[music]

Alison Stewart: We are continuing our series, Mental Health Mondays, with a conversation about a string of student suicides at a rigorous private university in New England. We recognize that this can be a difficult conversation, so please listen with care. If you or anyone you know needs help, the 988 Suicide and Crisis Lifeline is available 24/7. You just dial 988 to speak with someone 24 hours a day. Now to our story.

The first death by suicide at Worcester Polytechnic Institute occurred in July 2021 before classes started. University administrators sent out an email, including resources for support, but then in September, a second student died a week before classes began, and then a third before the month ended, and within six months, seven students who were a part of the Worcester Polytechnic campus community died.

The school's actions were both praised and questioned. New York Times Contributing Writer Jordan Kisner reported on how professors and administrators took on the unofficial role of counselors during that time. Her piece is called The Unthinkable Mental Health Crisis That Shook a New England College. She joins us now. Jordan, welcome to the show.

Jordan Kisner: Thank you for having me.

Alison Stewart: Listeners, we hope that you can join us in this conversation. We know colleges and their students are facing huge issues right now. For example, at North Carolina State University, they saw a similar cluster of seven suicides last academic year, two within 24 hours of each other. Four students this academic year at the University of Wisconsin-River Falls took their lives.

Are you a current student or alumni of Worcester Polytechnic Institute? We'd like to hear from you. We'd also like to hear from any college students, faculty, or parents about what they expect from a school when it comes to mental health support for students. What resources do you think campuses should offer students? What should the role of educators be in these times? Our phone lines are open. 212-433-9692, 212-433-WNYC, you can join us on air or you can text us at that number. You can also send us a DM on Instagram if you'd like to remain anonymous. That handle is @AllOfItWNYC.

Let's talk about the profile of this school before, let's lay some groundwork, before we get started with this conversation. What is the profile, who goes there, what's the reputation for student life?

Jordan Kisner: Sure. Worcester Polytechnic Institute is a relatively small college and university with a STEM focus. It is in Worcester, Massachusetts. It has a classic New Englandy feel to it. The vast majority of students who go there are going to be studying something like robotics, engineering, various aspects of the sciences. They pride themselves on project-based learning.

The students take an accelerated course load. Instead of doing two semesters for the year, they do four quarters, and in each quarter, the students take three classes. They wind up taking more classes per year than maybe your average college student. A lot of that work culminates in these real-world projects, like helping to figure out how to make recommendations for water efficiency in Panama, for example. It's a school that's known for its rigor, its intensity, and its real-world application of the sciences.

Alison Stewart: What is it like in terms of social life?

Jordan Kisner: I think that all campuses are in a period of flux when it comes to what the social life is like because we've had a very abnormal few years in terms of college and university campuses in this country. When I visited WPI in the fall of last year, last September, it looked very much like a normal college campus. People were playing frisbees, the student center was very full.

That being said, that campus has a reputation for being very, very academically focused and maybe not as socially focused. A lot of the students spend almost all of their time working on their classes and their schoolwork, and I have heard feedback from current and former students that it's maybe not the school where you go to have the most free time for socializing.

Alison Stewart: Prior to this cluster of student deaths and the subsequent changes, what had been Worcester Polytechnic's approach to student mental health?

Jordan Kisner: Something that felt really important for the shaping and framing of this story was that, actually, Worcester Polytechnic Institute had a really robust mental health and wellness protocol, instead of programs, prior to this crisis. For a long time, they have been on the vanguard of figuring out how to help students through their mental health challenges. They developed courses and programs that they shared with other universities. This is not a school that was caught with no plan in place. This was a school that was doing industry best practices when it came to this issue. When this crisis arose, it really made clear or suggested that industry best practices were no longer enough.

Alison Stewart: July 2021, a year and a few months since the pandemic started, a undergraduate student took their life. Could you tell us a little bit about the student?

Jordan Kisner: The student who died in July was a-- the truth is I want to be very careful talking about this student for the sake of their privacy and their family's privacy.

Alison Stewart: Of course.

Jordan Kisner: This was a senior and an immigrant student. Not very much has been shared about this student and their life, and I want to leave it that way, but they were the first of seven to die that year, and it came over the summer. It was something that happened while classes were not in session and not very many people were on campus.

Alison Stewart: As you were doing your reporting, what you feel comfortable sharing, what did professors, friends, acquaintances say about the student? Were there any signs that the student had any issues, if there were any difficulties?

Jordan Kisner: Something that I learned from the professors, and faculty, and staff that I spoke to at WPI was that, actually, none of the students who took their lives that year were exhibiting what had been thought to be the warning signs. I talked to one professor, Steve Kmiotek, who said, "I knew that I was supposed to look for students who stopped showing up to class, or whose grades dropped, or who suddenly seemed really tired, or disheveled. The various clear warning signs. The truth was that almost none of these students fit that profile."

Several were very socially well-connected, were doing extremely well in their classes, did not give off any reason for concern, and did not seek help or give anyone any indication of what they might have been going through. I know that was really notable and alarming for the faculty.

Alison Stewart: When this first student died by suicide, how did the university respond? How did they notify other students? What was the protocol?

Jordan Kisner: Charlie Morse, who's the Dean of Student Wellness at WPI and has been with that school for a long, long time, many years, heading their counseling center, he still sees students as patients, he explained to me that there is a really narrow tightrope that schools need to walk when they are managing the announcement of a death by suicide. They, of course, owe their community information, they owe them sympathy and resources for healing, but also there is a really good data to suggest that broadcasting too much information about a death by suicide can encourage contagion.

There are a lot of complicated reasons for that that I won't go into here. The school chose to notify the campus community by email and direct them towards the counseling center and other resources that are available on campus for anyone who might be struggling. That notification system was pretty consistent throughout the year.

Alison Stewart: My guest is Jordan Kisner. She wrote a piece for The New York Times called the Unthinkable Mental Health Crisis That Shook a New England College. We're talking about a cluster of deaths by suicide that happened at Worcester Polytechnic Institute within the course of an academic year.

Listeners, if you would like to join this conversation, you can share a story, perhaps a personal story. We are interested in talking to anybody, student, faculty, or parent. We would love to know what you think the university's role should be in terms of student mental health at the collegiate level. If you've experienced any mental health crisis, how did you deal with it when you were at school? What support do you think campuses should offer college students? You can call in and join us on air 212-433-9692, 212-433-WNYC. You may join us on air if you call in, you can also text that number. If you'd like to send us a DM and remain anonymous, that's available to you as well. That handle is @AllOfItWNYC.

The number of suicides at WPI fall under what the CDC calls a point cluster or spatial temporal cluster, which means, and I'm quoting this from the CDC website, "A greater than expected number of suicides that occur within a time period in a specific location. This might be in a community or an institution such as a school, university, or psychiatric inpatient setting." When did the administrators at WPI realize that they might have this sense of a cluster on their hands?

Jordan Kisner: I think that one of the things that was so painful about this time at WPI, which I heard from the people I spoke to there, was the sense of uncertainty. You have one student death, that's a terrible tragedy, a second, and then there begins to be a little bit of anxiety about a cluster, a third, and then I think another level of urgency begins to kick in in terms of response. Then from there, there's just this lingering question of how many more, of when is it over.

Alison Stewart: How did classes proceed that first semester, given the information that a student had died over the summer, and then by the end of the first month, another, I think it was three by the fall semester?

Jordan Kisner: It was more than three by the end of the first semester by the end of the fall. Two students died before classes began and a third died before the end of September. Classes proceeded more or less normally. Of course, they were modified in a few ways because the pandemic was still ongoing, but it's really important I learned from Charlie Morse and other folks there, to continue normally as much as possible, to continue a normal educational experience for all kinds of reasons, but also, it helps to minimize contagion and ensure the ongoing health of remaining students. Again, walking that balance between supporting students who are understandably struggling with what's going on in their community and continuing to help them pursue their education.

Alison Stewart: We get a text that says, "I'm faculty at an R1 with a liberal arts college field. We are encouraged to submit anonymous concern forms about students to the Office of Undergrad Education, but students tell me that it's extremely difficult to get an appointment with mental health providers. They report months-long waits for appointments and no follow-up. The uni touts its care and facilities for students, but it seems to only go so far as reporting rather than long-term care."

Jordan Kisner: This is an extremely common report that I heard. I did, of course, a bunch of on-the-ground reporting at Worcester Polytech Institute, but I also interviewed faculty and staff from universities and colleges all over the country, and I can't tell you how many times I heard that exact concern. In general, these institutions have more requests for help for mental health care than they have mental health staff that can support it. It's an ongoing financial structural problem at many institutions.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Caitlyn, who is calling in from Harlem. Caitlyn, thank you so much for calling in. You are on the air.

Caitlyn: Thank you. Thank you for this topic. I was a student with mental health challenges. In school, I went to Fordham about 10 years ago, and there was a counseling center. There were all of these nominally mental health resources available. I wasn't able to almost intake their help until-- what helped me the most was talking with the deans, and shout out to William Gould if he's listening because he incredibly helped me so much because he'd looked at my schedule and helped me to adjust. It was like addressing the cause of the pressure, and so we withdrew some courses. He actually even said like, "Okay, these professors are going to be more understanding and kind than those professors."

It was a really tailored way to approach my schedule and then make room for the other mental health services. Once the pressure was removed, not removed, but alleviated, I was able to actually use the self-care suggestions that they were giving me at the mental health because, otherwise, it was just like an impossibility in my mind. It was the pairing of the academic, like the practical details that I was able to even work, and then he worked with also my professors and let them know behind the scenes. Also, shout out to Angela O'Donnell and Michael Lee. They really worked together to help me through my last year of school. That was all I wanted to share.

Alison Stewart: Caitlyn, thank you so much, and thank you for your candor and calling in. Jordan, that's part of your story and we'll get to-- well, we'll dive in right now talking about how the teachers and the educators became involved in trying to help the students. When you talk to educators, how did they feel about this, what they were being called to do?

Jordan Kisner: I think that the idea of wanting to take an interest in what they call whole student, the well-being and the health of your students is not new for many professors and teaching faculty. Certainly, I think I heard from educators all over the country when I was reporting this story, that the demand for interpersonal caregiving has gone up in the last five years, especially since the pandemic.

For many who even already felt comfortable stepping into this kind of relationship with their students, the demand and the intensity of that work grew so exponentially that it became a real-time drain and energy drain and a real source of worry. That being said, it is true, like Caitlyn just said, that for most students, it's not just that they need to maybe go talk to a counselor, it's that there's a slightly more holistic approach that could be taken with the help of a dean with the help of a peer, with the help of several of their professors, and most people I spoke to want to be able to be part of that process, right?

They don't just want to wash their hands of their students and say, "Let the counseling center deal with that." It is a lot of extra work often to really be dealing with, and not just one, but multiple, multiple students at a time who are needing different kinds of accommodations. That can be a little overwhelming and also isn't usually evenly distributed among the faculty. It's usually certain members of the faculty statistically who bear the brunt of that.

Alison Stewart: Right. You get into that in your piece for students of color and LGBTQIA students, they often seek out professors who have had similar experiences, and some of those professors really want to help but do feel overwhelmed.

Jordan Kisner: That's true. There is really firm data from The Healthy Minds Study, which does national surveying and has for many years now, national surveying on the state of mental health in post-secondary education. Their most recent survey had a section on the faculty experience, and what they found was that more junior faculty, female faculty, LQBTQ faculty, and faculty of color take on a disproportionately high amount of this emotional caretaking work for the students.

It's not only that students are seeking out professors who might share their life experience. It's that, in general, say, a younger female professor might be seen to a wide range of our students as more approachable for some reason. You can see that these faculty members who are already maybe structurally disadvantaged when it comes to demands on their time and tenure and pay equity are taking on a bunch of extra work for their students that isn't usually recognized within their departments, which creates further structural concerns for them.

Alison Stewart: We're discussing mental health challenges on college campuses with Jordan Kisner. She wrote a piece called The Unthinkable Mental Health Crisis that Shook a New England College at Worcester Polytechnic Institute. We've got several people on hold, including a parent of a student at WPI, a adolescent child psychologist, as well as someone who experienced their own mental health issues during college. Will get to all of those calls and have more with Jordan after a quick break. This is All Of It.

[music]

Alison Stewart: You are listening to All Of It on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. We're discussing mental health on college campuses. My guest is Jordan Kisner. She wrote a piece for The New York Times called The Unthinkable Mental Health Crisis that Shook a New England College discussing the seven deaths that happened at Worcester Polytechnic Institute. Six were deaths by suicide, one was a seizure, and how it impacted the college, the college campus, the students. Let's talk to Surya who's calling in, who is the parent of a student who goes to WPI. Hi, Surya. Thank you so much for calling in.

Surya: Hi. Thank you for taking my call, and I love your show and I love the article.

Alison Stewart: I'm so glad you could call in. Would you share your experience as a parent and your son's experience and perhaps a bit of the conversations you've had?

Surya: Sure. My son is now a senior. He was a sophomore when all of this happened, and we were coming off of a year 2020-2021 with the pandemic and a lot of restrictions on campus, which we felt good about. The students were getting tested twice a week. They had tremendous amounts of different types of protocols if you tested positive or if you had a false positive or what have you.

There was a lot of, definitely a lot of social isolation, and not just at WPI, but I think across all these different campuses and its schools. When we started to hear about the suicide starting with the first one, we as parents were extremely worried, extremely concerned. What we love though is the transparency that came across from the school itself. The school held workshops and seminars for us as parents that we could join and ask questions.

The big takeaway that I learned is if you're concerned, ask your child, "Are you thinking about suicide?" If you ask that question, it doesn't mean that you're going to put that thought into your child's mind. It's more about hearing their reaction and making them feel that they're heard. We actually asked our son because we were just worried and concerned. He's a very social child, he is very extroverted, and there had been a lot of social isolation. He looked at us and he was like, "No." He's like, "What are you talking about?" We immediately felt so much relief.

We thought the workshops were great. Each time, unfortunately, and it was so tragic when we got the news via email, the school was very open about it. We felt so grateful that with COVID and with all of this, the WPI really stepped up and they were good in how they handled it.

Alison Stewart: Surya, thank you so much for calling in and for sharing your family's experience. Jordan, it's interesting in your piece, you write about how a task force was set up. There was a large amount of data collection. It was interesting to read. They really went at it with that project-based approach about what we can do, what the problem is, how we can handle it, which makes a lot of sense. Some people, though, wanted a little bit more, even though it was obviously university was doing a lot.

Jordan Kisner: Yes. There were students and parents who really felt like they wanted more information and more transparency. Then there were people in the community who felt like more immediate action was necessary, right? The task force was formed by the university president at the time, Laurie Leshin, who asked them to do this task force in two parts. The first was information gathering and making recommendations. Then a second implementation task force would put the recommendations in motion.

It took a number of weeks, maybe around two months, maybe a little bit less, for the first task force to do its work, to gather all the information and make recommendations. Six weeks to eight weeks might have felt a little bit too long for some members of the community before anything major was changed. Administration received a lot of criticism about that from within their community.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Sarah, calling in from New Jersey. Hi, Sarah. Thank you for calling in to share your experience. Sarah, are you there? Okay. Let's see if we can talk to Jennifer from South Orange, New Jersey, and maybe we'll get Sarah back in a moment. Jennifer, you're on the air.

Jennifer: Hi. I'm a child adolescent and young adult psychiatrist, so an MD psychiatrist. Most of my patients, they start with me as children and then they grow up and they go to college. Technically, once my patients leave the State of New Jersey, if somebody goes to college even in Pennsylvania or New York, I'm not technically licensed to be treating them. I feel like it's not that they're going to easily transition to another psychiatrist. Some of the kids are going to these very small liberal arts colleges in upstate New York, and who knows if there's even a psychiatrist in the town. It's just not feasible that people are transitioning to other psychiatrists.

Legally, I'm only supposed to treat people in the State of New Jersey. What do you do with a kid that you've treated for all these years that I know their psychiatric history? Certainly, if somebody wasn't stable, I would want another set of eyes on them, or maybe they wouldn't even go to college. It makes it for a very tricky situation versus my just doing telemedicine with them and then seeing them when they're home on vacations. Quite honestly, I look the other way, and that's how I run my practice. Most of the kids' therapists won't do that and the kids don't, or the young people don't want to start with a new therapist when they go to school.

Alison Stewart: Thank you for calling in, Jennifer. I've got a text, "I'm a therapist who works at a local university, and there needs to be a nuanced and collaborative approach by therapists, administrators, and faculty in helping students in crisis. The use of advocacy letters, incompletes, and extended time to complete assignments may be important components in helping students. Helping students to reach out to others, socialize and make friends is also very important." I think we got Sarah back. Hi, Sarah. Thanks for calling in.

Sarah: Yes, thank you for having me and talking about this important topic. When I was in college about 10 years ago, I was going through some mental health difficulties due to being undocumented and being a college student and facing those decisions that I had to make. One thing that really helped me was that I sought counseling through my school's health center and they put me through group therapy. Being in that environment, even though I was scared to really talk about my story, really helped me just talk through my issues and deal with me and enabled me to be more present in class and stop skipping class because I just didn't feel like going to school. In the end, it really helped me. Thank you.

Alison Stewart: Sarah, thank you for calling in. Jordan, as we start to wrap up this segment, one thing I did want to ask about is we've been talking about administrators, and students, and faculty. Where do parents factor into this conversation?

Jordan Kisner: I think that's a complicated question. People we're talking about, a lot of college students are legal adults, right?

Alison Stewart: Right.

Jordan Kisner: There is a certain amount of confidentiality that they are afforded and the collaborative work between a university, a student who might need help, and their family changes depending on really what the student is willing to do and what the university is available for and what the parents are available for.

I don't feel like I've done enough research or have the authority to say what the balance should be, but I know that that feels like one of the really live and unresolved questions right now. Parents are deeply concerned about their children who are students, universities are equally concerned, and yet there's not always a really clear line of where one caring entity and the other should hand off.

Alison Stewart: The name of the piece is The Unthinkable Mental Health Crisis That Shook a New England College. I've been speaking with its writer, Jordan Kisner. Thanks to everyone who called in and texted us, we really appreciate you contributing to the conversation. Jordan, thank you so much for sharing your reporting.

Jordan Kisner: Thank you, Alison.

Alison Stewart: Once again, if this has triggered anything for anyone, or if you ever feel in need and you need to speak with someone, you can call the Suicide and Crisis Lifeline number at 988 to speak with someone. It's available 24 hours a day.

Copyright © 2024 New York Public Radio. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use at www.wnyc.org for further information.

New York Public Radio transcripts are created on a rush deadline, often by contractors. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of New York Public Radio’s programming is the audio record.