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Brigid Bergin: It's The Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. I'm Brigid Bergin, senior reporter in the WNYC and Gothamist newsroom filling in for Brian today. On today's show, our climate story of the week looks at two climate-related bills that are still hanging in the balance in Albany with the legislative session winding down this week. That's the New York HEAT Act and one on plastics packaging.

Plus, later in the show, why some progressive advocates are turning to the states to expand rights, since the Supreme Court with its conservative majority is clearly not a path they can rely on. We'll wrap up today's show with a conversation on how so-called 'tradwife' culture-- have you come across this on social media?-- intersects or diverges from how you run your household.

First, it's primary day in New Jersey and that means it's time for another installment of The Brian Lehrer Show's informal, unofficial, and thoroughly unscientific exit poll. That's right, Garden State voters, get ready to call in and tell us who you voted for and why. The number is 212-433-WNYC. That's 212-433-9692. New Jersey primary voters, we want to hear from you.

There are a lot of races on the ballot in this election. Even though Democrats and Republicans already have their nominees for president, both Joe Biden and Donald Trump will be on the ballot there. Maybe you've been paying more attention to the Democratic senate primary, where Congressman Andy Kim, Patricia Campos-Medina, and Larry Hamm are all running candidates hoping to succeed long-serving New Jersey Senator, Bob Menendez.

A little bit more news coming from that camp, too, today. There are also several competitive House primaries and even before polls opened at 6:00 AM this morning, nearly 280,000 voters had already cast their ballots during early voting, so there's a lot of cover this morning. As you call in to tell us how you make up your mind, I am pleased to be joined by our own guru of Garden State politics. She hosts the monthly call-in Ask Governor Murphy show here on WNYC, she's the one and only WNYC and New Jersey Public Radio's Nancy Solomon. Hey, Nancy, thanks for starting what may be a very long day for you with us.

Nancy Solomon: [chuckles] Thanks, Brigid.

Brigid Bergin: Listeners again, especially New Jersey primary voters, call in for our latest informal, unofficial, thoroughly unscientific exit poll. We want to hear who you voted for and why. Democrats and Republicans have competitive primaries today. Why did you vote? Who did you vote for? The number, 212-433-9692. You can call or text at that number.

Okay, Nancy, so before we jump into the races, on the ballot today, I teased it, we've got to start with the latest news about Senator Bob Menendez at your current headline on Gothamist pulls together a whole bunch of the storylines we're going to get into. It says, "New Jersey's Senator Menendez is seeking reelection despite "gold bar trial". Could he be a spoiler for Kim?

Okay, Nancy, break down this headline for me. Senator Menendez is now officially running for reelection while also contending with an ongoing corruption case?

Nancy Solomon: That's exactly right. He is charged in a really sprawling conspiracy case with him, his wife Nadine, and now two out of the three businessmen charged are on trial with him. One has already pled guilty and is expected to testify. This is a really massive complicated scheme in which he is asked by the government, particularly military and intelligence officials from Egypt, to advocate on their behalf to open up arms sales to Egypt, which had been put on hold because of human rights concerns.

He is the chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee and so had a lot of power in that debate. Then, what Egypt offered-- This was all brokered by a guy who wanted to have a business, a halal meat-certification business. Just like kosher meat, halal meat, there are the big beef and meat producers, and you have someone who is experienced, who comes and certifies that everything is being done to kosher law or to halal law.

Brigid Bergin: Sure.

Nancy Solomon: These are very big businesses because the United States exports a lot of meat around the world, so Egypt gets to determine who they want to certify the halal meat that they import from the United States. There had been like four companies doing it. The USDA wanted to expand that number of companies because they think it's good for business to have more competition, good for pricing.

Egypt said, "No, we just want this one guy." so the prosecutors alleged that this was part of the deal, that Bob Menendez would get them their arms, and he would also get them this monopoly for this one guy, and then the money that that guy would make would kick back to Menendez and his wife. When the FBI raided the Menendez home, they found almost half a million dollars in cash, which, when I was sitting in court watching that testimony, it really is amazing how much cash there was like, what that looked--

I had no idea what $500,000 in cash looks like. You would basically need a wheelbarrow-

Brigid Bergin: Oh my goodness.

Nancy Solomon: -to move it. It was squirreled away in jacket pocket, boots. [laughs] My favorite was the boots. There was a duffel bag, it was about the size of a-

Brigid Bergin: Yes. I thought there was gym bag in there, yes.

Nancy Solomon: -gym bag. Yes. That had $100,000 in it. Bob Menendez says, in his defense, that, A, that his wife accepted gifts from her friends because she was in need. When they first started dating, he didn't really understand her financial situation, that she was on the verge of bankruptcy. Her house was being foreclosed on and that her friends helped her.

Brigid Bergin: Wow.

Nancy Solomon: That's part of the defense. The other part of the defense is that he has suffered some PTSD from growing up with Cuban refugee parents who had to leave quickly from Cuba, at the time of the revolution there, and lost everything they had except the cash that was hidden in the grandfather clock. This is the story. He says that over 30 years, he had been taking money out of the bank and keeping it at home and that this was basically sum total of his savings.

Brigid Bergin: Wow.

Nancy Solomon: We'll see.

Brigid Bergin: Nancy, where are the gold bars?

Nancy Solomon: [laughs] The gold bars were in Nadine Menendez's closet and in a safe deposit box at the bank. Senator Menendez says that he thought it was part of Middle Eastern tradition. His wife Nadine is Armenian, was born in Beirut, and speaks Arabic. He believed that this was part of her family tradition that they pass down and keep gold bars because they don't trust the currency of the country that they live in, which could very well be true. He thought that they were just her inherited gold bars.

Brigid Bergin: This is a very complicated case.

Nancy Solomon: Yes.

Brigid Bergin: If a screenwriter was doing it, they might say it's a little over the top. It's not going away anytime soon, right? Senator Menendez is currently on trial and then his wife will be on trial, is that right?

Nancy Solomon: Yes. The election calendar has not been kind, so the deadline for independents to file in the November election-- Let's back up just a minute, just to clarify that in September, when the indictment was announced, basically, within a matter of days, every top Democrat in the state, almost all, called for him to resign. It was clear to anybody watching New Jersey politics that he was not going to-- Andy Kim, congressman from the 3rd District, jumped into the race immediately.

It was clear to anybody watching that without the support of the party, he was not going to be able to win a primary challenge. He never filed for reelection in the primary as a Democrat. The deadline to file as an independent is today and yesterday he filed the paperwork. He has until mid-August to pull out and not be on the ballot. Then in terms of the trial schedule, it started May 13th, it's expected to go to sometime around the last days of June or the first week of July if it runs on schedule.

Then, his wife has been separated from the three defendants who are on trial right now. Her trial will begin and now go six weeks. [chuckles]

Brigid Bergin: Wow.

Nancy Solomon: It's going to make a real mess of any attempts that he-- Although if he's acquitted in the beginning of July. This is what he says, is that he will be able to mount a rigorous campaign that he has been unfairly tarnished and that he's done a lot of good things for New Jersey and deserves to keep his seat.

Brigid Bergin: Well, a very interesting backdrop to a very interesting primary day. I want to bring in Alex from Manasquan, a New Jersey primary voter who's going to talk about one of the big ticket races on the Democratic primary ballot. Alex, thanks for calling WNYC.

Alex Manasquan: Hello. It's very good to speak to you this morning. I'm just heading into work, and I figured, "Why not call in?" I am a big Andy Kim head. He was originally my representative. However, in the last redistricting cycle, I got redistricted into a Christmas district. When he was my representative, I literally had nothing but awesome things to say about him. I think if there's anybody who deserves this Senate seat after Mr. Menendez squandered it, I guess, for lack of a better word, I think that there's really no one more deserving than Andy Kim, to be honest.

Brigid Bergin: Alex, thanks so much for that call. Listeners, especially you New Jersey primary voters, we are inviting you to call in for our latest informal, unofficial, thoroughly unscientific exit poll. We want to hear who you voted for today and why Democrats, Republicans, everybody who can vote in today's election, we want to hear from you. The number is 212-433-9692. You can call or text at that number. Let's go to Michael in Hoboken, New Jersey. Michael, thanks for calling WNYC.

Michael: Hi. I voted this morning for Ravi Bhalla in the 8th Congressional District. This was a surprise to me. I hadn't expected to, but Ravi has taken a strong support of the President's effort to force a ceasefire in Gaza, and Rob Menendez is part of Josh Gottheimer's group that's trying to keep the pressure off, so I voted for Ravi Bhalla. More importantly, I voted for uncommitted in the Democratic primary for President, not because I don't support Joe Biden, I do, but because Joe Biden needs to get the message that unless he stands firm and gets Israel to stop ethnically cleansing Gaza and doing it with the United States money, he is going to lose this election. That's my vote.

Brigid Bergin: Michael, thanks so much for your call. Nancy, our board is filling up with some New Jersey callers, but I want to get your reaction to our first two listeners. Obviously, that big New Jersey Democratic Senate primary, and then one of the more competitive House primaries.

Nancy Solomon: Right. This goes right to the heart of some of the central issues, these two callers for this year's election. First off, Andy Kim has really shown us in the six years that he's been in politics, that he has masterful political instincts, and that he's often underestimated. When he entered the race for Senator Menendez's seat, and people knew that Tammy Murphy was going to declare and come gunning for him, who's the governor's wife, really, I think I put myself in the category of people who thought, "He's just going to have to drop out. He's not going to be able to beat her and the political machines and the ballot preferential treatment she'll get."

He took the whole system down. He has built a statewide campaign, and he's going to be a formidable opponent even with Senator Menendez running as an independent. That's what I'll say, and we could obviously talk a lot more about Andy Kim in the county line. The folks who are voting for the uncommitted delegates for the Democratic primary for President, this is a real sleeper of an issue. It hasn't gotten that much attention. I think it's going to tilt a few races down-ballot, which is what we just heard from a Hoboken voter.

Ravi Bhalla is pulling in. Ravi Bhalla is the mayor of Hoboken and he's challenging Rob Menendez, the son of Bob Menendez, who is a first-term Democrat in Congress in the 8th district, which is essentially most of Hudson County. What Rob Menendez is facing is both blowback around issues of nepotism and the political machine's ability to pick and anoint candidates in Democratic primaries, which is what had happened two years ago.

He's facing anti-Senator Menendez, anti-machine blowback. Then at the same time, there is this really big issue among Democrats about Israel and Gaza. I identified it much more in the district next door, the 9th, which is the incumbent is Bill Pascrell, the long-time Democrat, been in Congress since 1996, very much liked in his district. He has a district that has the second largest Palestinian community in the country, and a large Arab-American and a large Muslim community. It all is overlapping because there are Turks who aren't Arabs or Muslim, and then there are folks from Syria, Lebanon, and of course, Palestine.

He's facing huge blowback, and folks are organizing, A, to vote uncommitted against the President to send a strong message, but also, B, that's causing problems for Bill Pascrell. That's the district around Patterson and its suburbs in Passaic County.

Brigid Bergin: Sure. I want to go to another caller, Donald in Jersey City. Donald, before I give you the floor, I just wanted to say that we've gotten a couple of texts that are in line with, I think, what Donald wants to talk about as a Republican voter in New Jersey. Donald, thanks so much for calling WNYC.

Donald: Hi there. Yes, I live in Jersey City, and I remain a registered Republican. In New Jersey, as I understand it, you can only vote in your party for a primary. I feel enormously deprived this year, and I felt this way the last time around when I voted for John Kasich instead of Donald Trump. I feel, if I may put it bluntly, before Donald Trump would try to destroy the American democracy, he has to destroy the Republican Party. I think he's doing a rather good job of it, to put it ironically. I'm very upset about this, and I think anyone might be if they are paying attention to our politics.

Brigid Bergin: Donald, then I'll just pose the question to you. Have you decided how you're going to vote in the New Jersey Republican Senate primary?

Donald: No, and I have to take a look at that. I've got my ballot that they send to everybody. I would have to write in somebody like Governor Bill Wells for President, which would be weird and funny because, of course, he's not running this time around. He's the only Republican of stature that I can think of who would make a good candidate at this moment. There may be some others out there, but no, you have reminded me of the homework I have to do with regard to the ballot and see what I'm going to do. I may not even go, but I've never done a write-in before, so that could be fun.

Brigid Bergin: Well, Donald, thanks so much for your call. If I may, I'll direct you to all of Nancy's great reporting on gothamist.com, which covers a lot of this territory for you. Nancy, I wonder, this was in the text, and Donald didn't quite get this far, but we're hearing about how Democrats are mounting this uncommitted campaign for Republicans who are voting in the primary. Is there any similar effort, any write-in effort for people who maybe do not want to cast a ballot for Trump?

Nancy Solomon: It's a great question. I think that nothing has bubbled up to the surface. I'm sure there are a lot of people like Donald. I think what he says-- These calls are great because they really go to the heart of what is at play and what is important to people in New Jersey right now with this primary. Here's another issue. The primary is so late. We're one of four states voting today.

It's the end of the primary season. The decisions are pretty well made, and there are no choices. You can choose uncommitted against Biden, but as far as I know, there's not much of a choice in the presidential primary on the Republican side. He makes a really good point, and I hear his frustration. It's also interesting, what Donald had to say because New Jersey at one time, was really the center of moderate Republican politics and produced big Republican stars who were very well known nationally, who were moderate Abraham Lincoln Republicans.

That part of the party, I mean, we've seen it be just defeated and destroyed all over the country, and it got smaller and smaller and smaller in New Jersey where it felt it was the last bastion of it. Republicans are really struggling in New Jersey to find people they want to vote for, I think. Not everybody, obviously, there's a bunch of-- Trump has a certain amount of support.

You mentioned the Senate race. There are two Republicans vying for the Republican nomination for the Senate seat held by Menendez. Trump is definitely, I think I put it in the story, the elephant with the MAGA hat in the room, something like that. He raises a point that is of great frustration. It's one of the reasons why we see as many unaffiliated voters in New Jersey as we have registered Democrats and Democrats far outnumber Republicans. The primary is a very frustrating time for unaffiliated voters. It doesn't work for them.

Brigid Bergin: The same holds true here in New York as well. We need to take a short break, but we're going to have much more with WNYC's Nancy Solomon and more of your calls on the New Jersey primary election coming up. Stick around.

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Brigid Bergin: It's The Brian Lehrer Show in WNYC. I'm Brigid Bergin, in for Brian today. My guest is Nancy Solomon, WNYC's senior reporter for New Jersey and host of Ask Governor Murphy, a monthly call-in show here in WNYC in New Jersey Public Radio. We are talking primary day in the Garden State. We're asking for you to call in, tell us who you voted for, why you voted for them, and help us understand what the dynamics are of this very interesting and consequential election happening today. I want to go straight to John in Red Bank, New Jersey. John, thanks for holding and thanks for calling.

John: You're welcome. I want to say thank you to Nancy Solomon because of her program with Governor Murphy. It's really enlightened me and it gave me information that I probably would not normally have had. That's one of the reasons why I voted for Andy Kim. The other thing that I want to say is, I already voted today and I voted for President Biden. I think compared to what we have with Mr. Trump, we have to go with someone who believes in the Democratic process. Basically, that's why I voted for him.

Although, I wish he had not sought the presidential ballot or to go back on to be president of the United States. I think he's made a number of significant mistakes, but I still don't hold it against him. I think he's a wonderful individual, but I just think that a number of things, his age and some of the errors that he has made, we needed to find another Democrat that could handle this job.

Brigid Bergin: John, thanks so much for your call. Let's go to Mike in Hackensack, New Jersey. Mike, you there?

Mike: Yes.

Brigid Bergin: Thanks so much for calling.

Mike: Oh, you're welcome. Thank you and Ms. Solomon for the the great information that comes from the station as usual. Yes, I'm a dead-in-the-world liberal Democrat. I think that's one of the rules to live in New Jersey. Beyond that, I am flabbergasted yet by the support Trump continues to garner. I would just like to say, of course, I voted straight Democrat ticket [unintelligible 00:24:58].

I just want to just make a quick point here that when I hear people talking about Biden's age, and I hear this and that, I wanted to understand just a couple things that, first of all, one of what almost I would say all historians would consider, one of the greatest presidents we've ever had in this country, Franklin Roosevelt was crippled for his entire -- Well, he got elected four times, he didn't make the fourth one, obviously. I just want to not make age or your physical prowess a condition to be president.

What you have to do is be smart enough to pick the right people to do the right jobs. The only other point I want to make is this, anybody that says they're voting for this one or that, they have to understand something that if you vote for anybody other than Biden, you're voting for Trump. That's it. I really appreciate you giving me the time to say that. Have a great day.

Brigid Bergin: Mike, thanks so much for your call, a lot there. Nancy, I want to give you a chance to respond to the callers, but I want to pick up on something that Mike said. He said he voted a straight Democratic ticket. You've done a lot of reporting, and you alluded to this a little bit before, but that ballot looks a little bit different in this election than it has ever before. Let me give you a chance to first start by any reaction to those callers, and then just talk up for a moment about how different the Democratic ballot is this primary election than it's been in the past.

Nancy Solomon: Yes. Thanks to both John in Red Bank and Mike in Hackensack for the kind words, of course. The county line is the system that has existed for a very, very long time in New Jersey. What that means is that county party organizations endorse a candidate and they run a line on the ballot in each county that is all the different candidates they endorse. This year, if we had had the county line, and I'll get to why we don't, but it would've started on the Democratic primary side, it would've started with President Biden at the top, and then gone to the Senate seat and whoever was endorsed in that race, and then the congressional seat on down to local races.

What that research has shown that what that does is it gives an air of legitimacy to candidates that necessarily their names aren't recognized by the voter or they're not well known, and so people see-- As to Mike's point, they look at it, and they vote Democrat down the line because they are loyal Democrats. There's nothing wrong with that. What it has meant for primaries, because it's a very different situation when you're talking about a general election, but in the primary, over the years, voters have wanted to have more say in who the nominee is. It used to be the political parties chose the nominees. Nowadays, in all states, there's a fair and free election to choose who the nominees are.

There was a movement, there still is in New Jersey, to stop the practice of awarding the county line and do what 49 other states do, which is called an office block ballot, and put candidates grouped together for the office they're running and create a random selection for how the order goes because if you're at the top, you still get an advantage in each office block.

Andy Kim, when he was running against Tammy Murphy, first lady, and she was within days of her saying she was going to run for the Senate, all the party bosses, which are the heads of the county political organizations, endorsed her. It became an air of inevitability that with that support, she would win and she probably would have. He challenged it in court and he got a temporary injunction against the county line, which is based on a lawsuit that was filed a couple years ago and is slowly winding its way through federal court. Basically, his argument was to get a temporary injunction, you have to show, "Hey, this has a very good chance of being found unconstitutional and being disallowed." You give me a chance, this is my one chance to run for the Senate, it's an open seat, so I need a temporary injunction against the line. He won. Effectively, what that did was it knocked Tammy Murphy out of the race, which was astounding, and it completely shifted what the ballots looked like for Democrats.

This was a inter-Democrat fight, and the court didn't rule on anything having to do with Republicans, so the Republican party still has the line for now, but among Democrats, it has shifted. The decision came down in the last week of March, and it was already too late to enter any of these races. Really, there are some lucky people who decided back in the fall that they were going to do a primary challenge against an incumbent, most notably a few congresspeople.

Those have become competitive races. It's had a small effect this year, a large effect in the sense of the Senate seat, which is huge, but it's expected to have a much bigger effect on the gubernatorial election that's coming next year and on future races in terms of getting good reform, competitive primary challenges from good candidates who actually now see that they have a chance, a fair chance of winning.

Brigid Bergin: Nancy, we have a bunch of callers, a bunch of text messages. Before I bring in another caller, I just want you to make sure that we talk about the Republican primary candidates for Senate. Who's running in the Trump factor there?

Nancy Solomon: Right. It's Curtis Bashaw who is a hotel developer in Cape May. He's well-known for having renovated and reopened Congress Hall, which is one of the big landmarks in Cape May. He is running in the Republican primary against Christine Serrano Glassner, who is the mayor of Mendham. Her husband was a top official in the Trump campaign in 2020. She's endorsed by Donald Trump, and both candidates have endorsed Trump back. I think Serano Glassner is what you could describe as a full-on member of the Trump wing of the party.

I'd say Bashaw is a little more circumspect and a bit more moderate, but he's in the primary, trying to walk a line, and he won't criticize Donald Trump, but he doesn't fully embrace him either. I think the expectation is if he could win the primary, he would pivot more to the center and could have a decent chance at the Senate seat coming as a moderate, as we just discussed a few minutes ago. Serrano Glassner has that bit of-- She has the Trump thing going for her in the primary, so it'll be interesting to see who wins. This is the first vote since the Trump verdict, the guilty verdict, in the New York trial. There are, I think, four primaries today around the country. New Jersey is one of them.

It'll just be really interesting if we can divine what was the impact of that verdict on the Republican primary today. It'll be interesting to look at and try to figure it out.

Brigid Bergin: Absolutely. Let's go to some of our callers. We are running towards the end of this segment, so I want to invite people to tell us who they voted for, in what race, and a quick explanation of why so we can get as many listeners who have called in a chance to share how they are participating in today's big primary. As a reminder, this is the informal, unofficial, thoroughly unscientific exit poll, but we need to keep it fast so we can get all of these callers in. Let's start with Serene in Princeton, New Jersey. Serena, thanks for calling.

Serena: Oh, thank you very much for having me. I voted uncommitted. Justice for Palestine. As a Palestinian American, I've been voting in the election as a Democrat for the past 34 years. I think the first time I voted was Bill Clinton. With the Joe Biden administration, with the genocide happening to my people with my tax money, I feel like no way I will give Joe Biden my vote this election. [crosstalk]

Brigid Bergin: Serena, who else did you vote for down-ballot?

Serena: I voted for Larry Hamm because, Andy Kim, I went to meet him in Princeton, he was here for a fundraising and refused to see me and even come out to talk to me, so I will never give him my vote. History will judge these people who were silent against what's going on in Palestine. I voted for Larry Hamm. He came in, spoke with us as a Palestinian community in Princeton, and I vote for Bonnie Watson for the same reason.

Brigid Bergin: Okay. Serena, I'm going to jump in and go to another caller. I will note that we are getting text messages and other folks who are calling in who have different views on the war in Gaza and who object to some of the language that people have used. I just acknowledge that for our listeners, that we hear you and we see you, but we are also an open forum, and this is a community on the air, so we welcome people to tell us how they voted and why. That was the call-out for today. Let's go to Peter in Jersey City. Peter, who did you vote for and why?

Peter: Hi. I voted for Bhalla because when I came here to JC Heights in 2004, we had a great congressman, Steve Bauman. We lost a seat in 2010. They threw him under the bus. For 10 years, I never heard a peep out of someone called Albio Sires, who seems to have been my congressman. Then I have never heard anything from Rob Menendez, except the first mailing of this election was the most [unintelligible 00:36:15] attack on Bhalla. That immediately decided me who to vote for. Since then, I have a really terrible attack on Menendez by something called America's Promise PAC. I wonder if Nancy knows who pays for these anti-Menendez mailings.

Brigid Bergin: Peter, thanks for your call. Nancy?

Nancy Solomon: Yes, I believe that is coming from the Bhalla campaign.

Brigid Bergin: Okay, let's go to Laura in Warren, New Jersey. Laura, thanks so much for calling.

Laura: Oh, hi. Thank you. I'm an independent, so I'm able to vote in either primary. This year, I chose to vote in the Republican. I wrote in Nikki Haley because I wanted there to be hopefully some push for that. I'm very anti-Trump. I also voted for my congressman, Tom Kean, who I told him I would vote for him in the primary if he voted for Ukrainian aid, which he did, with a minority of Republicans. Maybe it took some courage to do that.

Brigid Bergin: Laura, thanks for your call. Nancy, I just want to go to you. Just to clarify, here in New York, we have closed primaries. What is the rule for New Jersey's primary?

Nancy Solomon: Unaffiliated voters can show up at the polling place and basically sign up to vote in one party's primary or the other. I can't remember whether that means then are you a member of the party? Does that last beyond election day? I can't remember, but I know that that is the process. Just turn up at your poll and ask for the paper to sign for whichever party primary you want to vote in, and you can vote.

Brigid Bergin: That's great. Well, I think we are going to have to leave it there for now. My guest has been WNYC's Nancy Solomon, the guru of Garden State politics. This has been another installment of The Brian Lehrer Show's unofficial, informal, thoroughly unscientific exit poll. Lots of different views out there. We welcome them and we appreciate those who have called and text. Nancy, I suspect you're going to have a long day, but I know that we'll have results and analysis here on air and online at gothamist.com tomorrow. Until then, thanks, Nancy. Good luck today.

Nancy Solomon: Thanks. Thanks for having me.

 

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