Brian Lehrer: Now listeners, I'm curious if anyone out there right now is undecided about your presidential vote in any way. Because if nobody's undecided, there's no point to having these conventions, or the debates or anything else, right? Let's just hold the election now. We're going to save some lines right now for the next few minutes, for anyone listening, who is undecided about your vote in any way. 646-435-7280, 646-435-7280. Who or what are you undecided about here on August 18th? I could think of a few different versions of undecided. You can be undecided between Trump and Biden. Anyone listening right now undecided between Trump and Biden? 646-435-7280.

Some people say there's nobody like that. If there's anybody like that, we would love to hear from you at 646-435-7280. The rhetoric of both sides does seem to indicate they believe there is a fight underway for votes, especially in the suburbs. In fact, I'll play one more Trump clip from yesterday to make this point when I hear clearly, racial appeals presented as code or even not as code sometimes. I'm going to call them out. This is one of those clips, but it also indicates that Trump thinks certain voters might be undecided between him and Biden. Here goes from yesterday's speech in Wisconsin, as Trump leans into his argument that Biden and Harris are a threat to certain voters in this specific way.

Trump: They also want to abolish the suburbs by allowing far-left Washington bureaucrats to force the construction of low-income housing projects in every neighborhood in America. That's what they want to do. That's their goal. We're going to let you preserve your American dream in the suburbs. Okay? We ended the program. We ended the program.

Brian: He's saying, Biden and Harris, want to abolish the suburbs. He used that phrase. And how? Because of a federal Low Income Housing Program, that's for suburban communities. It's a segregationist message without the word segregation, I think we have to say it to be honest. But politically, it's an example of the campaign going for a suburban turnout, or maybe a kind of undecided suburban voter who Trump hopes will be triggered by things like that. Listeners, who is undecided in the suburbs right now? 646-435-7280, 646-435-7280.

There's another way to be undecided, and that's between voting for either of the major candidates versus a third-party candidate or just abstaining because you don't like either of them. Is anyone listening right now undecided in one of those two ways? 646-435-7280. What will make up your mind? Both of those hurt Clinton in 2016. As you probably know. Lower Democratic turnout. Of course, we heard Michelle Obama in the last clip trying to counter the low turnout, but also the Green Party candidate Jill Stein got enough votes to have made the difference in some states like Ralph Nader in Florida in the year 2000, if we can assume the large majority of Jill Stein voters would have gone to Hillary Clinton. Who's undecided? Maybe nobody will call, but let's see. If you're undecided in any way these conventions are mostly for you, 646-435-7280, 646-435-7280. We'll see who's on the line if anyone, right after this.

[music]

Brian: Brian Lehrer, WNYC. Okay, who's undecided between Biden and Trump or between neither of them and a third-party candidate or abstention. Michael in Brightwaters on Long Island, you're on WNYC. Hi, Michael. Thanks for calling in.

Michael: Hi, Brian, huge fan of your show. I listen to you every day.

Brian: Thank you.

Michael: I am undecided. I think I actually am in that category of suburban New Yorker who's undecided between Joe Biden and Donald Trump. I love Joe Biden's vice presidential pick of Kamala Harris, but I was a big Cory Booker fan, I was a big Bernie Sanders fan. I think economically Trump might be the better option. I think in terms of the economy at large and where it's going in the future.

Brian: If you think Trump might be the better economically, how does that fit with you having been a Bernie Sanders fan?

Michael: I liked Bernie Sanders. Also, professionally, my jobs have changed because I worked in the arts industry during the beginning part of the Trump presidency and now I work in law enforcement. It was a total turn to change [crosstalk] of directions. Socially, I loved Bernie Sanders in terms of equality, what he was going to do socially for America as a culture. He was great. Because employment was so scarce toward the end of the economy at the end of the Bush years and even during Obama's presidency, I was really looking more toward Bernie Sanders in terms of getting back on my feet economically.

Brian: Really interesting. Michael, I'm going to leave it there. Do call us again. All right. Here's the missing link between the ultimate socialist and the ultimate capitalist. At least, not the ultimate but the socialist and the capitalist in today's mainstream limelight anyway, but there's an undecided voter. Deshaun in Lodi, you're on WNYC. Hi, Deshaun. Thanks for calling in.

Deshaun: Hi. Brian, I wanted to call in today. First of all, just want to thank you for having me on. I wanted to call in today to talk to you a little bit about people who I know. I don't want to name anybody particularly but people I know who are basically undecided at this point. I can talk to them about-- go back and forth about ideas and stuff. One of the things that I just can't talk them away from and I swing this way too is because there's no tough position on China on the Democratic side that I have come across. Trump has been all about being tough on China. That is going to be more and more important going forward.

Brian: What is it about China, in particular, that gets to you as it being a centerpiece of your decisionmaking or that of people you know?

Deshaun: Personally, I'll basically tell you that it's very difficult to find things that are not produced in China, right? Ideally, I would like to support local economy as much as possible, but it's getting more and more increasingly tough to avoid things that are manufactured in China. I really think that we need to start bringing manufacturing back to the United States or at least move it away from China because it gives too much power to any country, let alone a country that's so controlled by its government. You know what I mean?

Brian: I do. Deshaun, I'm going to leave it there. Thank you so much for that. Certainly, it's something that Biden's going to have to answer to if he's going to be as tough on China and as aggressive at trying to bring back the manufacturing of pharmaceuticals, which is at the level of an emergency product obviously, and manufacturing in general. Star in Manhattan. Whoops. Star in Manhattan, you're on WNYC, as I bump into my microphone and knock it halfway across the table. Hi, Star? Thanks for calling.

Star: Hi. Hi, good morning. Good morning. I'm just a little bit indecisive, me as a Black female, in reference to deciding on Trump or Biden. Just looking back at Biden's political career, for me, I feel like he hasn't really done anything outstanding that would gain my vote or whatnot. Then, in addition to that, I know a lot of people do speak about Trump and not having the right, public speaking tendencies, but I find Biden doesn't either. It was like a, "What do you do," kind of thing. He doesn't really come off the greatest apple in the bunch either, Biden.

Brian: You said speaking as a Black female, what about Trump's focus on white grievance and defending the Confederate statues and all that stuff. Why doesn't that make it a no brainer for you?

Star: Honestly, there has been things that Trump has done that I've personally seen on USA political stuff scale in reference to him doing a peace treaty with the Islamic countries, it's happened a few days ago. He is also siding with the NYPD. I live in New York and they're being endorsed by Trump. There's a few things that he's doing, maybe not particularly for Black people, but he's doing something. But in reference to Biden, I haven't really seen anything big for his political run which he has done.

Brian: Star, thank you very much. Call us back and let us know how your decision-making process goes this fall. We'd love to hear from you. I think we have another undecided voter, Chris in Manhattan. Chris, you're on WNYC, hello?

Chris: Hey, Brian. How's the going buddy?

Brian: All right. Undecided between Trump and Biden?

Chris: Pretty much, and having lived half my life in Burlington, Vermont, and being a fan of Bernie Sanders and all the rest, I don't understand the anger principle of where the convention was taken off last night. I have a feeling they're playing into Trump's hands right now with too much anger and not enough-- "Ignore the bully in the playground. Move on," is my playbook. We'll see what happens between now and Friday, but after last night I was just like, "Wait, this is exactly what let them win last time." I'm a Democrat, but I'm thinking, "Geez, we don't need this. Let's move on." That's what I got to say.

Brian: If that turns you off, alienates you from the Democratic side, what tends to alienate you from the Republican side and keeps you undecided?

Chris: From the Republican side, this is my prediction, is that, either at the end of this week or next week, Trump will announce his cure for the pandemic virus. This is just me saying it. I think they're just holding that in their back pocket right now so we're going to do--

Brian: What you mean, there is something other than hydroxychloroquine I presume?

Chris: Of course. I'm not that foolish, but yes, it's going to be the, "It's in development now through a Swiss Corporation." I don't want to get into it, but I think they're holding it in their back pocket right now. I think the Democrats have to stay less angry, more focused on solutions, and then move away and ignore the dude.

Brian: Chris, thank you very much. Keep us posted on your decision-making process. We have time for one more. Jacob in West Hempstead. You're on WNYC. Hi, Jacob?

Jacob: Hey, good morning. I'm an undecided voter. I don't like Trump at all. I don't like the way he speaks. I don't like how he handled COVID. I haven't really liked Joe Biden. I think he's pretty middle of the road and pretty moderate. What makes me nervous is, I'm nervous about the left-wing tilt of their Democratic Party, and I don't think that Joe Biden can keep the party the centered old school Democratic Party. I really don't want change. I don't want vast expansions of the welfare state. I don't want vast expansions of social programs. I think that, by and large, America is a pretty great place and we should basically keep it the way it is. Fighting racism wherever it exists, but not calling everything racist. I'm nervous about the left-wing tilt of the party. I don't know if Joe Biden can keep it down the middle and that makes me a little bit nervous.

Brian: Jacob, thank you very much. Keep us posted. I'm going to sneak in one more because, to my surprise, a lot of people have been calling in as you're all hearing undecided between Trump and Biden. Here's one I think undecided between Biden and skipping a vote. Paige in Brooklyn, you're on WNYC. Do I have that right? Is it Paige?

Paige: Yes. Hi?

Brian: Hi.

Paige: I have a lot to say, but I was really surprised of the amount of people that are undecided between Trump and Biden. I think probably many people are. I feel like a lot of the people were calling in saying that they're basically socially liberal and fiscally conservative, which is saying that the problems are bad, but the causes are good. I just think that I agree with everyone's criticism against Biden. He's the worst possible candidate that they could have selected. He has been in politics forever and his track record is nothing but like a horror show. Similarly, Kamala is also,

just has a really horrible track record and they haven't promised any positive things at all. I disagree with the last caller who said that the party is going too far left. To me, that feels like you're a sociopath.

Brian: Of course, Biden and Harris would argue that they've done many, many progressive things over many, many years in both their cases but are you thinking of not voting because, "Meh, they're not different enough from Trump."?

Paige: Yes, absolutely. I'm thinking that there's no reason-- I feel like at least holding out my vote can send a message to the Democratic Party that they need to listen to their constituents. I think that the people calling in saying they're undecided between Trump and Biden are like such a small part of the faction that they need to be winning over. It's just insane. It's so out of touch with what I'm experiencing on the ground, what everyone I know is experiencing on the ground. They are in a bubble and I don't know how to get through to them. I'm calling my representatives, I'm protesting but why were you presenting me with this old man who's done barely any incremental changes, was horrible to Anita Hill. It was in recently with-- Kamala Harris, has own criticisms of him, like what [unintelligible 00:16:39]?

Brian: Nobody's mentioned any-- At the beginning of the primaries, Anita Hill came on the show and she was like, "Biden? Really? There are 23 Democrats in this race. Really? Joe Biden?" But nobody's talking about that anymore.

Paige: I know. Even Obama held out his endorsement to the last minute [crosstalk] by Obama--

Brian: Speaking of the last minute, I got to go.

Paige: Okay. Thank you.

Brian: But Paige, keep us posted, call us again, tell us if you ultimately are going to vote. Listeners, very interesting call-in, right? Those undecideds between the two candidates, Paige represents another group of people undecided between whether the Biden-Harris ticket is worth it. There are groups of people out there.

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