remote but eventually had to yield on that. That's something that's going to be have to worked out between the unions, but the mayor has been strong on his message that we have to learn to live with this virus.

Brian Lehrer: Listeners, your reaction's welcome here to anything Mayor Adams has actually done so far in his first days in office, not what he ran on but what's actually happening as he takes over under intense circumstances so far, here on day 13, today's January 13th, right? Yes. 212-433-WNYC, 212-433-9692 or tweet your comment @BrianLehrer, or a question for our reporter guests, Katie Honan in from THE CITY and Jeffery Mays from The New York Times. 212-433-9692.

Jeff, the main thing he went on was public safety, sometimes with things that made people concerned with police violence and mass incarceration angry and afraid. He's made at least one policing announcement about deploying neighborhood cops to the subways. Can you explain what's new there?

Jeff Mays: Sure. It's not really hiring of any new officers or anything like that, it's really a change in policy. What the mayor announced last week was that police officers are now going to be required to do more frequent patrols of the subway system. If you are above ground, you're a police officer in a patrol car, when there's not a call, when there's not an urgent call, they are going to be required to stop at subway stations in their sector to go down and to do patrols.

The mayor used the term, he wanted to create a omnipresence of police in the subway. Some people have raised concerns about his use of that term, that maybe it's a bit Orwellian, but in addition to police officers patrolling, transit police officers are going to be required to do more patrolling of the subway. The police commissioner said she wants those officers to actually be engaging with passengers, speaking with passengers, doing things to try to prevent crime, like waking up sleeping passengers, making them aware of their surroundings.

The point is that the subway system, the ridership has declined since the pandemic, and obviously, that affects the subway system in terms of the money that's available, because fares make up a huge portion of the money for the system. Then on top of that, the governor also announced that she was going to create teams of social workers and outreach workers that will also be in the subway to help coordinate with the city to try to get people who are maybe suffering mental crises or homeless to help them connect with the help that they need. It's a two-pronged approach where the mayor is going to have police be more present in the subway, and also the governor plans to help send in outreach workers to help people in need.

Brian Lehrer: Now, Katie, anything else on law enforcement so far? That's a lot just on the subways, and it's the intersection of homelessness as an issue, as well as public safety as an issue. Sometimes they overlap, sometimes they don't, sometimes people think of them as the same thing when they really shouldn't. Nevertheless, that's what that is. Anything else on law enforcement since he ran on that so heavily?

Katie Honan: Yes, the other big thing that had actually sparked up before he was inaugurated is issues with-- The city council members signed a letter calling on him to-- I guess, critical of his comments about solitary confinement in the city's jails. It's set up what will likely be one of the first fights within the council beyond the speaker's race between the council and the mayor.

He has said he's not in favor of solitary confinement. He spoke about punitive segregation, some people say that it's the same thing, but that is where he is at. He says, "Look, we need to have people, if they're assaulting correction officers, if they're getting into fights, if they are a danger in jails, they should be separated." He came out really strong against what the city council members had signed on for the complete end of it.

That is one element of it. One of Eric Adams' phrases is, "Public safety is the prerequisite to prosperity," and that is what he ran on. This idea that, "Look, I was a police officer, but as a teen, I was also assaulted by cops. I've seen both sides of it." He also knows, in a lot of communities throughout the city, public safety is the issue, and if we're going to move on from COVID and get things back to normal where crime was lower pre-COVID, then you're going to need to be tougher on crime than, I guess, he's seen from the previous administration.

Brian Lehrer: Quick tweet that's come in from a listener that says, "If you're taking an informal, totally unscientific poll regarding is it nepotism if Adams appoints his brother to a $210,000 a year city job, head of his security detail, yes," says that listener.

We'll get to that issue in a couple of minutes, but Adams' new police commissioner, Keechant Sewell, has already gotten into a public dispute with the new Manhattan DA, Alvin Bragg, after Bragg kept his campaign promise to issue a day one memo listing some crimes he wouldn't seek prison time for, including illegal gun possession and resisting arrest if no violence was involved. The police commissioner issued her own memo, which looks like got leaked to the New York Post, and that's how it went public. Jeff, do you know how that went public by any chance, and if she intended to have this public dust-up or something more private?

Jeff Mays: I don't really have an answer to that. I do know that this eventually was going to come out because of the difference of opinion that they have in terms of how certain crimes should be prosecuted. Alvin Bragg really ran on this idea, as did a lot of progressive prosecutors around the country, that there needed to be a shift in the way people are treated when they enter the criminal justice system.

There needed to be a shift because there was a plan to close Rikers Island, for example. You can't close Rikers Island if it's at the levels that it was at before in terms of people who are being held, many of them who were being held before trial, many who were there on charges that may not be as serious as people think. She put forth this questioning of that memo. I know they did have a meeting, and they seem to be saying that they want to work towards some common ground, but given the fact that Mayor Adams really ran on making safety the crux of his campaign, improving safety in the city, I'm not really surprised to see that level of pushback.

It's really interesting when you look at Alvin Bragg and Eric Adams. They have a lot of similarities in a lot of ways, both Black men who had negative interactions with the police when they were young men, and who both went into law enforcement to try to make change. In spite of their differences on this issue, they do agree that there needs to be a more holistic approach to criminal justice. The question is, as a prosecutor, Alvin has a lot of discretion in how people are charged, and Mayor Adams has made safety his number one promise. They're not seeing eye to eye on that issue yet. I'm not sure ultimately how that will work out between them.

Brian Lehrer: Bragg was here on Monday and said for one thing, that he thought there was a misunderstanding, perhaps on the part of the police commissioner, certainly on the part of a lot of members of the public, about what he's actually doing. He sought on this show to explain that he does not intend to keep dangerous people on the streets, just to let more of the non-dangerous ones not get locked up. For example, here he is, on Monday, on the issue of when he would not prosecute or really when he would prosecute resisting arrest.

Alvin Bragg: A high school friend reached out to me and said, "If someone punches a police officer, is that okay?" The answer is, "Of course not." Of course, that's not okay. I've prosecuted those cases, I've prosecuted people who have punched law enforcement. That's not okay, and of course it's not okay, and I've never said it was okay on the campaign. "Of course not," is my response to that.

Brian Lehrer: He was trying to make a distinction, and Katie, maybe this is too subtle for a lot of people to get, who only casually follow the news, that he's talking only about not prosecuting what he considers non-violent resisting arrest, and only in cases where there's no underlying crime that the person is having an interaction with a police officer for. Do you think that's being misunderstood even by the commissioner?

Katie Honan: Yes, and I guess his memo was not meant to be leaked, but that's, I guess, the nature of the news forever.

Brian Lehrer: Is there a public decision?

Katie Honan: Yes, right. I think there was that initial confusion, and it seemed to have become a messaging and a communications issue. If someone has to do a lot of backtracking in his first few days as DA over a memo, I think that is a communications issue. I know that he spoke with the police commissioner over-- The Post reported that it was a productive policies chat, so people were confused by it. I think knowing what he ran on, maybe some people who were not supportive of him, they seized on this memo to say, "Look, crime is going to be overrun."

There are people in public seats across the city who would seize on something like that. It could be very complicated, and there's a nuance in terms of what gets prosecuted, what happens, what kind of crimes, what kind of felonies, what kind of misdemeanors. It's a lot for people who did not go to law school to understand, but when the core of your message gets seized by people who might want to say, "Look, this is what he said, this is how we're interpreting it," it's a communications issue.

I think we'll see how things progress there as well, and how he continues to work with the police department on what crimes actually do get prosecuted, and these are some high profile crimes, where I can think of the man who set the Christmas tree on fire outside the Fox News building, that was an example that was used by a lot of media as someone who he was set free the next day, so that was an issue for a lot of people as well.

Brian Lehrer: Another listener tweets, and Katie, I see you have already retweeted this, "I find we've got to live that as the Adams' 'We've got to learn to live with COVID' as justification for Adams insistence on having people work, learn, et cetera in person to be interesting," writes this person. "Part of learning to live with it should be adjusting our lifestyles to it rather than plowing on with pre-pandemic practices." Jeff, do you think he's hearing that kind of thing from inside? Do you think there are robust debates in his emerging cabinet, or are city council members taking this position? Do you think that's a matter of active discussion right now?

Jeff Mays: Well, look, the interesting part here is, as I said earlier, private industry has the freedom to tell their workers you can do hybrid, you can do two days a week. They can adjust their schedules based on the rising and falling of infections, of the Coronavirus infections. The big question here is you have over 300,000 city workers who make up an important part of the city taxpayers and homeowners who feel like they should be granted the same sort of privileges.

There's just a political issue here with the mayor shutting the city down. It's difficult to say, "Hey, let's shut the city down in the wake of this pandemic," when it appears that these infections are going to be happening on a regular basis. He's the boss of these municipal employees. Who knows if they will be able to apply enough pressure to get him to change his mind? I know as I'm on the show with you right now, I have a few friends who work for the city that texted me saying, "We want to be treated better. We feel like the mayor is not taking our positions or difficulty into account, our state into account." It's a difficult situation because the mayor did have good union support that helped him win the election.

Brian Lehrer: By the way, Jeff, on the Alvin Bragg thing, Mayor Adams himself has expressed faith in the DA even after the police commissioner's memo to the NYPD rank and file expressing concern got leaked. Is Adams undermining his own brand new police commissioner or threading that needle somehow?

Jeff Mays: No, I think he's really trying to thread this needle. When Alvin Bragg's memo came out, there's certainly pressure from police unions and the correction union on how these law enforcement issues will be handled, but it's my understanding that Mayor Adams and the District Attorney have been talking since the campaign. They've been having regular conversations, sitting down with each other, that they apparently email regularly, I'm told, to speak to each other.

I don't think that their relationship is false. It's just that this is an extremely difficult issue, especially at a time when we're seeing crime. Certain crimes are going up. There are concerns about safety, but there's also this tremendous push, you have a city council that is very progressive, that is going to be pushing to make change on issues of criminal justice issues, and how we ultimately handle those issues. It's just, it finds him in a difficult position and I think the mayor has to speak up at certain times and Alvin Bragg is going to have to push back at certain times.

Brian Lehrer: Katie, you mentioned the person who set fire to the tree outside the Fox News building. What did DA Bragg do or say about that?

Katie Honan: That was before he took office, but I know that is something that people-- I'm sorry, I didn't mean to, but that is a story that people point to that as an example of larger bail reform issues that then, I guess, spill over into this larger issue. Crimes are not getting prosecuted here in the city, and people are not getting put away. I didn't mean to confuse people, but I know that's what I hear from friends of mine who maybe are a little bit more conservative on policing issues and they see a story like that.

Then a few weeks later, they read about a memo where they're thinking, "Oh, so someone's not going to get prosecuted now for committing a crime," and it perpetuates an idea of lawlessness in the city, at least from people I speak with, that isn't necessarily true, but that is what's happening. I think to have that in your first week in office as a new DA after how many years of the previous DA, I think it seems like a PR problem, whether or not he actually does what he outlined in the memo.

Brian Lehrer: We'll continue in a minute with Jeffery Mays from The Times, Katie Honan from the news organization, THE CITY, and we'll play another clip of Eric Adams on appointing his brother to be the head of his security detail and take up the nepotism question around that right after this.

[music]

Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer at WNYC as we continue to talk about Mayor Adams coming into office in the middle of the Omicron crisis with pretty much no time to ramp up gradually, here on day 13 of his administration, and some of the things that he's done that are making waves or not, with Katie Honan from the news organization, THE CITY, and Jeffery Mays from The New York Times, and you on Twitter @BrianLehrer, and you on the phones, 212-433-WNYC, 433-9692.

Now, let's talk about Adams appointing his brother to run his security detail. Listener tweets, "The appointment of the mayor's brother certainly seems concerning," but that tweeter goes by Devin Nunes' Lawyer, so maybe there's a credibility issue there. Here's another clip of the mayor on that, this time on CNN on Sunday.

Mayor Eric Adams: My brother has a community affairs background, the balance that I need, he understands law enforcement, he was a 20-year retired veteran from the police department, and I need someone that I trust around me during these times for my security, and I trust my brother deeply.

Brian Lehrer: What's the ethical issue, Jeff? Can't the mayor pick who he wants to protect him personally without a big public conversation?

Jeff Mays: Well, under city law, public servants are not supposed to use their positions in any way to gain financial gain for themselves or close associates. That includes siblings. Part of the problem here is that Bernard Adams, who is the mayor's brother, really started working before the administration received any approval from the conflicts of interest board. If they wanted his brother to be in this position, the process would have been them to obtain approval before hiring him to do this job, and that apparently did not happen. They are seeking approval now.

The other question the mayor has not answered is what qualifications does his brother have other than being his brother? He is a former law officer sergeant, he did 20 years in New York Police Department, but the question is, does he have any specific experience in executive protection? What makes him the best choice to do this? There are tons of civil servants in the city, in the police department, certainly, who have handled executive protection for years. I know the mayor has raised concerns about his safety. The problem is he's asked the public to trust the NYPD to keep them safe and it appears if he's saying he only trust his brother, does he not trust the NYPD to keep him safe?

Brian Lehrer: Does he have a labor issue here, Katie, that people in the NYPD who see this appointment from the outside, when, as Jeff says, there are others who have executive security experience and then rising up through the ranks and on that particular track, see themselves being snubbed?

Katie Honan: Yes, and I think it's bigger than a labor issue. It's what Jeff just said, this is an issue of okay, do not trust the rank and file currently within the NYPD who have executive protection training, they've worked their way up, maybe they've worked with other designees who are protected. Why appoint your brother? I think what seems to be the root of it is Eric Adams has noted that he's a very private person. He's noted that there are security risks, and it's why he's been so private.

Maybe this is why he wants his brother protecting him, so the person knowing his every move keeps it literally in the family of wherever he may go. I don't know if that points to the public that there is something that he is trying to not-- or if there's something that he's trying to hide when he's going about the city or wherever he goes, to keep it with his brother.

I think he did not seek permission, I think perhaps he will be looking for forgiveness, and he needs to get that waiver from the conflict of interest board and figuring all that, but it does point to perhaps larger concerns from the public as to there was no one else in the NYPD who was qualified to do this, and that's not the case, and why did you want your brother?

Brian Lehrer: [unintelligible 00:29:58] phone call. Steven in Harlem. You're on WNYC. Hi, Steven. Thanks for calling me today.

Steven: Thank you very much for taking my call, Brian. Appreciate it. How are you?

Brian Lehrer: Good. Go ahead.

Steven: Oh, yes, just a couple of things. I just wanted to reflect back to our last mayor and the reception that the police department gave him. There was basically a police riot. Being a bit of student of history, as they said, it's like maybe this is trying to avert that. We already have a big to-do going on, it seems, behind the scenes and now in front of us. I'm just thinking of it. That's strictly a security issue. It's his brother. He knows his brother is going to take care of him. Simple as that.

Yes, nepotism is alive and well and always will be to a certain extent, but I completely agree with this one and I support the new mayor 100%, because I really think that we got to get the guns back in the drawers at home and not in the people's pockets walking around the city. That's all I have to say right now.

Brian Lehrer: Thank you, Steven. Call us again. Jeff, that was an interesting call in that he supported Adams in doing this thing that is apparently not popular in the NYPD, which is appointing his brother to run his security detail. Then the caller supported the ways that Adams wants to support the NYPD or use the NYPD in the way they want to be used, being more aggressive getting guns off the street.

Jeff Mays: Look, I think the problem here is the mayor needs to just be more explicit. What's going on? Have they gotten serious threats on his life? Is he concerned that he can't trust officers in the NYPD? They have not revealed any of those details to explain why his brother is the only person that could do this job.

I think also that the city has said, my colleagues reported yesterday, that Bernard Adams is not going to receive pension payments for his previous service as a police officer. In order to do that, City Hall will have to show that no one else is qualified to serve in the position. Again, that raises questions of what are the qualifications for him to be in this position? Have there been threats? Is he concerned about the NYPD and white supremacy within the NYPD? I don't think Mayor Adams has been really explicit in explaining that. There're a lot of questions that need to be answered.

Brian Lehrer: Katie Honan continuing to multitask, tweeting already a little summary of Steven from Harlem's call. Katie, on the anarchy, what was there at the Adams quote from Sunday? The rise of anarchy and white supremacists? He seems to be, for one thing, taking the centrist stance there of targeting the threat of political violence both from the right, white supremacists, and from the left, I guess, because that's usually what's referred to when they say anarchists. I don't know. How do you view him throwing that into it as one of the reasons for appointing his brother?

Katie Honan: I don't know if Bernard Adams has any specialty in dealing with these type of specific threats, whether it's domestic terrorists from either side. I do think it's interesting because Mayor Adams has said-- Even his first day on the job, he took the train. I did not ride with him, but I know other reporters said he didn't have any police protection with him and he said, "Look, I want to walk the streets. I want to be a regular New Yorker. I don't want to live in a bubble." He said he met with the police. This is before we heard that he was going to appoint his brother, but he said he met with them so they could figure out how he would be protected.

He didn't want police officers holding doors for him or having just a large protection that we often saw with Mayor de Blasio. Even within City Hall, there would be close to a dozen officers even protecting the front door. As a reporter, there were times they said, "Oh, you can't walk out the door because Mayor de Blasio is coming in." I don't know what they thought I was going to do to him, but that did seem to be a very large protection and Eric Adams said he doesn't want that. I saw today on Twitter he was taking the subway. He walks the streets, but that's what he said.

He, a week ago at least, said, "I don't really need that same level of protection," but then is now pointing to possible threats against him in the office in general as a reason why he's appointing his brother, although not-- As Jeff said, he needs to be explicit. Show us the ways in which your brother, out of all the people in the police department, is an expert in whether it's terrorism on the left or the right, and why he would be so good at that.

Brian Lehrer: That's interesting. They wouldn't let you get close. You look very threatening, Katie. I know, I cross the street whenever I see you walking down the sidewalk toward me. There are a few other controversial appointments. Two, Jeff, you wrote up, another in the policing realm, Philip Banks. Katie, you wrote about a likely pick for economic development czar and controversies surrounding that person. Can we do each of these briefly? Jeff, Philip Banks who was already within the NYPD, now he's going to be deputy mayor.

Jeff Mays: Sure. Mr. Banks retired from the NYPD in 2014 and made a federal corruption investigation, a wide-ranging investigation. Mr. Banks was named and as an unindicted co-conspirator in this investigation about two businessmen who were really seeking to influence the police and public officials. He has been named as deputy mayor of public safety. Adams' administration say his role is going to be coordinating all of the agencies in a public safety response. The question is, having been named as an unindicted co-conspirator in this investigation from a few years ago, the investigation resulted in a few convictions as well.

There's just questions about whether this hampers his credibility and his ability to actually do this job. Mr. Banks last week, in something of an unusual move, confirmed in an op-ed in the Daily News that he had been chosen as deputy mayor. That really went against the protocol that mayors used to make these big announcements. They usually are not allowed to announce themselves as having been hired in this position. A lot of people think that was because of the controversy around his appointment.

The question now is, how is Mr. Banks going to be received? How will he work with other law enforcement agencies in doing his job and working with the police commissioner? It's still unclear whether the new police commissioner will have to report to Mr. Banks who then will report to Mr. Adams. The mayor has said the police commissioner will report directly to him. When you have a deputy mayor of public safety, that is another layer of bureaucracy over her. That's where it's at right now.

Brian Lehrer: Katie, briefly on this economic development person.

Katie Honan: Briefly, it was reported last week by-- [unintelligible 00:37:35] had at first that Carlo Scissura, who's currently the CEO of the New York Building Congress, was set to be appointed as the president of the Economic Development Corporation, which is the city's nonprofit economic development arm. I had received through a source a contract that Mr. Scissura had signed with the developer named Tim Ziss that basically laid out a scope of work that appears to be lobbying in regards to five properties in Brooklyn that two of which were later sold back to the city, school construction authority for schools, and an apartment complex in Astoria, Queens.

The City Hall would not comment on it because he's not officially been appointed. Sources of mine also told me that this is likely the pick, or at least it was the pick as of last week and earlier this week. I think it just shows some concern over someone who would engage in this type of, apparent experts told me, unregistered lobbying work. It involved a $6,000 a month fee, a $15,000 retainer. In the case of the apartment building in Astoria, which is under HPD, a $100,000 bonus if he got what this developer wanted, which is also concerning for ethics experts because it's a success fee that is actually in some states illegal.

I don't think the contract was meant to be seen by the public. Once that was reported, I don't know what will happen, and I don't know if Carlo Scissura will still be the EDC president, but I think it points to a pattern. Hopefully, not a long pattern, but it could show some ethics questions over people who are in charge and who are being appointed by Mayor Adams in the administration.

Brian Lehrer: We're almost out of time. Let me do a little callers lightning round here. 30 seconds apiece. Emilio in Brooklyn, you're on WNYC. Give me a good 30 seconds.

Emilio: I just wanted to make a correction or clarification. Earlier, I heard Jeff mention that with regards to the MTA that farebox recovery, that ridership is down as though it's a huge portion of their funding. Actually, I'm looking at the funding farebox recovery right now from 2020. It was a total of 17%, and that's actually high. I'm an urban planner and this is a misconception nationwide that they use the idea that people skipping fares is actually going to make a difference when there's not a single transit authority in the country that recovers more than 20% of their funding.

Brian Lehrer: All right. Emilio, thank you very much. I guess that also plays into Adam saying people need to come back to the subway to keep the subway funding secure, but 17% is not nothing. All right. Michelle in Middletown, New Jersey, 30 seconds. Hi, Michelle.

Michelle: Hi. I was just wondering, with de Blasio in office, he had given the Thrive program to his wife, Chirlane McCray, who managed to somehow lose $900 million. She was not qualified to do what she was asked to do. It sounds like Mayor Adams is already putting inept people in positions. I'm just wondering, why doesn't he actually take a look back and investigate the $900 million missing Thrive money?

Brian Lehrer: Michelle, thank you very much. We will fact-check that number in a second, but one more in this lightning round. Sherry in Long Island City. Sherry, we've got 30 seconds for you. Hello.

Sherry: Hello, 30 seconds. One of the people on Eric Adams' transition team is involved in ownership or management of the building in the Bronx that burned.

Brian Lehrer: Yes. His name I think is Gropper. Katie, do you know anything about him and how close Eric Adams is tied to that person? There's now a lawsuit against the landlords and against the city for allegedly being neglectful with knowledge of fire doors that wouldn't close.

Katie Honan: Yes. That's Rick Gropper, he's the co-founder of Canberra, which is the one of the owners of the building. I will say there was hundreds of people on Eric Adams' transition team. I think even that housing portion that he was on probably had if not a few dozen, they had a lot of people. I do not know if Rick is personally close with Eric Adams. I know the investigation at this point, the FDNY has not found the cause of the fire and then the continued spread.

I know that there was an issue with the door that was supposed to automatically close. At this point, I think obviously, people are making a good connection to the fact that he was on the transition team, but I will point out that there were a lot of people. To my knowledge, he is not personally friends with Eric Adams or personally close to him. As the investigation continues, we could see if they have any negligence on their end. That is true that he was on the transition team, but a lot of people were.

Brian Lehrer: Jeff, did the Bill de Blasio-Chirlane McCray Thrive mental health program lose $900 million?

Jeff Mays: I don't know if that's accurate. I know there were some concerns that the program was not able to show its effect in terms of the results in dealing with mentally ill people. There were concerns about whether it had the right focus. Chirlane McCray was not paid for that position. I also want to just quickly point out that Mr. Banks really denied any wrongdoing in his op-ed, and far from--

Brian Lehrer: He was never criminally charged, right?

Jeff Mays: He was never charged, even though evidence did show that he did accept gifts. Far from being inept, many people I've spoken to who know him, including Jumaane Williams, a public advocate who's been a leading voice on police reform, really feel that he understands what needs to happen in terms of public safety in Whiting and the idea of public safety and that police aren't necessarily the sole source of public safety. The question is regards to his ethics issues, not necessarily his skill as a police officer.

Brian Lehrer: Well, they do whole evaluations of presidents after 100 days, [chuckles] Joe Biden's first 100 days. Eric Adams' first 13 days have been 100 days packed into less than two weeks. We thank Katie Honan from the nonprofit news organization, THE CITY, and Jeffery Mays from The New York Times. Thank you both very much. Great job. Thank you.

Katie Honan: Thank you.

Jeff Mays: Thanks for having me.

Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer at WNYC. Much more to come.

 

Copyright © 2022 New York Public Radio. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use at www.wnyc.org for further information.

New York Public Radio transcripts are created on a rush deadline, often by contractors. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of New York Public Radio’s programming is the audio record.