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Brigid Bergin: It's The Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. I'm Brigid Bergin, senior reporter in the WNYC and Gothamist newsroom filling in for Brian today. On today's show, we're going to preview two big elections happening across the pond in France and the UK. In both countries, things are not looking good for the party, currently, in power.

We'll have more on that with two correspondence from The Economist plus later in the show, in advance of Independence Day here, we're going to take a step back and have a big think conversation with a CUNY political science professor about the democratic ideals of the Founding Fathers and where things stand today. Lastly, you know how libraries offer fun summer reading challenges for kids. Well, our pals at All Of It have won for all of us to join.

All Of It producer and book maven, Jordan Lauf will lay out the challenge for you summer reading bookworms and maybe want to be bookworms out there. First, we start with the latest from City Hall. On Sunday, the city council officially adopted the new $112 billion budget for the new fiscal year. We've been unpacking it throughout the week. The final deal, how the mayor and council landed the plane, as he was fond of saying, included more money for libraries, housing, schools, and public safety.

Much of what was won came after organized protest and pushback to the mayor's proposed cuts from the council, advocates, and regular New Yorkers. At his weekly press conference, the mayor prefaced his comments on the budget by pointing to a recent op-ed in the Daily News from Reverend Al Sharpton. In it, Sharpton makes the case that Adams has made significant progress over the past two and a half years boosting jobs, lowering crime, and investing in critical services.

That his critics largely in the media, are mistreating him, not unlike the city's first Black Mayor, David Dinkins. Much of these comments were connected to how that same paper covered the question of who gets credit for what actually ended up in that budget.

Mayor Adams: I just thought Reverend Sharpton really laid out a real message of what our successes are and how those successes have been depicted. You know what's interesting, Michael? The first two pages of the Daily News, first two pages, yesterday we had some of the most historical things that took place in the city, the Supreme Court ruling all these other issues. The first two pages was hoops to credit for the victory of the budget.

Brigid Bergin: The mayor says he doesn't care who gets credit for the victory. It's not how the vegan sausage gets made, his metaphor, but it does sound like maybe he does care. Our WNYC and Gothamist City Hall reporter was at that press conference and she joins me this week with clips and analysis, and to help take your calls. Liz Kim, welcome. It's great to have you here this morning.

Elizabeth Kim: Morning, Brigid.

Brigid Bergin: What's your take on the clip I just played? The mayor certainly seems to care a lot about who gets credit for the budget wins. Is there anything else going on there?

Elizabeth Kim: Well, he should care because this is the budget that going into the primary next June into the reelection that he's going to campaign off of. This is a very important budget, and I think there's a lot of argument that he didn't handle this budget very well. I want to start off by unpacking it for listeners. There was a very unusual arc to this budget, and there were a lot of different issues driving Adams' decision in how he handled this budget. First of all, and people may have forgotten this, we started out with a specter of a recession.

There were a lot of experts saying that we were headed for a recession. Then later, it got changed. Well, maybe not a recession, but a slowdown. The other thing that was more of a certain reality was that we were going to see federal pandemic aid dry up. A lot of programs that were being funded with the billions of dollars that the federal government had given the city during COVID, that was no more. We were going to use all of that up.

How was the city going to fill that hole? The third thing that the mayor had to deal with was the migrant crisis that was billions of dollars as much as $5 billion a year the mayor has estimated. For the mayor, and for his Budget Director Jacques Jiha. This was the perfect storm for a fiscal crisis. What did the mayor do? He made very broad and steep cuts, and unsurprisingly, they were very unpopular. Now, where he gets criticism is that experts and the council said that his cost projections were too high, and in the end, his revenue estimates were too low.

Then what happened was the cuts are very unpopular. He's getting this criticism that's coming from budget experts who were saying that they miscalculated this. He starts to walk the cuts back. He's walking the cuts back before the budget negotiations even begin. We entered this budget cycle where the council had a very strong hand because they knew that it was going to be about restorations. I think that that made it a very strange budget too. Right, Brigid?

Brigid Bergin: Absolutely.

Elizabeth Kim: You've seen this process before. Usually, the mayor can use some of these cuts as leverage to get something he wants, but this budget wasn't about financing some big initiative that either the mayor and the council wanted. We heard Council Speaker Adrienne Adams describe it this way. She said we have become the council of restorations not building and that was really meant as a criticism to the mayor and they took credit for it.

They've been given credit for it because in the wake of the budget, as soon as the budget deal was announced, you had a slew of advocates for different things, for education, for parks, for transit. They all came out and what they said in their press releases was that they credited the council for securing these restorations. The way it's been reported, and I think it is accurate to say the council did fight for these restorations and also the advocates fought for these restorations.

Brigid Bergin: Absolutely.

Elizabeth Kim: In the weeks leading up to the budget deal, there were several rallies. Libraries held rallies, parks.

Brigid Bergin: Then what do you make of the fact that he pointed to this real statement of support from Reverend Sharpton, who also noted that while the Adams administration is facing these criticisms, didn't really talk about where the critiques were coming from? If you look a little more closely, as you mentioned, some of those critiques were coming from the council and from their budget analysts and certainly from members, but we're talking about a council that is majority women, majority people of color, and then maybe potential primary rivals.

If we're talking about issues of the competence of this administration, that's an argument maybe that you start to hear from State Senator Zellnor Myrie, another Black elected official from Brooklyn. We don't exactly have a Rudy Giuliani in the background like David Dinkins did, who's lobbying these coded critiques at the Adams administration. In that clip I played though, you do hear Adams direct his comment at one specific reporter. Is this their way to telegraph a message to the media about how they are covered?

Elizabeth Kim: I read that kind of criticism, which the mayor has made before, which is this idea that the incompetence is in a way it's coded. What he's saying is that it's racist because he's a Black mayor. As you pointed out, a lot of people making those charges are people of color themselves. I think what is still a reality today is that the press corps following him is largely white.

I think by making a charge like that, he's able to, in some ways, blunt or maybe disarm the press from going as hard as they might in covering the mayor. I think, Brigid, you know this. There's this tricky thing in covering electeds and someone like the mayor. It's like how do you handle deference? On the one hand, this is the mayor, he's owed that.

Brigid Bergin: Sure.

Elizabeth Kim: Then you also want to be tough too on the mayor. I think race complicates all of that because the optics then become if you have a white reporter going really hard after a Black mayor, he's not wrong. I think that it is a legitimate way to see it. It's just a legitimate question to ask, but at the same time, that doesn't mean that the criticisms are unfair or unfounded.

Brigid Bergin: I think part of what we need to do is get into some of the details of the budget itself, but before we do that, listeners, I want to invite you to be part of this conversation. Do you have any questions about this latest budget deal or other issues coming out of City Hall this week? We're going to be talking a lot more about pre-K in just a moment. Are you one of those families that either scored a spot or maybe you're one of those families still on the waitlist?

We want to hear your story. We're also going to talk about police reform and public safety, plus Mayor Adams on his support for President Biden. Do you think the mayor should still be standing with him? Give us a call. The number is 212-433-WNYC. That's 212-433-9692. You can call or text at that number.

I teased the pre-K conversation we're going to have now, Liz. It's been one of the areas of concern, funding for early childhood education specifically for four-year-olds in the pre-K program. I want to play a bit of the question that you asked the administration, but before I do, just set this up. What has been the tension around pre-K funding throughout the budget negotiation?

Elizabeth Kim: The tension around pre-K is that we have this program that was considered a national model, but under Adams, it has become very-- some people would say, mismanaged. They're saying that because there are thousands of vacant seats, and at the same time, there are parents who are unable to get seats this year. Over 2,000 were unable to get seats. Now, the mayor is going to argue that in the scheme of the tens of thousands that apply, that's a very small percentage, and he's right, but then again, Brigid, you remember, this is called a universal program.

For it to be viewed as a success, I think is that parents have to feel that if I apply, I can get a seat. This is also a program that is seen by experts as critical to the city retaining a lot of working-class and middle-class families, which the census shows that we're losing. This is a very, very important policy. How the mayor has chosen to advance it and the way he speaks about it, I think is very important. It's also been very worrisome to people who support this program because in many ways from the start, he made the cuts and he talked about we need to rightsize this program.

I think that that argument was fair because if we are seeing tens of thousands of vacant seats, and then in other areas, there aren't enough seats, I think the argument is there that the city needs to rethink this program and think about reallocating the seats. That's why I think this was a very pivotal moment for this budget. Were the cuts going to stand or were they going to put back money? What happened was, it was in some ways, not completely satisfying to the advocates who wanted to see all of the money restored, but I don't think it was a total loss either.

Not all of the money was restored, but they put back an additional 100 million. It was a deal that was reached with the council. What they agreed to, or part of the money was going to go toward one, addressing all the people who are on the waitlist, and the council told me it was around 1,600, the mayor's office is saying it's 1,400, but then also going forward thinking about this program. Why is it not working? Why are there so many vacant seats?

One of the proposals they came up with was converting a half-day seats into full-day and year-round seats. I think they're thinking through policy solutions. I think in the end, the restructuring of the program if in fact, they are able to get this program back to being truly universal, it could be a shared win between the mayor and the council.

Brigid Bergin: Well, I think some of those families that are probably still on that waitlist are very eager to know if this program is going to be rightsized in their favor. I want to play how you framed that question to the administration, and then we'll hear a response from Deputy Mayor Ana Almanzar. Let's start with Liz's question.

Elizabeth Kim: Mr. Mayor, I wanted to ask you about the 1,600 families that are on the pre-K waiting list. I know it's part of the budget deal that you reached with the council. The agreement was that city would go through that entire list and ensure that there was a seat for every single student. I wanted to know how fast-- when can family start expecting to get offers?

Brigid Bergin: Then this is from Deputy Mayor Ana Almanzar.

Deputy Mayor Ana Almanzar: You speak about the numbers of family who have not received an offer. It was initially when the process started was 2,400. As of now, 1,000 seats have been filled for those families who are able to access those seats. We have about 1,400 left and we are still working as families accept and reject some of the seats, we are working with the Department of Education and the team internally here at City Hall to make sure that those offers go out as soon as possible and as quick as possible to make sure those 1,400 families or so receive those seats right before the end of the year. A second, before the start of the school year, right?

Elizabeth Kim: Before the start of the school year.

Deputy Mayor Ana Almanzar: Of school year. Correct.

Brigid Bergin: It sounds like the Department of Education is going to be sending out notices over the summer to those families, but that makes for a challenge for families who maybe need to find childcare for their four-year-old if they're not going to be in this pre-K program. Liz, I should tell you, we're getting several text messages from listeners who are also very concerned that more than 700 preschoolers with a disability are currently on a waitlist for pre-K, and that the mayor had announced--

Another listener texted, "The mayor had announced a year ago that no preschooler with a disability would be left without a seat and then failed to make any investments in that." I'm wondering, in what you heard from the administration and what you've been following since then, is that something that you've heard them talk about, and how does this fit into the thinking about rightsizing the program, if we know that there's this group of students who may be still unserved almost entirely?

Elizabeth Kim: Yes, to the question about special education, that is actually also a part of the budget deal is that the mayor and the council will ensure that every student who needs a special education seat will also get one. I think this issue of the waitlist is very, very important because this is the first step. This is basically the first thing they have to do. We're both parents. What I thought was a little concerning about the way the deputy mayor answered that question is, she's saying that they're going to get through the waitlist before the start of the school year.

Now, before the start-

Brigid Bergin: That's late.

Elizabeth Kim: -that's late. I think the parents on that waitlist probably don't want to hear that. I think they probably want to hear something maybe closer to mid-August because we all have to make childcare plans. That was not great, I think, but we will see. We'll give the city the time, but I think what comes out of that will be the first thing we see as to how they're handling this program.

They have said that all indications are that the mayor's office is being more directly involved in this program, which is a good sign because you hear Deputy Mayor Almanzar saying that the mayor's office is also going to be part of this. It's not just going to be run out of tweed. Let's see what comes of that. Going forward with the rightsizing, I think, we'll see that during the next application cycle and how many people do we see are being shut out how many vacant seats are there.

Brigid Bergin: Liz, you mentioned this idea of extending some of these pre-K seats that were half-day seats to full-day seats. I had a child go through pre-K. Full-day meant about 2:15 in the afternoon. Another listener texted that it could mean maybe 4:00, 4:30, presumably with some form of aftercare. Part of what working parents sometimes are really looking for is something that can go until 5:00, 6:00 PM.

Was there any talk and do you have a sense that the city is thinking about those types of solutions given that childcare is one of these enormous expenses for so many as you mentioned middle-class, blue-collar families who are trying to figure out how to make ends meet in the city?

Elizabeth Kim: Right. That's exactly what the council has been talking to me about. To be honest, I think the mayor has an opportunity to talk about that. That's a big structural shift that could be very meaningful to a lot of parents and could really help expand the program even further. To go from a day that might end at 2.15 to 5:00, but that's exactly what the council has in mind. Let's extend the day. The other component is let's make it year-round. That could mean a lot to a lot of parents, too.

Brigid Bergin: Absolutely. Listeners, if you're just joining us, I'm Brigid Bergin filling in for Brian Lehrer today. My guest is my colleague, WNYC, and Gothamist reporter, Liz Kim. We're talking about the mayor's weekly press conference. Big issues this week, obviously, around the city budget. We want to hear from you, too. Do you have any questions about this budget deal or other issues coming out of city hall, whether it's related to pre-K, public safety?

Are you one of the families on one of those waitlists? Are you trying to figure out your plans for the fall? We'd love to know what you're thinking about and how you're trying to balance whether you wait for the city to tell you if you're going to get an offer or if you have to sign a further childcare. Plus, we know that on the minds of many Democrats is the future for President Biden.

Mayor Adams weighed in with his support yesterday. Do you think he should still be standing with him? Call us, the number is 212-433-WNYC. That's 212-433-9692. You can call or text at that number. We're going to have much more with your calls and texts, but we're going to take a short break. Stay with us.

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Brigid Bergin: Good morning again, everyone. I'm Brigid Bergin filling in for Brian Lehrer on The Brian Lehrer Show today. My guest is WNYC and Gothamist reporter Liz Kim. Liz, the mayor has an event today at One Police Plaza. Police reform has long been an issue that Adams has worked on. Public safety was central to his first campaign pitch to voters and inevitably will be part of his campaign for re-election. The administration has faced some real scrutiny this week.

The New York Times and ProPublica published an investigation that found Police Commissioner Caban has used what they called a little-known authority called retention, which essentially has allowed him to prevent cases of alleged police misconduct from going to departmental trial and for those officers to face potential discipline. You asked a question about police reform as well. Let's take a listen.

Elizabeth Kim: A comment to Jeff about how you've devoted your life to police reform. I want to ask if you could talk about what you consider the major police accountability reform you've instituted as mayor in terms of transparency or addressing racism in the force.

Brigid Bergin: Now the mayor offered a pretty lengthy reply. This clip is about two and a half minutes, but Liz and I will unpack it on the other side. Let's take a listen.

Mayor Adams: Well, I think it's a combination of one of the big things that I don't think many people appreciate about this is that rarely has a mayor understood the intricacies of not only policing but agencies. If you were to do an analysis of the previous mayors throughout the decades, they did not come from that agency that has a major impact on our quality of life. That's one of the most emotional agencies in our city, the New York City Police Department.

It's a combination of things, not only symbolic, but substantive. We are moving to close the gap of how long it takes to identify those officers who are not suitable to do officers. It was taking years. That was one of the major things that I wanted to focus on to ensure that we identify those officers who commit crimes or do something that's improper and how long they're going to stay in the agencies. The second is the proper use of stop-and-frisk.

Stop-and-frisk has been something that has been abused throughout the years, going in, doing a real analysis on how we are utilizing a tool that is effectively used that we could address the issues. The third is our inspection team, something that you don't see, don't even know that exists. We beefed up our inspection team to be proactive, to go out there and identify those cops that are not following the rules, not doing the right things.

The amount of manpower we put in place by those inspection teams that could identify misbehavior, inactions, the failure to properly carry out their police roles is something that's crucial. One of the most important things I could do around reform was the commissioners I picked, particularly Commissioner Caban.

Long history, everyone knows his history. His dad fought for integration in the police department, and now his son is a commissioner of it. The right leadership can place us in the right direction. Those stricter timelines on cases that have languished for months is a huge shift in what we have done in the past. Then the best reform we could have is people being safe.

Brigid Bergin: Liz, we played that extended clip from the mayor because public safety is so central to how he has campaigned to New Yorkers. His commitment of what his administration was going to accomplish. You asked for a reform that addressed transparency and racism on the force, and I heard him mention the proper use of stop-and-frisk as one of the items. What did you make of that answer?

Elizabeth Kim: It was a very long answer, but I think it's important for listeners to hear the mayor's entire answer on this because this was central to his campaign. It's central to his identity as a former police officer who criticized the NYPD. What he talks about, it's interesting because it doesn't seem to line up with what we know, what's been reported. Let's start with stop-and-frisk. He ticks that off. Yes, that was something he talked about during the campaign.

He said that he believed that stop-and-frisk could be used, but it had to be used in the right way and in the right circumstances. It could be used in a way that wasn't racist, which is what the data has shown is that it has been disproportionately used on Black and Latino men. What does the data tell us? The data tells us that under Adams, stop-and-frisk is up and that it is still disproportionately stopping people of color. That was a little odd that he ticked that off because there's been a lot of reporting about that.

The other thing he says is closing the gap to identify, I guess, police officers who have some misconduct case. There's been reporting on and at that very press conference, the mayor was asked about that New York Times ProPublica story that you mentioned which was about the commissioner, Commissioner Caban interfering in police misconduct cases and allowing officers to skirt the full process. There's tension there, too, with his response there and about the inspection teams that he says, this is something that you don't often hear about or see.

Well, if that's a major part of his attempt to reform the NYPD and address misconduct, why don't we know more about it? I thought there was a lot there in his two-and-a-half minutes that left listeners maybe scratching their heads or wanting to know more.

Brigid Bergin: Yes, it's certainly something I know that you and our colleagues will be covering going forward. We've got some listeners who have been patiently waiting. I want to bring in Brian from Bay Ridge. Brian, thanks so much for your call.

Brian: Hello. How are you? I just wanted to mention that my wife has a UPK center. We've had a lot of problems with the Adams administration. He's really screwed it up since de Blasio left and it makes it very difficult to get parents in. Right now we have 14 3K seats available. People are denied. If you can take the information down, we have seats. We're registering right now. Golden Sunrise Daycare, we're at 918 58th Street. We have 14 3K seats and two 4K seats.

Brigid Bergin: Brian, let me just interrupt. We always like when people can give their plugs on air. My question is, what is it that has changed? Why is it harder for you to fill these seats now under the Adams administration? What was different about filling them under the de Blasio administration?

Brian: I couldn't give you all the particulars. I'm sorry because my wife runs it, but I was with the DOE myself for 25 years. The way it looks is that the process was streamlined before and Adams changed the agencies that took things over. He somehow did something like gave the health agencies to something that the DOE used to keep, and then the DOE got something that some other agency had and it all fell apart and we didn't get paid for months and months and months almost went out of business. They just handed off all the divisions to new people who were just starting and they didn't know what to do with this information. Everybody just fell through the cracks.

Brigid Bergin: Well, Brian, thank you for calling. We appreciate knowing that there are seats available. Listeners in Bay Ridge, Sunrise Daycare, I think, if I got the name right, apparently still has pre-K seats available. Liz, I saw you nodding and I know part of what Brian said, I've certainly heard as well about the idea that some of these facilities that were administering pre-K were not getting paid. Do you have any sense of what changed between the two administrations?

Elizabeth Kim: Right. I think a lot of what Brian said tracks with the reporting that has been done by education reporters, including our own Jess Gould. There is the issue of payments and why were those payments late? A lot of these complaints are around management and that has been one of the central criticisms. The mayor often bristles at these criticisms. He hates this criticism, but it's one that's often lobbed at him, is that he has not effectively managed these agencies and these very, very important programs.

The thing I would also add about the vacancies is another reason why people speculate there are so many vacancies is that the city hasn't done enough outreach to let people know about these programs. I spoke to one of the members of the council who told me that the new plan is to really have boots on the ground. They want to have people in hair salons, in churches, in homeless shelters where there are a lot of families. It's about getting out the word and we'll see. Maybe that will help reduce some of the vacancies.

Brigid Bergin: Let's go to Jessica in Brooklyn. Jessica, thanks for calling WNYC.

Jessica: Hi, I have called a few times before as a mental health practitioner, but now I'm calling in as a parent. I have a three-year-old who just finished 3K in a school in Clinton Hill, and it's a school that's been the biggest hub for migrant families. It's so interesting because the school is working phenomenally to be inclusive of these families, as much money as Adams is giving, providing services for families, but the neighborhood has been good and we're all stepping in.

It's so interesting because I hear parents on the playground saying they don't want to send their kids there, and they are keeping them on waitlist for "better schools in Fort Green." I just want to say, I found it to be phenomenal for my daughter in 3K. The families have been amazing. There are a ton of French African families and Latin American and South American families. They're doing a very good job, again, considering budgeting and I just wish there were a little more taste of inclusivity more than just what people speak in their "politics" and what they're actually doing because it's been really beautiful at this school.

Brigid Bergin: Jessica, thanks so much for that call. I'm so glad that your child had a great experience in 3K. I know it was a great experience for our family as well. Liz, I think the interesting point that Jessica raises is maybe there are other things going on with those waitlists beyond just the bureaucratic issues that Brian, the previous caller, had raised. Another interesting perspective on what's going on here in the city.

I mentioned that library funding was restored, that was turning into a real political headache for the mayor, but we know that city funding for parks is still down. Adams really proudly claims the mantle of being the city's blue-collar mayor, but do you get the sense that the administration really understands how and who is taking advantage of some of these city services? Who is using these parks? Who is now going to suffer as a result of the lack of funding for some of these areas?

Elizabeth Kim: Well, what the mayor believes is he believes that for his base, for his constituents, and I think he would argue for most New Yorkers, what they value the most is public safety. That's why there was some cuts to the NYPD, he had cut some academy classes, but those were one of the first restorations that he made at the beginning of this year. Yes, the parks thing, I think it will dog him because I think the same way in which he did not see how libraries are-- fundamentally, they're beloved and everybody see.

Even people who don't use the library value them as a community institution. Also, the way that libraries are being used, the uses for the users have evolved as have the programs that they now offer. Everything from story time to learning English, to giving someone internet access. That's been said of the mayor, why did he not understand this? If he's always talking about himself as the mayor for the working class, how could he not see that these are the institutions that the working class need and value?

Brigid Bergin: Another issue that came up yesterday, Liz, was this idea that the mayor has been floating Attorney Randy Mastro, as a possible replacement for the City's corporation council. That's an appointment that would require the council's approval. It was tabled during budget negotiations. Just remind listeners why this has been such a point of contention, and do you anticipate this is going to be moving forward anytime soon?

Elizabeth Kim: Randy Mastro has been floated for a while now as the city's top lawyer. He would be in charge of the city's law department, which is around 850 lawyers. It's a very, very big job. It's very, very important, but it is one of the positions that needs counsel approval. If you have heard of Randy Mastro, you will know that he is a very high profile lawyer, but he's taken on some controversial right-wing cases and I could list them for he defended Chevron in a class action pollution case. He defended former governor Chris Christie in the Bridgegate scandal.

More locally, he has taken on lawsuits against bike lanes, against raising the minimum wage for fast food workers. He's not someone who's well-liked by the left. The council, which is largely made up of more left-leaning members now, they've made it very clear even before Adams, and he has not been formally nominated, but even when it was floated, they made it very clear that they did not like this candidate.

It's not even clear that he could get out of committee. This is not something where it's close where they need to just win over a handful of votes, it seems like the overwhelming majority of the council, at this point, would not vote him in. He's been in a holding pattern. Originally, what the mayor's office said was that they were going to wait until the budget is done.

Now, the budget's done, so the question was put to them. The answer, I think may surprise some people, but yes, the answer was that they say anyway that they plan to go through with it. I guess that will be another drama that we'll see unfold between the council and the mayor.

Brigid Bergin: Liz, before I let you go, we need to talk about the issue on the minds of so many Democrats in recent days. That's whether President Biden should remain on the top of the ticket. The mayor was asked about it again yesterday, here's what he said.

Mayor Adams: He started out slow, I think he started to move forward as he went on. Listen, I identify with him. People want to take the worst day of your life and define your life. I know what the last couple of years have been. There was a reason I said I'm the Biden of Brooklyn because I just think working-class people are authentic.

I remember meeting him in 2021 when I went to the White House and we were able to chat briefly and just authentic leaders are not perfect. We have good days and we have bad days, and people want to make the worst day of your entire life, but I think it's imperative that he makes a decision on what he's going to move forward with his partners in the party. Whatever I can do, I'm going to do, I'm not going to get ahead of the strategy. I'm going to be in alignment with the strategy.

Brigid Bergin: Mayor Adams there first addressing obviously Biden's debate performance last week, but then, just offering that little note of caution there at the end. He's going to be in alignment, but he's not going to get ahead of the strategy, and certainly, in the days since that debate, we're seeing an outpouring of concern from Democrats.

Governor Kathy Hochul is going to be in Washington DC today, meeting with democratic governors who are meeting with the President. Liz, what was your sense of the mayor's framing there? We certainly know that the mayor and President Biden have not always had the best relationship over the past year, at least throughout the migrant crisis.

Elizabeth Kim: Right, which is partly what was behind that question. He was asked that question several times after the debate, and he gave essentially-- He's given a very consistent answer in which he says, "We shouldn't judge the president just based off of one debate performance." Then he makes that pivot, where he opens it up to like, I will support whatever strategy there is. As in acknowledging that perhaps there are conversations going around about and he's not wrong.

The reporting supports that about an internal push within the Democratic party to seek another candidate. Take that as you will. The mayor, as you said, he's had a strange relationship with the president because of his sharp criticism of the way Biden has handled the border crisis. He's saying, " I don't think we should judge him on his worst day, but at the same time, I'm going to support whatever it is that the party wants."

Brigid Bergin: Well, I know that there will be a lot for both you and I to do in the days and weeks ahead related to this and other politics here in New York. We're going to leave it there for now. My guest has been WNYC's Liz Kim, Mayor Adams reporter. Liz, have a great holiday, and thanks so much for joining me.

Elizabeth Kim: Thanks, Brigid.

 

 

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