[music]

Brian Lehrer: It's The Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. Good morning, everyone. On today's show, we'll have the Russian-American journalist and Russia-US Relations Expert Julia Ioffe from Puck News. We'll get her take on all this theater about Russia's war in Ukraine and what's real here. That's why I call it theater. It's unknown what's real here and who's just posturing for whom at this point. She also writes about the Middle East, though. We'll also talk about her article called The Coming MAGA Israel Battle. You may be surprised who on the right has apparently had about enough of Netanyahu in general and war in Gaza and Jewish settler violence in the West Bank in particular.

Also, today, our Health and Climate Tuesday section of the show will be about turf versus grass, why artificial turf is replacing grass on so many playing fields in the United States, and what the health and climate implications might be. We'll take your calls at the end of the show on how much you use arts and entertainment reviews. Some publications are cutting back on reviews, The New York Times, Vanity Fair. Are they less necessary or just being paid less attention to in the social media era? We'll invite how you use reviews or decide what arts and entertainment to spend your time or money on.

We'll start today checking in on the New Jersey governor's race. It's considered a competitive race according to the experts and according to the polls between Democratic Congresswoman Mikie Sherrill and Republican former state legislator and the 2021 Republican nominee, Jack Ciattarelli. I'll spare you the poll numbers on the race because they're so changeable and often so unreliable, but I'll give you one descriptive finding. A Fairleigh Dickinson University poll released in late July found that, "Asking questions about local issues increased support for Ciattarelli among independent voters. Similarly, asking questions about national issues decreased Ciattarelli's support among independents."

This suggests something about how New Jersey independents feel about Donald Trump, more or less, and therefore, you can guess how each is campaigning. We'll talk in this segment about immigration as an issue, abortion rights as an issue, and the state of the race generally. Our guest is Opinion Columnist Charles Stile from NorthJersey.com, also known sometimes as the Bergen Record. Charlie's latest column is called Ciattarelli Breaks With President on Immigration but in a Trumpian Way. Charlie, thanks for coming on. Welcome back to WNYC.

Charles Stile: Good morning.

Brian Lehrer: What do you mean Ciattarelli broke with Trump on immigration, but in a Trumpian way?

Charles Stile: Well, he definitely opposed his policy on opening up Fort Dix, the joint air base down in South Jersey, as a detention center for detainees, people who are being deported. Also getting less attention was his opposition to closing the Picatinny Arsenal out in Morris County, but it was the Fort Dix one that drew the most attention. He did it, but he didn't criticize the president. He actually heaped blame on the Democrats for causing the environment by which we need to deport immigrants.

In other words, it wasn't Trump's fault. It wasn't this national dragnet led by ICE, now beefed up by $100 million money from the Big Beautiful Bill, whatever it's called. It was really the Democrats for open borders. It was a very Trumpian deflection tactic move. He did it in a way so he really tamped down the criticism and any potential blowback he might get from the MAGA base, which he really desperately needs if he's going to win this thing.

Brian Lehrer: Interesting, by the way, that you just called it Fort Dix rather than its full current name, Joint Base McGuire–Dix–Lakehurst.

Charles Stile: I know.

Brian Lehrer: It was Fort Dix back when my father served there, protecting New Jersey from the Soviet Union.

Charles Stile: Same thing.

Brian Lehrer: Joint Base McGuire–Dix–Lakehurst, that's what we call it now.

Charles Stile: It's a mouthful.

Brian Lehrer: What's the Trump administration proposal for the joint base that Ciattarelli rejected?

Charles Stile: It's been a little vague, but I think it was up to about 1100-2000 detainees that were going to be basically processed there as a holding station on their way out of the country. I think the ambition was once they really ramp up and start filling places like Delaney Hall and Elizabeth Detention Center nearby, on a regular basis, they were going to face an overflow. They were looking around for additional spaces. They were looking at other military facilities around the country. It was really like a transfer station. The problem with that is that that area is represented by a lot of Republicans who protested the idea of that happening. I think that was also weighing on the Citorelli campaign.

Brian Lehrer: This is Burlington County, a relatively Republican part of the state. They didn't want an immigration detention center or holding facility there.

Charles Stile: Yes, I think the concern was escapes. It was a classic New Jersey NIMBY move. Yes, we're all for detainees, we're all for the deportation dragnet, but just keep it out of our backyard.

Brian Lehrer: They could put in some moats with alligators, couldn't they?

Charles Stile: Well, we have them in Florida, but I know. It is interesting because, if you've ever driven to Fort Dix, it's a long, empty ride off US 206 out of Bordentown. There's a lot of land back there, but there are also a lot of farms and a lot of Republican farmers.

Brian Lehrer: By the way, you fact-check in that article the notion that past Democratic administrations set the stage for this. In a way, isn't that fair? Certainly, the Democrats let more immigrants, including undocumented immigrants, into the country than Trump is allowing, and so, to what you call Ciattarelli's Trumpian way of opposing Trump.

Charles Stile: I think it's fair in a more global sense. The reality on the ground right now is that we would not be in this position if we did not have this extraordinary extremist reaction to the immigration crisis of uprooting potentially millions of families, some of them who've been long settled in the United States and in New Jersey, who have been contributing to our economy, have sent their children who are born here, in many cases, raised and groomed here, and just threatening them, and in a lot of cases, just uprooting them. Just showing up at their work site and disappearing them. That's on Trump, not on the border crisis there.

Brian Lehrer: There's a stat that I saw come out of New York that a majority of the immigrants detained, when they went to their court proceedings, their regular immigration proceedings that they showed up for and then got detained by ICE, a majority of those people had no criminal records.

Charles Stile: Correct.

Brian Lehrer: Do you know if the same is true in Jersey?

Charles Stile: I don't know if we've done that analysis yet, but I know a lot of the work that has been done in New York region and elsewhere is that the number of people who have been undocumented and without criminal conviction, who have been detained, have outpaced the number of people who have criminal convictions. That number continues to grow. That disparity continues to grow. It really shows you that in the eyes of the Trump administration, all undocumented, all unauthorized immigrants are illegal and have to go, regardless of their criminal status or whether they've even had a traffic ticket. You're out of here.

Brian Lehrer: NorthJersey.com columnist Charles Stile is with us as we talk about the New Jersey governor's race. We're going to get into the larger state of the race after we finish this thread on immigration. We're going to talk about abortion rights as an issue in the race. Listeners, we invite you and your comments and questions on the New Jersey Governor's race. Welcome at 212-433-WNYC. Just tell us what's the most important issue or difference between the candidates for you, or if you're undecided, what are you waiting to see? 212-433-WNYC, call or text for Charlie Stile. 212-433-9692.

Let me play a clip from Ciattarelli first on immigration. This goes back to during the primary campaign in May, but I think he would say the same thing today. You'll tell me. Candidate Jack Ciattarelli on Newsmax, May 17.

Jack Ciattarelli: Every elected official in this country should be working in partnership with the president. I will, as governor, to keep our country safe, secure the border. When I'm governor, we'll go in a step further. There'll be no sanctuary cities, nor will we be a sanctuary state in New Jersey.

Brian Lehrer: Can you describe the difference before we play a Sherrill clip between Ciattarelli and Sherrill, specifically on that sanctuary cities or sanctuary state status?

Charles Stile: Well, Ciattarelli has made it clear that he would end what is known as the Immigration Trust Directive, which was established in 2018. The attorney general gave guidance to local police departments and the state police on how they should cooperate with federal immigration agents. It really, I would say, severely restricted their participation in those raids.

There was a policy rationale behind that which I'm not going to go into and bore you with, but Ciattarelli has said that from the get-go, and it's been a good sound bite. He has also said that he would take the handcuffs off local police. Now, he's been very vague about exactly what that means. Does that mean he would allow ICE and the federal agents to deputize local police and go after undocumented in their communities and be their eyes and ears, or would it just only involve people who have a detainer or in order to hold a person because of their criminal activity or potential criminal activity?

He's kept that vague and I think partly to not seem too Trumpy and extreme as he heads out onto the campaign trail and my understanding with Sherrill she has supported the directive, but has opposed turning that directive into a state statute, into state law, which a lot of people on the left, the progressives, have been pushing for. Sherrill's position is if you open that can of worms and try to turn it into law, then the whole thing gets bogged down into a legal battle, and there's a potential that the whole directive could get thrown out on constitutional grounds. That's basically their difference on that.

Brian Lehrer: Now, here's a clip of Sherrill. This also goes back to just before the primary, the Democratic primary in her case, of course. Again, I think it's still representative. Sherrill on the CBS News show, The Takeout, on plans she says that Ciattarelli would have to DOGE New Jersey.

Mikie Sherrill: One of the reasons I'm running for governor is because Jack Ciattarelli, the Republican, has said he's going to DOGE New Jersey. Said he's not going to stand against Trump in any way. He is actually going to not take any executive order on whatsoever, which is pretty shocking that you would see that abdication of leadership.

Brian Lehrer: Is that representative, Charlie, of how Sherrill is trying to run on national issues, consistent with that finding from Fairleigh Dickinson that that seems to advantage her?

Charles Stile: Absolutely, 100%. It's the thrust of her campaign. As you pointed out at the beginning, those poll numbers suggest a heavy Trump drag potentially on Ciattarelli. She is really going to pound that, especially after Labor Day, as this campaign really hits full steam. I think it's fair game. I would say, though, that knowing Jack Ciattarelli and his history, he is not a Elon Musk, DOGE hatchet man. He's not calling for massive dismantling of government. He's a businessman. He's a green eyeshade kind of guy who's in the back room going through line items with a scalpel, looking for the fat. That's my image and my understanding of Ciatarelli, but if he's going to clasp himself to Trump, then he's open to this attack.

Brian Lehrer: Which he's doing more because he thinks it's advantageous for Republican turnout. Would you say that's accurate?

Charles Stile: Yes, it is. I think he definitely sees it that way. I also think they're calculating that he's not as radioactive to moderate Democrats and independents as people think he is.

Oh, Trump. Excuse me.

Brian Lehrer: You mean Trump isn't as radioactive to moderate?

Charles Stile: Correct. Not to the degree that maybe a couple of years ago, and they look over their shoulder to last year's election. The turnout here in New Jersey among Democrats was depressed for a lot of other reasons, but Trump made gains. He made gains in Democratic constituencies. I think the challenge for him is to pivot and to make this race all about New Jersey issues and the Democratic Party's long legacy of management, eight years under Murphy, 20-plus years of Democratic majority rule in the legislature. Everything that's gone wrong in the past decade or more is on the Democratic Party's watch. It's time for change. That's his path to victory. Whether he can cut through the Trump cloud is really something to be seen.

Brian Lehrer: Before we turn to the issue of abortion rights and play a clip of each, is there, let's say, a single issue that you might identify that represents how Ciattarelli is campaigning differently on a local issue in 2025 than he did in 2021 when he lost to Phil Murphy?

Charles Stile: I would say that he's putting more emphasis on the affordability issues in New Jersey, that the Democratic Party has made life for you, average citizen, more expensive. That was a theme last time around, but I think he's pushed it to the point where he's saying it's really gone over the brink.

Brian Lehrer: Well, then let me push that a little. Let me push that one step further, because I was looking at both their websites this morning, and Mikie Sherrill has pages and pages on affordability, specific things that she would do, according to her, to make New Jersey more affordable. Ciattarelli has a shorter, more general affordability section of the campaign. Can you identify an issue or two where their approach to affordability is clearly different in a way that voters can decide, I like this or I like that?

Charles Stile: Well, I would say the issue, for example, is on electricity rates. He's vowing to take a more conventional approach to bolstering our electricity supply. He is neither [crosstalk]--

Brian Lehrer: What is that more conventional approach?

Charles Stile: More reliance on natural gas, for example.

Brian Lehrer: Does she want to restrict it?

Charles Stile: Well, she's been, frankly, a little more vague about this, but I think she's putting more of an emphasis on solar and-

Brian Lehrer: Wind.

Charles Stile: -clean energy alternatives.

Brian Lehrer: Generally.

Charles Stile: He's really basically saying, "Look, under the Democratic Party rule," at which Mikie Sherrill would be an extension, "wants to continue with these well-intentioned, but impractical clean energy solutions, and we need help now." They've basically left New Jersey in a disadvantaged position, exposed to high rates and hikes, which one took effect on June 20th or early June that where rates went up 17% to 20%. He's trying to lay the blame on those hikes on Democratic rule and likening that Sherrill would be an extension.

Brian Lehrer: On green energy making energy more expensive. That's definitely one of the things that I've seen Ciattarelli is campaigning on.

Charles Stile: No question.

Brian Lehrer: Do you have reporting that indicates whether the premise is true? Does the transition to green energy that's been taking place under Biden, generally nationally, and to whatever degree, in New Jersey is actually pushing up energy prices on a month-to-month basis for people's utilities?

Charles Stile: I don't, and I don't think anybody does. It hasn't really been parsed out in any great degree. It's been parsed out based along any analysis has been done through a partisan lens. To really find a neutral analysis as to, for example, how much did Phil Murphy's reliance on offshore wind and the failure of that project put us in this position right now? It's really hard to say. It's a good talking point for Ciattarelli, but no one really has--

Brian Lehrer: You mean because, if that offshore wind was developed, there would be more energy?

Charles Stile: There would be more energy, there's no question, but how much has that really been a major driver to this 17% to 20% increase in June, and potential hikes coming in the future? Hard to say, but I think it has contributed. How much and whether it's a whole multiplicity of issues, like a supply from the grid, et cetera, it's hard to say.

Brian Lehrer: Sorry, I keep following this thread down this rabbit hole because this is an interesting [crosstalk] conversation and I hope the listeners agree, but do you have a take on how much in 2025 climate change, which of course ties into this, how much are you willing to sacrifice short term if the green energy transition is pushing up prices to any degree, even if that's not fully demonstrated? How much are people willing to take that hit if it's a hit for longer-term climate goals based on climate effects in New Jersey, like a lot of flooding that we've certainly seen in the state, I think it's fair to say, more in recent years.

Charles Stile: Frankly, the theme of this campaign both campaigns, is not long-term. It's not long-term viability of the health of New Jersey's environment. That really has not broken through. It's how am I going to reduce your costs now and in the near future? The debate over climate change has really taken more of a backseat and it's not getting the attention that it would have gotten, say, a couple of years ago. This is really about affordability. Your costs are going up, your housing, there's a crisis in the stock and supply of housing in New Jersey. Your electric prices are going up. I'm here to make that better. I'm going to make life more affordable and easier on your pocketbook now and in the near term. That is the overarching meta-theme of both campaigns, frankly.

Brian Lehrer: Tom in Seabright, you're on WNYC with Charlie Stile from NorthJersey.com. Hi, Tom.

Tom: Good morning. Thanks for taking my call. I'm not a Murphy fan. I don't think a lot of people are either. I don't care what the polls say. I think if people were asked what they think of him, it's very low. Honestly, I think there's a reason that Sherrill isn't walking around with Murphy's arm around her. There's so many things that he's done wrong that I think she's going to get saddled with.

Right now, he wants to raise the base flood elevation and flood zones 4 feet. He did that stupid plastic bag ban that just hurt poor people or regular people going shopping. The tax rate is still high. The highest property tax rates in the country, I think. The roads are horrible. What he did with the energy is ridiculous. He tried to blame it on other people. I didn't do it. His BPU approved all these rate changes. Insurance is going off the charts for homeowners' insurance anywhere within 5 feet of the ocean. The roads are horrible.

He tried to get his wife in as senator. He almost did that. If Andy Kim didn't sue that power boss endorsements that used to be the practice in New Jersey, she would have gotten a Democratic nomination, and she probably would have been the senator.

Brian Lehrer: Tom, let me, let me leave it there because you put so much on the table already. To his larger premise, Charlie, is Governor Murphy's record and what the caller says is his unpopularity, a drag on Mikie Sherrill's campaign?

Charles Stile: In some areas, yes. That caller hit on some accurate points and some was just a lot of anti-Murphy grievance, but that apocalyptic scenario he gave of Murphy, I'm not so sure it's shared across the board. His approval ratings have always been in the middle range. He's never been unpopular. He's not leaving the state as unpopular as Chris Christie did eight years ago. He's always flown under the radar. He's in the mid-40s, and I think his approval rating is, I haven't checked lately, but it was close to 50% or just over 50%.

I don't think he's one of these polarizing figures. There are issues, and you can name them, like New Jersey transit, I think he mentioned a couple, that are part of the Murphy legacy that could be problematic for Mikie Sherrill.

Brian Lehrer: We're going to turn to abortion rights as an issue in the New Jersey governor's race with Charles Stile, columnist from NorthJersey.com, right after this. [music] Brian Lehrer on WNYC. We're talking about the New Jersey governor's race, Mikie Sherrill versus Jack Ciattarelli with Charles Stile, opinion columnist for the sometimes known as The Record or even still The Bergen Record, found at Northjersey.com.

Let's turn to the issue of abortion rights. We again have a clip of each. You've also written about this as an issue in the campaign. We'll play the clips first. Now, this is Ciattarelli on New Jersey public television with Steve Adubato when he was running for governor in 2021. Of course, he lost to Phil Murphy, but his position, I think, he'll tell us, is the same today.

Jack Ciattarelli: I've been very clear all throughout my career and life, Steve. I've never advocated for overturning Roe v. Wade. I've always been A-okay with a woman having a right to choose. I believe what we see in Texas is a form of extremism, just as what we see from Phil Murphy is a form of extremism. He continues to advocate for a law that the legislative leaders refuse to post because they know it's a bad law. It's a law that would allow abortion in months seven, eight, and nine, right up to the day of delivery as performed by somebody other than an MD. If that's not extremism, I don't know what is. I do not support the Texas law, but I certainly don't support what Phil Murphy supports. I believe my position on abortion is right where a majority of New Jerseyans is.

Brian Lehrer: Ciattarelli in his last campaign, and you'll notice that he referenced that Texas law and said he doesn't support it. Here's Mikie Sherrill as the Democratic nominee this year. She said this on WBGO on June 26.

Mikie Sherrill: Looking at other states, like say Texas and Florida, where women are dying on the emergency room table having miscarriages because the doctors feel that they are not able to perform emergency abortions, I hope that as people take into account what this actually means in practice, they can be more supportive of my position on this.

Brian Lehrer: Charlie, are abortion rights breaking out as an issue in the governor's race along these 20-week limitation that Ciattarelli wants, or parental notification requirements that Ciattarelli wants, or anything else?

Charles Stile: I think this issue, especially pushed aggressively by Mikie Sherrill, is really less about abortion rights than more as a symbol or a stand-in for Trump extremism. She's using this to remind, particularly moderate voters and women voters who have always been her base out there in Morris and Essex county, that she has stood with them and that Ciattarelli, even though he poses himself as a moderate and he comes from the moderate centrist tradition of New Jersey, is with Team Trump. He's with Team Trump.

If you sign on with Jack Ciattarelli, you run the risk, now, I think it's a very unlikely risk, but a risk that he'll be part of a national campaign that will be played out in the states to roll back abortion rights. I think that's really what you're really seeing here. This has been, for all intents and purposes, a settled issue after the state codified abortion rights a couple of years ago, in 2022. I think that's what's really at play here.

Brian Lehrer: That's what would have to change. If Ciattarelli is elected and tries to push for the things that he says he supports on this, he would have to get the legislature to or maybe he could do some things by executive order. I don't know. You tell me. He is campaigning to make New Jersey's abortion law more restrictive than it is.

Charles Stile: Technically that's correct, but I think he's more in a defensive position where he is being-- I think she's been going on the offensive and aggressively on this issue and he is basically pulling this out or dusting it off his old playbook and falling back on this position, which he sells a rational middle of the road New Jersey centrism, which, in fact, and some might argue that, but for example, some of the restrictions he's calling for, such as parental notification, have long been settled by case law in this state. It's just not going to happen.

Brian Lehrer: Right. The fact that his website says common ground positions on abortion and talks about late-term abortions, but I think public opinion generally follows the argument that there are almost no very late-term abortions. When there are, they're under extremely excruciating circumstances. It's not like some woman pops up at 32 weeks and says, "No, I don't feel like it."

Charles Stile: Exactly. This has really been borne out. This is one of the inherent contradictions of his position, that he allows for what he calls elective abortions after 20 weeks, but-

Brian Lehrer: No elective abortions if-- Yes.

Charles Stile: -only if the health of the baby and the life of the mother is in jeopardy. The reality is most late-term abortions that happen, if they happen at all, are because the mother's life is in jeopardy or the child's life is in jeopardy, or their health has been compromised. It's one of those ongoing issues. By the way, this is the same playbook that Republican House candidates used in 2022. It's almost the same script.

Brian Lehrer: It didn't work, you're saying. Right?

Charles Stile: Yes, it neutralized the issue. It didn't.

Brian Lehrer: I know they took the House majority, but that issue was considered to have favored Democrats. I want to acknowledge some texts that have come in, going back to the previous caller who was citing failures as he saw it, by Murphy on one of the points, and several texts from different people, these different phone numbers, on one of the things that he brought up, which was the plastic bag ban.

Charles Stile: That's okay.

Brian Lehrer: One listener writes, "The plastic bag ban is a raging success and our congresswoman had nothing to do with it." Someone else, "The plastic bag ban is an extremist right-wing talking point. Idiotic. Everyone can afford to buy a bag for $1 that will last them forever, versus one-use throwaway bags." People are putting it that way because the caller said the plastic bag ban disadvantaged only poor people, and that's why it's unpopular. I'm just curious if you have any take on that, because I could keep reading texts. A number of people reacted to that point from that caller.

Charles Stile: It has not been an issue it's at all in this campaign, as far as I can see. It's an ongoing sore point for people on the right. It's one of those flashpoint issues of government overreach. The people on the left and the center-left have not only embraced it, but have gotten used to it. It's just one of those things now that have become part of the firmament of the state, part of how we live. I don't think Ciattarelli is going to spend a lot of political capital running on rolling back the bag ban. I think he's got other fish to fry.

Brian Lehrer: We have just a couple of minutes left. I want you to touch for just a second because you reported on it, their running mates. It's hard enough to get publicity for the top of the ticket candidates right now, considering what's going on in New York, but they do now have running mates. As always, running mates are selected for political appeal on the ticket. Do you want to run down those two, just very briefly?

Charles Stile: Well, sure. Dale Caldwell, respected pillar of the political establishment, Democratic Party establishment, well-regarded in the Black community-

Brian Lehrer: A pastor.

Charles Stile: -and a pastor, I think, is important for Sherrill because, frankly, she needs to boost her standing in the African-American community. She faced a vigorous challenge from Newark Mayor Ras Baraka, who at one point in the campaign came up to the brink of calling her a racist. She didn't carry Essex County, but it wasn't--

Brian Lehrer: Where Newark is.

Charles Stile: Where Newark is, and where she lives, actually, Montclair. That's the Democratic Party homeland right now. One out of every seven Democratic registered voters is in Essex. She's got to win that. She has to excite the African-American community. I think they're working hard to do that. I'm not sure how effective it is yet. We have to really go out and see. Mr. Gannon, the Morris County sheriff, is popular there.

Brian Lehrer: This is Ciattarelli's running mate.

Charles Stile: Ciattarelli's running. Excuse me. I think that was a very smart, strategic move to take a popular sheriff who's popular among voters in both parties in Morris County and drain some significant support, if possible, away from her base out there. In reality, the broader goal of lieutenant governor candidates, we have only a limited experience with it here, is don't do any harm, don't eclipse the boss or the main candidate, go out on the rubber chicken circuit and be a good surrogate, and don't create controversy.

Brian Lehrer: Hopefully call out on the modern-day equivalent of the rubber chicken circuit or what we have in addition to it, which is the social media circuit, which is obviously so important in campaigns these days. Maybe we'll do another segment on how either campaign is approaching that. Although it relates to this last question that I wanted to ask you anyway. This is the last question. This is all taking such a backseat in the media, at least in North Jersey, to the New York City mayoral race, which I don't have to tell you is a five-way battle with four marquee names and making global headlines. Is that mattering to how this race is run, or is it frustrating either candidate?

Charles Stile: The marquee names, meaning Trump.

Brian Lehrer: No, the New York City mayoral race.

Charles Stile: Oh, you mean in New York City race.

Brian Lehrer: Cuomo, Eric Adams.

Charles Stile: I think so.

Brian Lehrer: Sliwa and Mamdani.

Charles Stile: I apologize. No, I think the Mamdani thing, his candidacy has been a bit of a complication for Sherrill, although, I think she gave this soft support endorsement of him and that has given Ciattarelli an opening to associate all the negatives of Mamdani, his positions on Israel, as in an attempt to peel away some moderate Democratic Jewish voters who are concerned on this side of the river about Mamdani. That guilt-by-association approach has its limitations once this campaign gets into the core issues. That way, I think that has a little bit overshadowed. On the rest, the New York race and the Cuomo, no, beyond that, I don't think.

Brian Lehrer: That's interesting, your take on the effects that there may be a Mamdani effect on people's perception of Sherrill, or she gets put on the spot to ask what she thinks of this or that position of Mamdani. I was thinking of also just the sheer magnitude of the coverage of New York and the fact that the New Jersey race may be having a hard time breaking through to people's consciousness unless they're on certain social media feeds.

Charles Stile: Well, I think we'll see that in the next couple of weeks when the advertising war begins. Both candidates are participating in the public financing here in New Jersey. They both have raised roughly the same amount of money, but it's going to be the super PACs and the national parties coming in and bombarding the airwaves. Whether they can elbow away or find any room to advertise in the New York market is going to be a challenge. It's going to be very expensive. That is that's really what it comes down to. How much can they get their message out through broadcast media? Especially in competing with the New York race.

Brian Lehrer: Listeners, some of you know that in many election years, and we're going to do it this year, we do a series on this show called 30 Issues in 30 Days, so that not all the media coverage, at least not here, is going to be about the polls and the attack ads and all of that. We really compare the candidates on the issues. Our 30 Issues in 30 Days series will start September 22nd this year, 30 consecutive shows leading up to the Friday before Election Day. Some will be on the New York City mayoral race. Some will be on the New Jersey gubernatorial race as we serve our metro audience.

As a little bit of preview to that, we thank Charles Stile, columnist for NorthJersey.com, for talking about some of what's been going on in the campaign in Jersey this summer. Thanks for joining us, Charlie.

Charles Stile: You're more than welcome.

Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer and WNYC, Much more to come.

 

Copyright © 2025 New York Public Radio. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use at www.wnyc.org for further information.

New York Public Radio transcripts are created on a rush deadline, often by contractors. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of New York Public Radio’s programming is the audio record.