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Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer on WNYC. The 79th session of the UN General Assembly has been in New York this week. As world leaders met in New York City, they spoke about at least three humanitarian crises in the world involving war and displacement. Not sure they made any progress on those things. We'll hear what our guest thinks. Joining us now to debrief the UN General Assembly with an eye on the humanitarian crises in Gaza, in South Sudan, and in Ukraine is the CEO of Oxfam America, Abby Maxman. Abby, welcome back to WNYC. Thank you for joining us.

Abby Maxman: Thanks so much, Brian. Great to be here.

Brian Lehrer: Well, start with Ukraine. You recently traveled, I see, throughout Ukraine to meet with Oxfam's partners there. What did you see while you were there? How would you describe the humanitarian situation? We spent so much time talking about the politics of the war, Zelenskyy and Putin and Trump and Biden, and all of that.

Abby Maxman: Yes. Well, what I saw was immense devastation throughout the country, homes destroyed without roofs, windows, abandoned villages. While I was there, I experienced what all Ukrainians experience every day, frequent air alarms through the night, power cuts, so being wakened with incoming drones and missiles, warnings so that people could try to seek safety and shelter. The scenes really offered me a glimpse of what Ukrainians have endured for two and a half years. I also saw incredible resilience and strength of the more than 40 partners we work with serving marginalized communities who really need all the support that they can get and that we offer.

Brian Lehrer: Here's a clip of Ukrainian President Zelenskyy at the General Assembly on Wednesday, talking about conditions on the ground in his country. Here's part of what he had to say about what's going on and attributing it to Putin.

Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelenskyy: One of his methods is targeting our energy infrastructure. These are deliberate Russian attacks on our power plants and the entire energy grid. As of today, Russia has destroyed all our thermal power plants and a large part of our hydroelectric capacity. This is how Putin is preparing for winter, hoping to torment millions, millions of Ukrainians.

Brian Lehrer: Again, because you were just there, Abby, can you reflect a bit on the energy crisis that Ukrainians are currently facing and the implications for their lives, even their safety?

Abby Maxman: Well, indeed. The points about the suffering, physical, emotional suffering, is enormous. They are living under, again, two and a half years and counting of a terrible war. The needs arising from Russia's invasion and subsequent occupation are immense. We spoke with a number of people who have suffered. Their family members are on the front line. People have lost their husbands and brothers and sons in war.

The challenges are just immense. They're persisting. So much attention is being paid to people who have fled their homes and people who are continuing to serve on the front line. We all need to widen our focus and think about all the communities and groups being left behind. Roma communities, LGBTQIA+ communities, and women's rights organizations who we work with are doing incredible work because there is so much need. The energy crisis is huge. As we go into winter, it will be terrible.

The suffering is just hard. The resilience is impressive, but it's a terrible war and a terrible crisis. The amount of aid that is needed is enormous. As you know and you already mentioned, there's multiple crises in the world. We're living through a time of polycrisis. The world needs to really step up and continue and maintain the support for the humanitarian response and our partners and organizations like ours supporting them in Ukraine and elsewhere.

Brian Lehrer: My guest is Abby Maxman, the CEO of Oxfam America. Oxfam, the relief and general anti-global poverty organization. Interesting to me and I'm not sure it got so much attention, Zelenskyy, also in the speech, lambasted the UN itself as unable to resolve wars due to what he described as Russia's ability to veto measures against it at the Security Council. Russia does have a veto at the Security Council as does the United States.

I see Oxfam recently put out a statement saying, "Real reform should start with dismantling the outdated power structures of the UN, especially its Security Council. The decades-old UN charter needs a full overhaul to better reflect today's world and challenges." What would that look like, according to you, and how would that help in a situation where there is a war going on, whether Russia has veto power at the UN or not?

Abby Maxman: Well, we do call for reforms. We see that the structure that's designed to protect people, peace, and security is not doing that sufficiently. We have been calling for sweeping reform at the UN and all of our global systems to make sure they're fit for the moment and the future. We need to make sure that they are addressing the extreme needs, the conflicts underway, climate justice, humanitarian crises, and so much more.

Things like reforms at the UN Security Council and the veto power where the P5, who have the ability to-- they've set the rules for the whole world. When it applies for some of them, they don't deliver. We need a UN that is working for people, for peace, for security, for human rights, and for our common humanity. Oxfam has a range of recommendations. We certainly have experience. As we are an organization that responds to humanitarian suffering and humanitarian realities on the ground, we also want to address root causes.

The UN continues to be the best mechanism we have to address the challenges we face together. Without reform, it really doesn't seem able to deliver on its mandate fully. We see a real opportunity to make changes so that the voices of all the member states and nations can help ensure that the crisis of our times can be addressed on the ground, both addressing the immediate needs, but also looking at the diplomatic solutions that are needed now more than ever.

Brian Lehrer: Power at the UN was really divvied up among the old Cold War powers. We're living in a different world today. Moving on to the Middle East. President Biden addressed the General Assembly as president of the United States for the last time. He warned of a larger regional war in the Middle East. Here's 40 seconds of Biden on Wednesday.

US President Joe Biden: Since October 7, we've also been determined to prevent a wider war that engulfs the entire region. Hezbollah, unprovoked, joined the October 7th attack, launching rockets into Israel. Almost a year later, too many on each side of the Israeli-Lebanon border remained displaced. A full-scale war is not in anyone's interest. Even if the situation has escalated, a diplomatic solution is still possible. In fact, it remains the only path to lasting security to allow the residents from both countries to return to their homes on the border safely.

Brian Lehrer: Like with Ukraine, while the leaders talk mostly about the war itself and the warring parties and right and wrong, there's the humanitarian crisis on the ground. Oxfam, I see, is on the ground in Lebanon. What are the greatest needs at this time? How would you describe the situation in those terms?

Abby Maxman: Well, what we were hoping to hear from President Biden, above all, was how he will use his power to end the atrocities ongoing in Gaza and now what we're seeing in Lebanon. The situation is terrible in both places as we know. Oxfam has a longstanding presence in Lebanon and we are responding to the escalating crisis. We're providing essential support to hundreds of thousands of people who have been forced to flee as these airstrikes have been bombarding their homes and communities.

It's been a few years since I was in the Beqaa Valley, but I think of today, the people who I met with several years ago and the influx of internally displaced people, primarily from Southern Lebanon, which is already showing signs to create more disastrous conditions for local communities there as we're witnessing destruction in Gaza as well. It's an overloaded international humanitarian system and the needs need to be met. We and our partners are supporting internally displaced people in shelters in Beirut, in Mount Lebanon, and North Lebanon with the basics that they need.

Clean water and sanitation, emergency access to cash and food, and hygiene and menstrual hygiene kits. These are all fundamentals to living through times of war, but there's so much at stake in times of war. What I know and hear from our colleagues is it's emotionally terrifying and exhausting. This country, Lebanon, and our colleagues in Gaza and the West Bank can ill afford to deal with this crisis, the bombardment, on top of the existing crisis they are facing in Lebanon with already a large displaced population.

One thing we know, Brian, the conflict was both predictable and avoidable. For decades, the people of Lebanon have endured crisis after crisis without getting the opportunity to fully recover. This protracted emergency is only going to be deepening. We're already seeing that already. I'm hearing from my staff there, they're gearing up. We're doing everything we can, but we know that this needs to stop. The best way to save lives and alleviate more suffering is a ceasefire across the region. No more civilians should die in Lebanon, Israel, or Gaza.

Brian Lehrer: That, of course, becomes the entry into the political conversation, which is not for this segment as who's really the bigger obstacle to the ceasefire and how do they get there. That's for another day. The third humanitarian crisis, and this one really doesn't get enough attention in the United States, pertains to Sudan. It's been 17 months of a brutal civil war there, which has devastated much of the country.

The nation's army is battling its bitter rival, the paramilitary Rapid Support Forces. Since then, local armed groups and neighboring countries' armies have been drawn into the conflict. The UN reports that over 10 million people have been displaced. Can you tell our listeners, if they haven't been following the Sudan situation, about the work that Oxfam is involved in in South Sudan and what you're seeing there?

Abby Maxman: Yes, absolutely. It's really so important, Brian, that you're shining the light on this crisis. It's one of the largest humanitarian crises in the world by far, and yet it's getting no attention. We are gravely concerned by this crisis unfolding in Sudan. All of us are watching with horror and doing our best to serve affected populations. Last month, famine was declared in an internally displaced person's camp in North Darfur.

It barely seemed to register for many. It's not even catching any headlines. What this really highlights is a catastrophic failure in the international community to act swiftly to end this gruesome war and scale up efforts. Now, for us, we're working to support those affected by the crisis. We've been working in South Sudan for over 30 years. We have a strong and established team working across 10 bases around the country, providing essential services and help just to keep people alive.

What people have endured, unspeakable acts of violence, suffering, absence of food. We know that starvation is imminent. These calls about famine are serious and the scale is enormous. We're supporting over 500,000 people with humanitarian assistance, clean water, hygiene facilities, food, fuel, and income support, anything needed to help people survive day by day, but the suffering is immense.

We're just trying to help people get back on their feet in a day-by-day basis at the moment while also, we hope, we're imploring all in the diplomatic community to bring an end to this crisis because children are suffering and dying. We need to be able to address this issue head-on. We know that sexual violence is underreported and it's often used as a weapon of war.

Gender-based violence, it's horrific. It's a reality. It's rife and often used in crises like these. We also work to support women directly in addressing their immediate medical needs, legal advice, safe spaces. We provide women who often are either now women-headed households, single-headed households, taking in orphans from family members, or even strangers.

They need support, access to everything. Above all, we need a political solution. Going back to what's happening in New York this week with the UN General Assembly and where you started in this conversation, Brian, we need a strong, robust United Nations that addresses peace and security for the poor and marginalized communities who are continuing to bear the brunt of political failures.

Brian Lehrer: Let's end with a little bit more on that to bring it full circle. How effective is the UN in your view in 2024 at dealing with these humanitarian crises that are born of war in the three cases that we've been talking about? If they can't settle the wars through ceasefires and other political means in the Security Council, do they at least have the means to support groups like yours? I know the UN has its own relief agencies, but to at least make life as palatable as possible while the warriors keep conducting war.

Abby Maxman: I'm glad you're highlighting that, Brian. We've seen the UN-wide appeals tripling over the past 10 years. The needs are outstripping resources. Donors have met less than half of the amounts needed in the last year. They need to step up. Donor countries have to make sure we can address basic needs without taking away from peace and security and development because then we're just pushing more suffering down the road. It costs so much more in human lives and costs to delay.

We, as Oxfam, have extensive research and reports. We can see what's about to come. We talk about anticipatory action, helping us invest in protecting people, lives, and livelihoods. The member states need to step up. As we started out, how are they doing? We're not meeting the basic needs in terms of the financial needed to get as local as possible. As you mentioned, UN agencies, but also non-governmental organizations and local leadership and local organizations who are always the first to respond.

We need to increase what we bring to them, to women-led organizations who are always, always at the front lines. I'm really proud of our work in Ukraine and other places where we are stepping up to make sure local partners' capacities is amongst our priorities and making sure they're getting resources and support to deliver on their mandates and to respond at scale to the humanitarian suffering.

As we talked about earlier in this discussion, Brian, this fundamental inequality in the UN Security Council has undermined the efforts for global peace and security with these five countries, this so-called P5, who hold this veto power over the will of 190 member states. We need to make sure, use our voices to say, "We need a change." One million people have died in 23 of the worst conflicts over the past decade.

The number of people in need has more than doubled to 230 million. It's too many. It's too much. It's dragged on for too long. We, as a community, are ready. We're on the ground. We are responding. We need the global community to support these efforts, both at the diplomatic level. To enable, we all get the resources down to our local organizations and partners so that we can be responding to the needs in real-time.

Brian Lehrer: Abby Maxman is president and CEO of Oxfam America. Thank you so much for coming on.

Abby Maxman: Thank you, Brian.

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