Title: Swing State Check-in: Nevada [music]

Brian Lehrer: It's the Brian Lehrer show on WNYC. Good morning, everyone. You probably heard in the coverage of the Trump rally at Madison Square Garden last night that before Trump came on, they had a comedian named Tony Hinchcliffe warm up the crowd with some racist and anti-Semitic jokes. We'll get to that. Here are a few things being much less covered that might also be worth knowing. They had the richest man in the world on stage asking for a tax cut. You might have heard of him. His name is Elon Musk.

Elon Musk: At the end of the day, you're being taxed. All government spending is taxation. Whether it's direct taxation or government spending, it either becomes inflation or it's direct taxation. Your money is being wasted, and the Department of Government Efficiency is going to fix that.

[applause]

Elon Musk: We're going to get the government off your back and out of your pocketbook.

Brian Lehrer: And out of your pocketbooks. Elon Musk, the richest man in the world, according to the list that Forbes puts out every year, the richest man in the world advocating for a tax cut at the Trump rally at Madison Square Garden last night. Musk, of course, is an immigrant, and here's how he was introduced by another billionaire, Howard Lutnick, the CEO of the Wall Street firm Cantor Fitzgerald.

Howard Lutnick: Give it up for the greatest capitalist in the history of the United States of America, Elon Musk.

Brian Lehrer: Greatest capitalist in the history of the United States of America by Trump's telling, turns out to be an immigrant. Interesting. After Musk, and just before Trump, came another immigrant. Relevant, maybe that she's another white immigrant, in her case from Slovenia. Her name is Melania Trump. Obviously an immigrant as people who've never heard her speak before could tell from her accent. Many in the crowd may have been surprised that she has one as she called New York City her hometown.

Melania Trump: Hello, Madison Square Garden-

[applause]

Melania Trump: -our hometown, where architectural symbols of strength, courage, and unity create a canvas for the world's undisputed capital of industry.

Brian Lehrer: New York's ultimate virtue there, the world's capital of industry, I guess, referencing back to Elon Musk, but another immigrant at the Trump rally calling New York City her hometown. Interesting. Maybe you missed this over the weekend. You probably know that Trump's former top three military and administrative appointees, at one point they held those jobs have all labeled Trump a fascist recently. Right? Trump's handpicked Defense Secretary, Mark Esper said people should look up the word in the dictionary and ask if he fits the bill. Esper said, "It's hard to say that he doesn't when you kind of look at those terms. He certainly has those inclinations." Then there was General Mark Milley, Trump's handpicked Chairman of the Joint Chief of Staff, of all things. Milley recently called Trump, "fascist to the core. The most dangerous person to this country." Trump's handpicked Joint Chief of Staff, Chairman Mark Milley. Last week, Trump's handpicked chief of staff and Homeland Security Secretary of all things, General John Kelly, you've definitely heard this one, said Trump would govern like, "a fascist for sure." He said when they were in office together, Trump used to praise Hitler, but you know, who thinks he knows better than Trump's top appointees? Mayor Eric Adams. Asked on Saturday if he thinks Trump is a fascist, the mayor of New York said this.

Mayor Eric Adams: My answer is no. I know what Hitler has done, and I know what a fascist regime looks like. I think, as I've called over and over again, that the level of conversation, I think we could all dial down the temperature.

Brian Lehrer: Eric Adams knows better than Milley, or Esper, or Kelly. At Trump's Madison Square Garden rally last night, he thanked the mayor, and claimed that the Adams' corruption indictment is political payback from the Biden administration for criticizing them on immigration, just like him.

Trump: He said that they shouldn't be calling Trump a dictator because it's not true. That's nice.

[applause]

Trump: That was nice. Very nice. We want to thank Mayor Adams for going through a hard time with these people. These are lunatics.

Brian Lehrer: If elected, Trump would have the power to pardon Adams if he's convicted, or if Trump really does govern like a fascist and takes over criminal justice from the judgment of the prosecutors, like the US Attorney in New York, he could cancel the Adams indictment. Maybe. Maybe that's why the nominal Democrat Adams is playing so nice with the MAGA Republican nominee, the Eric Adams-Donald Trump mutual admiration society, or at least their mutual, he's not so bad society has been formed.

In case you were doing other things on this beautiful weather weekend in so many places, we were paying attention to the news, so you didn't have to. Now we continue our Monday Swing State Series with a visit to Nevada. Our guest today is Lucia Starbuck, political reporter at public station KUNR in Reno, and host of their monthly program, Purple Politics Nevada. Lucia, thanks so much for getting up early and coming on with us. Welcome to WNYC.

Lucia Starbuck: Hey, thanks for having me.

Brian Lehrer: If I have my facts right, Nevada only has 6 electoral votes out of the 538 total, and they've gone to the Democrat every presidential election in the 21st century. Why is this considered a hotly contested swing state?

Lucia Starbuck: I promise you it is still very purple, and those six electoral votes matter. I say it's purple because we look at the last election, Nevada reelected its Democratic senator, and kicked out the Democratic governor, and elected a Republican governor. I still call it very purple. I still think it can go either way. It's very split here in Nevada.

Brian Lehrer: Could you give people in the rest of the country some demographic basics, like we hear out here that it's a more heavily Latino state than all or most of the other swing states proportion-wise among the electorate? How much is that the case?

Lucia Starbuck: Yes, you have many Latino voters here. You also have a very large AAPI community, and also many indigenous voters. When we talk about Latino community, there are also many naturalized citizens, so lots of different voting blocs that can really sway an election in either way as well.

Brian Lehrer: We know that Latinos are not a monolith. What's the nationality or origin or heritage mix more or less?

Lucia Starbuck: Many Latinos in Nevada identify as Mexican. That's the biggest breakdown for Latinos here in Nevada. Also, both looking at the president and the parties are both making their pitches to Latinos in Nevada as well.

Brian Lehrer: Yes, and how divided was that population in the 2020 election, to use the most recent example? Was it at all by heritage or background or since you said Mexicans are the predominant group being relatively close to Mexico there, of course, was the Mexican population split between a number that you know?

Lucia Starbuck: I'll have to double-check that. I think typically, swaying pretty blue, but you've heard more and more Latinos saying that they are not feeling very heard by the Democratic Party. Their lives haven't really gotten any better over the last four years. Trump's and the Republican Party's message is starting to resonate with them. I've heard from a couple of voters who say, "I immigrated here the right way and it makes me really upset when other people don't." That's something that I've heard more and more this election.

Brian Lehrer: Listeners, anyone in or from or with any connection to the state of Nevada, help us report this story. What are you seeing as the presidential election dynamics in the state? 212-433-WNYC call or text 212-433-9692 or anyone else with a question or comment for political reporter Lucia Starbuck from public station KUNR in Reno, call or text 212-433-WNYC 212-433-9692.

Staying on the issue of the Latino vote, how does Trump's language based on your reporting, like, immigrants are poisoning our blood, countries like Venezuela are emptying out their prisons and mental institutions and dumping those people here? It was originally in 2015, the first words out of Trump's mouth as a candidate. "Mexico is sending us rapists and drug dealers," and some of them are good people, pa-pa-pa, but we all know that. Or last night, that comedian, Hinchcliffe, at the Trump rally at Madison Square Garden said, "Latinos love to have babies," and then he used a reference to sexual intercourse and said that's what Latinos are doing to our country. Does a large proportion of the Nevada Latino population just shrug those things off, or maybe you were indicating a minute ago they think, or a percentage of them think, well, they're not talking about me, they're talking about other Latinos. What would you say about all that?

Lucia Starbuck: Well, I think a lot of people find those kinds of comments really, really, really offensive, kind of same thing like calling Puerto Rico a floating island of garbage.

Brian Lehrer: That was in that, "comedy routine last night,"

Lucia Starbuck: Yes.

Brian Lehrer: -and saying that Jews wouldn't be good at playing the children's game rock paper scissors because they don't like to throw paper, so that's the Jews are cheap trope, or the Palestinians have the rocks for rock paper scissors, so the Palestinians are inherently violent trope. That was all in there but yes, including Puerto Rico as a floating island of garbage, though not many Puerto Ricans in Nevada. Right?

Lucia Starbuck: [chuckles] Well, these comments either way, I think when I talk to some Latino voters, they're almost like, "How can other Latinos vote for Trump? I can't even imagine." Also, a lot of fears when he promises to round up people, "Are my family members going to get caught up in that, even though they are were born here and they look Latino?" I think a lot of fears, and then also, fears that that will increase a lot of bullying. I've talked to voters where they felt that racism toward Latinos used to be way more out in the open in the past and just feeling that come back again, especially in rural communities. Just an uptick in hate and bullying.

Then I hear from other Latinos who are voting for Trump who say, "He's not actually going to round people up, he's just talking politics." It's weird. You have a lot of the population saying, "I can never imagine voting for Trump and my family members too." That's just totally out there for me, but other Latinos, the message just really resonates. Not resonates, they just think he's talking politics. He's not going to actually do these really crazy out-there things he says he's going to do.

Brian Lehrer: By the way, a listener writes, "Brian, he's a comedian."

Lucia Starbuck: Yes. [chuckles] He doesn't mince his words is what I hear a lot.

Brian Lehrer: Not about Trump, about the comedian last night-

Lucia Starbuck: Oh, sorry. [chuckles]

Brian Lehrer: -so when he makes jokes based on all the hateful tropes about various possible groups, yes, that's okay.

Lucia Starbuck: Then I have been on a Trump rally and he says these things and the crowd just goes wild.

Brian Lehrer: Oh, and when Trump says the things that he says.

Lucia Starbuck: Yes.

Brian Lehrer: Is crime much of an issue in the state?

Lucia Starbuck: I think yes, people do want to feel safe. I think that comes up a lot, wanting to support law enforcement. I think the biggest issues I hear in Nevada are, is the cost of living and they're looking for Harris or Trump to fix that issue. The cost of living comes up again and again and again.

Brian Lehrer: Yes. We're going to get to that and talk about it in a little more detail in a few minutes, and I'm glad you brought it up. Just to finish on the crime thread, is crime committed by recent migrants much of an issue because that's half the Trump campaign at this point?

Lucia Starbuck: Yes, and he brings that up at his rallies and it gets the cheers. There have been some high-profile murders committed by undocumented immigrants in Nevada, but when I hear people talk about immigration, it's more. They blame strained resources, schools, hospitals, infrastructure on immigrants, which I think is just really due to influx of growth in Nevada and the rest not catching up, but more when I talk to voters, they blame immigrants on strained resources.

Brian Lehrer: Lawrence in Brooklyn, you're on WNYC. Hi, Lawrence.

Lawrence: Hey, good morning. I was just struck, you mentioned it actually twice in your program. Has nothing to do with Arizona but by this so-called comedian who spoke-

Brian Lehrer: . Nevada.

Lawrence: Yes, Nevada. I'm sorry. This so-called comedian who spoke is directing his humor if we're going to call that at Puerto Ricans who are, in fact, Americans. They're not immigrants. I think it's fairly clear that what the Republican Party and Trump have disguised as guarding our borders or even as anti-illegal immigrant hostility, once we move that and direct the same ire towards Puerto Ricans who are our fellow Americans, they've just unapologetically said, "Nope, it's just racism about people of Latin heritage."

Brian Lehrer: Thank you, Lawrence. That's an interesting point. Right. Puerto Rico is obviously part of the United States. It's not a state, it's a commonwealth, but those are US citizens in Puerto Rico, and Trump would be in charge as much as the president is in charge of Puerto Rico if he's elected. He's calling Puerto Rico a floating island of garbage, which is, I guess, different somewhat than saying that about another country, which we know he's called other countries as asshole countries. Yes, then that puts it back as the caller points out, interestingly, in the category of race as opposed to immigrant or foreign status.

My guest is Lucia Starbuck, political reporter for KUNR Public Radio in Reno. How much of a gender gap did you have in 2020, if you happen to know those stats, and how much of one is being reported in the polls now?

Lucia Starbuck: Oh, I'm not sure on the gender gap. Let me see.

Brian Lehrer: If you're looking it up, I'll vamp here and give you a minute.

Lucia Starbuck: Sure.

Brian Lehrer: Just to say nationally, there is a bigger pro-Harris gender gap among women than there is a pro-Trump gender gap among men, from what I've read, a few commentators recently have been making the point that there's so much media focus on how well Trump is doing with men compared to Harris. The other side of the equation isn't being discussed as much, which is that Harris is doing even better among women relative to Trump than Trump is doing with men relative to Harris, if you can follow that. We know Trump is trying to win largely by trying to appeal to low-propensity male potential voters. That's what makes them low propensity. Now I come back to you, Lucia. Are you seeing the gender-based appeals on either side or do you have those stats? It's fine, of course, if you don't.

Lucia Starbuck: I think Harris's message is really resonating with women a lot because of the issue of access to reproductive healthcare. You wonder how much is that of that is the campaigns talking about it or voters but it's something that I hear from voters all the time that they see this as a really big issue and that's why they're voting for Harris. I think that message is really appealing to women in Nevada, even though abortion is protected under the state law up to 24 weeks, I believe, but they still see it as a really big issue and really upset that women in other states have lost those rights. I do see that as really a galvanizing issue for Harris and why she's really appealing to women. I also hear that from men in Nevada as well.

Brian Lehrer: Listener writes in a text message. "My sister lives in Nevada. She has three daughters aged 19 to 27. Her middle daughter is a big-time Trump supporter focusing on taxes. She believes Trump will lower her taxes. She cannot explain how she knows that she just heard this. My sister, the mom, is heartbroken over this, given the fact that she is a widow and raised her daughters alone, and they have survived mostly because of Democratic economic policies. My younger niece is Gen X and goes to rallies and is motivated and has motivated my sister, the mom, to support Kamala." Does that kind of family dynamic, it could be any family anywhere, [chuckles] but does it ring true to you as something you're hearing in Nevada?

Lucia Starbuck: Where families, even individual family members are divided on who they'll be voting for?

Brian Lehrer: Yes, and with those issues being stated, tax cuts, and this brings us into the realm of economics, tax cuts as the be-all and end-all of how to help somebody thrive economically versus other, what the listener calls, the listener perceives as Democratic economic policies that have helped this single mom of three daughters survive.

Lucia Starbuck: Yes, I think I do see that a lot in families. Families just say, "Well, we don't even talk politics," so a plus that you guys are at least talking about it. Yes, I think it depends on your individual experience and also a little bit where you get your news. If you are getting those headlines that Trump is going to cut certain taxes, that could be very attractive to you. When he came to Nevada, he promised no taps on tips, overtime or Social Security. That was a big thing. It's interesting. I think that argument is really strong in Las Vegas where it's very service industry heavy. Of course, in northern Nevada we have those industries, but it's a little bit more diverse there, but yes, I do hear and also by generation as well, millennials and Gen Z, they might not really know anything or more Gen Z, Trump is the introduction to politics, so it's hard to what you base the pre-Trump times on. I think age is an interesting thing. Then also where you get your information and what the candidates say ultimately makes it to you.

Brian Lehrer: We're going to continue in a minute with Lucia Starbuck from KUNR Public Radio in Nevada, the latest episode in our Monday Swing state Series. In fact, the final episode in our Monday Swing State Series we'll decide next Monday if we're going to revisit one, that's particularly hot on the day before election day or do some last-day overview. We've been going through all seven swing states. I think, consecutive Mondays, we are in Nevada where we are landing today. We're still inviting your calls. If you have questions for our guest or if you have any connection to Nevada, if you're there right now listening live, if you're from Nevada, if you have any connection to the state, help us report this story. 212-433-WNYC 212-433-9692. We're going to stay on this question of economics as a central issue out there, as I believe it is to so many of the last-minute swing voters. We're going to play a Harris clip to that effect after the Trump clips that we played, so stay with us.

[music]

Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer on WNYC as we continue with our latest and final Monday Swing State profile. It's Nevada with the political reporter Lucia Starbuck from Public Station KUNR in Reno. Okay, listeners, name that billionaire at the Madison Square Garden Trump rally last night. If you can. Listen.

Elon Musk: As you can see-

[applause]

Elon Musk: I'm not just MAGA, I'm dark, gothic MAGA.

Brian Lehrer: Dark gothic MAGA. If you guessed Elon Musk, give yourself 40 billion points as we continue with our segment and with Lucia Starbuck from KUNR in Reno. To get back to economics, we've been covering the economic agenda of the two candidates a lot, especially cost of living questions. We did three Wednesday night specials on cost of healthcare, cost of housing, cost of child and elder care, people with disabilities and your family's care, the care economy, comparing Trump and Harris. We know they're both running on canceling the federal income tax on tips, as you mentioned, Trump said it first, so he probably gets more of the credit in Las Vegas and around there. How much do you think all these other things like abortion rights, and fascism and immigration are background noise to the remaining swing voters as opposed to how are you going to help me as I'm struggling with my personal finances?

Lucia Starbuck: Yes, it's a little bit of both. I hear from voters all over the political spectrum, all ages, everyone saying cost of living and pointing to different things. Gas, groceries, utility bills, housing, healthcare, child care, just everything. When Vance was in town, he said, "Send your gas bill to Harris." I think it really matters to people and they are just like, it's very painful. People just describe living paycheck to paycheck.

There was a couple weeks ago, back-to-back rallies with Minnesota Governor Tim Walz, and former President Trump. I interviewed people online and they said the same exact things that they were either just able to afford a house, now they can't pay for other stuff, or they can't even afford home repairs, and they're really just looking for Harris and Trump to address those things.

I think a couple of Harris's economic points, I've heard from are very, very attractive to voters. Tax credits for first-time homebuyers, trying to tackle price gouging at the grocery stores. That's very attractive to people. It's interesting, I've actually come across a couple of voters when I say, "Are you hurt by the cost of living?" Specifically Democrats, I've heard from people or left-leaning who say, "Yes, maybe I am paying a couple more dollars for my eggs, but democracy is the most important thing to me." I've heard that a couple of times.

I interviewed one voter who had rheumatoid arthritis and was paying a lot in healthcare supplemental plans, but he still said that getting not electing Trump was his biggest thing. I've heard both where people feel, of course, cost of living, but these other issues are still bubbling to their service and they're paying attention to what the candidates are having to say. Democracy being a huge one for people.

Brian Lehrer: Here's a line from Vice President Harris that she's using as what's being reported as her closing argument.

Vice President Harris: Let's imagine it for a moment. It's either Donald Trump in there, stewing over his enemies list, or me-

[applause]

Vice President Harris: -working for you, checking off my to-do list.

Brian Lehrer: You may have just answered this a little bit, Lucia, but do you think the content of Harris's to-do list, as she calls it, is known to the swing voters in Nevada?

Lucia Starbuck: I think people who who politics are kind of their life or they're really are tuned in all the time are paying attention, of course, people who are volunteering for the Democrats, consistently looking at going to the surrogates who come through town, but I don't know for your average voter who's working a full-time job, raising kids, going to school full-time, it's hard. I've actually heard from voters who are still trying to learn a little bit more about Harris. Yes, it's not sure if it's really, really trickling down to people who aren't just cued into politics 24/7.

Brian Lehrer: This may be the same question, but a listener texts, "I recently moved from New York City to the Las Vegas area. I'm registered as an independent and will be voting unequivocally for Harris. Wondering if your guest has a sense of independence in Nevada, how they're leaning?"

Lucia Starbuck: Oh my gosh. Yes, that's the big question too. It's fascinating. There are more registered nonpartisans. In Nevada, you can register as a nonpartisan on your party affiliation than there are both registered Democrats and Republicans. I did a whole episode on the Purple Politics Nevada on this. It really depends. There's a lot of people who are just totally fed up with the two-party system. That also stems a lot from Nevada's closed primaries where you can only vote for the candidates that are in your party, are done with the political parties, are wanting candidates to make their message more in the middle instead of on both of the extremes.

I've talked to a lot of nonpartisans. Some are pretty set about who they're going to be voting for or where their values align. I hear a lot of fiscally conservative, but socially liberal. Also, I think with Trump being such-- I think a lot of nonpartisans, maybe if the race was against Harris and someone who maybe didn't have as much baggage or such a strong message against certain groups of people as Trump, then maybe they would really be looking at the presidential candidates, but I hear a lot of nonpartisans are very turned off by Trump. Also pointing to that, looking for the person who is less extreme.

I think political science experts tend to just shrug off nonpartisans, but I think they could either go both ways and they are really looking for candidates that speak strongly to the issues that they're most interested on. I think that'll come up more when we see our US Senate race. I think a huge group of nonpartisans extremely upset with the two major political parties and are looking for candidates that really speak to them.

Brian Lehrer: Oh, what's going on with your US Senate race?

Lucia Starbuck: Oh, [chuckles] also purple important. Nevada can also help determine which way the US Senate leans after this election. Again, we have our Democratic incumbent, Senator Jacky Rosen, who is running against challenger Republican retired Army Captain Sam Brown. That's also an extremely tight race. Jacky Rosen's been backed by the Culinary Union. She says she has strong union ties, also very pro-access to reproductive healthcare. Then Sam Brown has really tied his campaign to Donald Trump. He's been there almost every time he's been to Nevada, so you have those two also facing off this election.

Brian Lehrer: Interesting. By the way, you bring up the Senate. There's so much talk these days always when we get close to a presidential election, about the Electoral College and whether the Electoral College is good for democracy. The main reason that some people consider it not to be is because the Electoral College, the size of the delegation from each state is all your members of the House of Representatives from the state, which is of course by population size, plus the two senators from the state, which of course are not by population size. What's the population of Nevada, roughly?

Lucia Starbuck: Ooh, I think it's 4 million people, and it was a helpful breakdown in Nevada. A bulk of people live in Las Vegas, which is in the southern point of the state. About half a million people, maybe not even that in Reno-Sparks, where I am. Then the rest is extremely rural.

Brian Lehrer: About 4 million people in the state of Nevada, you're next to California which ahs 40 million people, but each state has the same number of senators and the same amount of power in the United States Senate. Does that ever come up [chuckles] in a way that Nevada has to defend itself as being overrepresented that you've heard?

Lucia Starbuck: [chuckles] Also, I'm sorry, we did not, we haven't hit 4 million. We're closer to 3 million. [chuckles] If you talk to Nevadans, Nevadans have incredible Nevada pride. [laughs] We feel it's very important to us, it's a big deal. You know, you say, oh, we're focusing on swing states. It's like, "Oh, Nevada's in the news. It's super exciting." It's a really strong Nevada pride. Also, a lot of those Nevadans are from California, [chuckles] so coming here to make it have a little bit less expenses. Also maybe their politics, they are Republican and didn't feel super heard in California, but they really do here in Nevada. Outside of Nevada, I'm sure you guys are looking at us, but here in Nevada, it's a huge source of pride. It's very important. We feel like we want to be in the news, in the race. I feel if you talk to Nevadans, it's a big deal and a big source of pride. [chuckles]

Brian Lehrer: On the "no tax on tips" proposal, which you said is popular in Las Vegas because there are so many people who work in the hospitality industry there. Two things. One, am I right that Trump said it first, then Harris embraced it? It's the position of both candidates, but it's more associated in the public's mind there with Trump?

Lucia Starbuck: Oh, definitely, Yes, I think if Trump said it first, it's resonated way more, and that's what people are really tying him with. Like the Harris kind of, they highlight more of their other things on housing and things like that. I do think that people definitely associate it way more with Trump. Again, people are just really looking at ways to make their everyday lives easier, to make their pocketbook hurt a little bit less. I think anything that the candidates are throwing out there, people are really paying attention to. One thing I've heard that people like, they've appreciated that both Harris and Vance have talked about increasing the child tax credit. That's something that people have heard from both parties, but I think "tax on tips" has definitely been tied to Trump.

Brian Lehrer: Listener writes in a text message, "Most people who get tips don't pay federal income tax." Would you say that's true because they're in lower income categories where they don't pay or as the listener says because of a very high standard deduction, so it's not actually relevant to how much tax. Most of the people who are making some of their money from tips, would pay?

Lucia Starbuck: There was a story that came out of Las Vegas talking to service workers. Some were really excited about it. Some said like, "It might not even change how much I'll take home." Also, one thing to note is service workers in Nevada, they are making minimum wage, so they're not-- I know in other states where you're really, really relying on tips, but they are at least having to make minimum wage.

Brian Lehrer: One more call. This is on the Trump rally at Madison Square Garden last night. John in Brooklyn, you're on WNYC. Hi, John.

John: Hey. I'm very confused by the strategy, I guess behind what they were doing last night. As we know, the Latino population and other obviously groups are going to be critical in a close race. You don't set up a rally-

Brian Lehrer: Just for people who didn't hear the beginning of the show, you're referring, I think mostly to that comedian who said these racist anti-Latino things, and that's gotten a lot of coverage. Go ahead, John.

John: Yes, exactly. You don't hold a major event like that without vetting comments and vetting what people are going to say. They had a teleprompter. I'm just very confused if this was a strategic mistake by them in doing this, by platforming these people and attacking potential large voter groups or this was just because now they're walking it back, right. I'm just very confused politically by what they may have been trying to achieve by this.

Brian Lehrer: John, thank you. They are walking it back to the extent that the Trump campaign has put out a statement that the comedian's lines that have become so controversial for the hate that they expressed that he doesn't speak for them, some version of no, he doesn't speak for us or we do not agree with those sentiments. Lucia, I don't know if for you as a political reporter in Nevada you have any analysis of that. I don't know if you've seen a similar thing at rallies there. It could be a two-part dance where they put it out there and they vet a comedian like Tony Hinchcliffe because they know he'll put it out there and that's going to resonate with the base, and then they say, "Well, we don't really believe that," and so they have it both ways or if it was a strategic mistake because they just failed to vet the guy. I don't know if you have a take on that or if you've seen a similar kind of thing in rallies that you've covered in your neck of the woods.

Lucia Starbuck: I'm not a political strategist but to me at least, a lot of these campaign stops feel very organized or feel very intentional about who they're bringing. I'm thinking a lot for we've seen just a million surrogates come through for Democrats, and it feels very not scripted, and I think that's a little bit different than a rally. I'm not sure, [chuckles] no press is bad press. I'm not sure, but yes, I've also heard and seen offensive things at Trump rallies.

He was just here a couple of weeks ago, and he had a projector and there was this screen and it was this black and white kind of altered picture to make it scary looking. It was these people in bandanas with huge guns, and it said like, "Your apartment under Kamala Harris." I have seen really out there things where you're like, whoa. I'm not sure. We can never know if it was intentional, if it was like, oh, my gosh, what? Like now they're walking it back. The campaign rallies I've been to, it feels like it was very much planned, but that's my take.

Brian Lehrer: Maybe a feature, not a bug. All right, last question. I can't resist. Maybe this is offensive. I can't resist because you're a political reporter in Nevada, what are the Las Vegas odds on this presidential election?

Lucia Starbuck: [chuckles]

Brian Lehrer: I don't know. I don't cover that is an acceptable answer.

Lucia Starbuck: [chuckles] No, I think it will be safe to say that Las Vegas will go blue. It's a major city. It usually goes blue.

Brian Lehrer: Oh, no, no, that's not what I'm asking. I'm asking, what are the Las Vegas bookies saying about the odds of the presidential campaign ending for Harris or ending for Trump?

Lucia Starbuck: [chuckles] What do you mean by the odds?

Brian Lehrer: The odds makers? What's the line in Las Vegas?

Lucia Starbuck: Are you saying we matter? [laughs]

Brian Lehrer: I'm asking, if I went to a Las Vegas betting site, would I get odds that Trump is going to win or that Harris is going to win the national election?

Lucia Starbuck: I think if you're in the business of losing money, you dare bet on the presidential race in Nevada.

Brian Lehrer: That is an excellent answer from Lucia Starbuck, political reporter for KUNR Public Radio and Reno, and host of their monthly politics program, Purple Politics Nevada. Thank you very much for spending [chuckles] time with us today. We really, really appreciate it.

Lucia Starbuck: [chuckles] Thank you so much. Always a pleasure to talk about Nevada politics. I appreciate it.

 

 

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