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Matt Katz: It's the Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. Welcome back, everybody. I'm Matt Katz, reporter in the WNYC Gothamist Newsroom filling in for Brian today. We'll end with a few takes on New York City etiquette. My guest is Nick Leighton, who hosts the aply-named podcast, Were You Raised By Wolves? He has a recent peace in Gothamist called, 10 Etiquette Rules to Not Be the Worst in New York City. Among his advice, be ready when you get to the cashier. If you're not ready to order, let the person behind you go next. "Etiquette starts," wrote Nick, "with the simple acknowledgment that other people exist. Hi Nick, welcome to WNYC.

Nick Leighton: Thanks so much for having me. This is a treat.

Matt Katz: Listeners, what are your New York City etiquette rules or your questions about how to be conscientious in this big city? 212-433-WNYC, 212-433-9692. Nick, by way of introduction here, what is your particular interest in etiquette and manners? Why are you so interested?

Nick Leighton: Oh, golly. I mean, for me, I don't want to be wrong, and so I want to know what the right thing to do is in all situations. I definitely pay a lot of attention to what that might be wherever I am in the world. Certainly in New York City, we have some specific things that we do here.

Matt Katz: Yes, very much so. For example the sidewalks.

Nick Leighton: For sure.

Matt Katz: Your first rule is treat the sidewalk like a highway. Can you explain what you mean?

Nick Leighton: Yes. I mean, if you wouldn't do it on a highway, don't do it on our sidewalks. If you're driving on the road, you don't just stop in the fast lane. You don't exit a highway across traffic without signaling. You don't stop on the off-ramp. If you wouldn't do it on a highway, you shouldn't be doing it here. This is definitely maddening for a lot of New Yorkers when we're just sort of blocked.

Matt Katz: It also applies, I imagine, to crowded stairs on the subway because I, last-

Nick Leighton: Oh, for sure.

Matt Katz: -week, got passed twice on the subway stairs even though there was really no room to pass. There was people in front of me anyway. It didn't make any difference. Why did these two women pass me on the subway stairwell when they didn't have to? They should have treated it like a highway.

Nick Leighton: Once we start asking the question like, why are people doing this, I mean, that's a rabbit hole. In New York, there are a couple different flavors of etiquette crimes, but the category that is the worst are anything that has to do with wasting our time. Slowing me down on the sidewalk, you're wasting my time. Not letting me off the subway first before you get on, that wastes my time. Stopping right at the top of those subway stairs, you slow me down. Anytime you're wasting Yorkers' time, that is the probably highest etiquette crime in town.

Matt Katz: Then we're packed together that some of the things are just based on how you have to behave if you're so close to other people. One of your tips is a Broadway theater is not your living room. What are the do's and don'ts when you're out and about on Broadway?

Nick Leighton: Well, you're not at home and so you have to realize you're not in your living room. Other people can see and hear you, including the people on stage. If you're on your phone, everybody can see this, including Patti LuPone, and we all know we don't want to make Patti angry. The creaky bag of chips, talking to somebody throughout the show, all of this, you could do it if you're home. Once you leave the house, yes, some etiquette rules apply.

Matt Katz: I have a confession. Sometimes at the theater, know it's dark, I will kick off my shoes. Nobody can see it. I'm wearing socks.

Nick Leighton: That's not the point. We have work to do. I have a podcast I think you should listen to. No, what are you doing? You're taking off your shoes?

Matt Katz: [laughs] I want to get a little bit more comfortable. I'll put them back on-

Nick Leighton: Yes, that's not--

Matt Katz: -when it's time to go. I showered. It doesn't smell. You think it's still not appropriate?

Nick Leighton: It's not. Don't do that. No, please don't. I mean, at least we keep our socks on. Please tell me you keep the socks on. Do you keep socks on?

Matt Katz: Of course, I keep the socks on.

Nick Leighton: Oh, you say of course.

Matt Katz: I keep the socks on.

Nick Leighton: Oh, okay. That's [unintelligible 00:04:24].

Matt Katz: Yes, definitely. I'm not crazy. I'm not out of control.

Nick Leighton: I'm only one man. There's only so much I can do, but I would rather you keep your shoes on. Maybe let's switch to a more comfortable shoe that you are more comfortable keeping on during the show.

Matt Katz: Then I won't [crosstalk]--

Nick Leighton: I'm not going to negotiate.

[laughter]

Matt Katz: Listeners, you can find Nick Leighton's piece, 10 Etiquette Rules to Not Be the Worst in New York City. It's on gothamist.com. What are your pieces of New York City etiquette? 212-433-WNYC, 212-433-9692. We have to talk about the sub. I'm going to go to the callers, but I have to talk about the subway. I mean the subways is a free for all. There [chuckles] does not necessarily seem to be much rules in terms of etiquette. My biggest thing is everybody getting on before everybody gets off. What are some of the other big subway [crosstalk]?

Nick Leighton: Yes. That's just physics. That's not even an etiquette. It's just two objects cannot occupy the same place at the same time. That's just electromagnetism. Yes, that's a big one.

Matt Katz: Looks like we might have lost Nick, but we'll try to get him back. In the meantime, let's go to the phone lines. Hey, Phil in Williamsburg. Hi, Phil.

Phil: Hey, good afternoon-- well, good morning. Just almost good afternoon. How are you?

Matt Katz: Yes, doing great. Thanks so much for calling in. We lost our guest, but we're trying to get him back in a moment. Tell me what you were calling about.

Phil: Well, I want to pick up with what he said about stopping at the top of subway stairs. I live in Williamsburg, right in the heart of the so hip it hurts central nervous system of Kent Avenue and near the Smorgasburg. I just have to say what happens here regularly on weekends is we have a deluge of tourists and visitors that come into the neighborhood and they're just lollygag on the sidewalks. They're mulling around, checking their phones, clogging up the sidewalks, and there's people in the neighborhood that are trying to get stuff done and go places.

Yiu constantly have to tell people, "Please move over to the right. Please move over to the right. Please move out of the way." They're very just almost oblivious to the fact that people need to use those sidewalks to get places and to get things done.

Matt Katz: Yes, I know exactly what you're talking about. There is a particular pace to the city, Nick. We got your back, right Nick?

Nick Leighton: Yes. We want to step lightly, I think is the term. I think the caller brings over a great point, which is this is not being done nefariously. Rare is the person that is setting out to be rude. This is just I'm not being mindful of the people around me. These tourists, they're having a great time and they're just not mindful that, oh, there are other people trying to run errands and I am blocking the sidewalk and by admiring the architecture.

Matt Katz: Are you supposed to tell them?

Nick Leighton: Oh, a lot of New Yorkers would. What do you say? Can you tell tourists to get out of my way in a polite way? Maybe. You could say, "Excuse me, can I pass?" If you could land that in a very non-judgmental way, then that's allowed. Not everybody can land that.

Matt Katz: Joanne in Brooklyn. Hi, Joanne.

Joanne: I'm handling money and the first one- I have two- is when you are behind someone at the cashier's line at the grocery store and the person in front of you is done, person, please, please move up and deal with your bills and coins and credit cards at the end of that conveyor about so I can step up. [chuckles] It's like, "Come on. I don't have time."

The second one, and this really gets to me now because it's small, but really has an impact, when cashiers, say at a dollar store, hand over coins and bills, some of them will put the bill on your palm and then put the coins on top of the bill, which leaves you with a balancing act. That is, how to get those coins into my other hand, which is holding my wallet, and then fold up that bill with just one hand and then get everything back in the wallet-- Put the coins in the palm, put the bills between the fingers. It's great. I really appreciate those cashiers who know that trick.

Matt Katz: Thank you very much, Joanne. I appreciate it. Let's try to get one more in here. Tim in Greenwich Village. Hi, Tim. What's your etiquette demand?

Tim: Oh, hi. My etiquette pet peeve, I would love there to just be an acknowledgment that, generally speaking, people sleep at night and there is a noise code. My example is that two nights ago, a bunch of young men who lived down the block from us spilled out into their backyard at 4:30 in the morning. Obviously, they had just come home from a night out and they decided to share whatever they were talking about with every person within earshot, which is hundreds of people. I'm really sick and tired of the "it's New York" excuse.

Matt Katz: Yes. Nick, noise. We got about a minute left. Noise etiquette. Tell us.

Nick Leighton: Well, anything that I think makes you sleep-deprived is a particularly heinous etiquette crime. I feel you there for sure. It is just knowledge other people exist, which includes at 4:00 AM.

Matt Katz: If you go with that framing, other people exist, then you're going to be okay in New York City in terms of following the rules of etiquette?

Nick Leighton: You're going to be on the path. I don't know if you're going to be okay, but you're going to be in the right direction.

Matt Katz: I have to keep my shoes on at the shows-

Nick Leighton: Please.

Matt Katz: -I guess.

Nick Leighton: We're going to talk about this later.

Matt Katz: [laughs] Nick Leighton, journalist and host of the podcast, Were You Raised By Wolves? His piece in Gothamist, 10 Etiquette Rules to Not be the Worst in New York City. Nick, thank you so very much. I appreciate you coming on.

Nick Leighton: Thank you so much. I really enjoyed it.

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