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Brian Lehrer: We thank Rap Battle winner Michael Hill as always. Now that we've had our Poetry Month fun and gotten this weekend's disappointing weather forecast, we'll extend the news block by just a few minutes for the breaking news that New York State's legislature and Governor Hochul have finally reached a budget agreement four weeks into the new fiscal year. There is bail reform news, MTA news, taxation news, charter schools news here, maybe illegal cannabis shop crackdown news relevant to our previous segment, and more. Our Albany reporter Jon Campbell is back with us for a few bullet points. Hey, again, Jon, it was just earlier this week that you came on and said, "They're not there yet."

Jon Campbell: Indeed. Now they're pretty much there, but maybe not totally there. We have a "conceptual agreement" between Governor Hochul and the legislative leaders.

Brian Lehrer: I know it's going to take till early next week for all the votes to get done, but I see some specifics are coming out, and I'm interested for this short conversation mostly in the MTA. We know about the fiscal crisis, the new taxes that were proposed, and ideas like free buses. What got in?

Jon Campbell: Well, free buses got in for one. There's going to be a two-year pilot program where one bus route in each borough. It's going to be free. It's going to be the up to the MTA to decide which route in each borough. We don't know that yet, but that is going to be part of this broader bailout plan for the MTA. The MTA has struggled to regain ridership to pre-pandemic levels, and that has been a hit to their bottom line.

The state's going to kick in money. The city is going to be expected to kick in $165 million a year for paratransit services, and they're going to increase the payroll mobility tax. That's a tax on employers for each employee they have in the MTA region. They're going to increase that only in New York City though for the largest employers, not in the rest of the region, which really pushed back pretty hard against it.

Brian Lehrer: Let me follow up on a couple of those points. First on one free bus line per borough. Where I grew up in Queens, one of my buses that came couple blocks from where I lived as a kid was the Q31. For people who don't know, that gives people an indication of just how many bus lines there are per borough. How are they going to choose one?

Jon Campbell: That really remains to be seen. The governor yesterday, she had a big press conference where she laid out a lot of what's in this conceptual agreement. We don't have the actual language yet. We don't have the bill language, and that's really when things get finalized and when we learn. She did say, the governor did say that it will be up to the MTA that the state didn't make decisions on this, that the lawmakers didn't make the decisions in terms of what line in each borough will be free for two years. That's up to the MTA, and that's going to be a tough decision. There's politically fraught, and everybody's going to be pushing for this line or that line, so have fun with that MTA.

Brian Lehrer: If I remember correctly, my grandma used to take the Q44 from the Bronx where she lived to come and see us. On the taxation piece that you mentioned, is this another indication of suburban power in the state legislature? When you came on earlier in the week, it was mostly to talk about how Governor Hochul's plan to require more housing development in the suburbs got killed in this budget deal because the suburbs resisted so much. Here the tax that's supposed to help the MTA afford itself was going to be throughout the whole MTA region, as you said. That includes the commuter lines as well as the city's buses and subways, but now it's only going to be at payroll tax hike in the city.

Jon Campbell: Yes. Only in the city, and only the largest employers. We haven't gotten exactly what would qualify as largest employers, but as it is now, it would be people with the payroll of over $470,000. That's how it's structured now. This is another example of the suburbs really flexing their muscle. They have considerable muscle in Albany. It comes at a time when Kathy Hochul performed poorly last year in the suburbs, especially on Long Island, where she was defeated by Lee Zeldin but still was able to overcome that.

The suburbs are a powerful force in Albany. Their elected officials both at the local level and the state level are quite loud and aren't afraid to flex their muscles and make their voices heard. This is yet another example of it.

Brian Lehrer: Bail reform. Judges will have more discretion to hold defendants behind bars until trial, or at least require bail from them. We'll talk about that in some detail on Monday's show with Jumaane Williams. Climate, Jon, I don't know if anything has emerged yet because I know only some of the topics details are coming out. We do a climate story of the week on the show. We've done many on New York State climate policy and some of the things that were in play but not expected to get through or expected to get through in the budget. Any details on climate stuff yet?

Jon Campbell: Yes, one thing that came up last night at the press conference, which was kind of hastily called for 7:30 PM, but one thing that did come up is all electric buildings. We've heard a lot of debate about gas stoves and gas hookups. This is going to apply to new construction, new buildings built after 2026 and 2029, depending on their size, will not be allowed to have gas, fossil fuel hookups in those homes. It will not apply to existing gas stoves, gas lines, but this is for new construction. There's going to be some other climate issues and measures in the budget. We don't have the details on those yet.

Brian Lehrer: One more topic. Cannabis recreational adult use shops, the legal ones still getting all this competition from so many illegal smoke shops in New York more than in New Jersey. We heard in our last segment. There was going to be perhaps some kind of illegal cannabis store crackdown in this budget agreement. Do we know that yet?

Jon Campbell: Yes. Again, we don't have the details. We don't have the actual budget bills yet, and that is when we'll really find out what's going on here. The governor last night said, yes, that will be part of the final budget agreement, and it will allow the Department of Taxation and Finance to essentially step in and shut down these businesses if they are illicit, if they are unregistered marijuana shops. That is something that since that New York legalized marijuana, we've seen these sprout up, and the way the law was written, it was difficult for state and city regulators to step in and shut these down. They're making an effort to make it easier for both the Department of Taxation and the Office of Cannabis Management to shut these businesses down.

Brian Lehrer: If this is going to be up to the state, does that let the NYPD off the hook? It's going to be, I don't know, state troopers or somebody invading these stores in Williamsburg and the Upper West Side and everywhere else?

Jon Campbell: I don't know about state troopers, but certainly the State Office of Taxation and Finance has regulators that can step in for tax fraud charges essentially. Again, we don't have the details, and I know that's very annoying to hear. That's such as the state of the current budget agreement. We'll find out more when we have those.

Brian Lehrer: We'll know more next week, and we'll certainly follow up. Before you go, I just can't stop thinking about this one free bus line per borough experiment. What's the long-term vision? Is it that buses in New York City perhaps are headed for being free overall? If so, what's the social goal there?

Jon Campbell: This was really driven by two Queens' lawmakers, in particular, Mike Gianaris. He's the Deputy Senate Majority Leader, and Zohran Mamdani, who's a state assembly member. They had Save-the-MTA plan. A big part of that was they want to move toward free buses, as we've seen in some other cities across the state. There was a lot of negotiation about that and what that might look like. This is where they landed, a pilot program for two years to try to see if it works, if they can make it fit, if the state can afford it, if the MTA can afford it, and what that might look like. It's pretty limited. One line in each borough, but it's meant to be a harbinger of things to come. It's meant to be, let's see how this goes, to see if we can expand it later.

Brian Lehrer: All right. I want the BX-7, but that's another show. Jon Campbell, our Albany correspondent, thanks for staying on it. Thanks for coming on.

Jon Campbell: Thanks for having me.

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