Alison Stewart: This is All Of It, on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. All week long, we're going to talk about food and what this city has to offer. It's Summer Restaurant Week in the city and we're celebrating the places to find the best burgers, tacos, pizza. To kick things off, we are going big with the help of New York magazine. It has released a piece called The Best Food of 2025 (So Far). Food writers Matthew-- Say your last name, Matthew.

Matthew Schneier: Schneier.

Alison Stewart: Matthew Schneier, and Tammie--?

Tammie Teclemariam: Teclemariam.

Alison Stewart: Thank you. Will highlight the dishes that they can't stop thinking about, from a fancy roast bird to scones that disappear by noon to a bánh mì that breaks all the rules. Tammie and Matthew, welcome to the studio.

Tammie Teclemariam: Thank you.

Matthew Schneier: Thank you so much.

Alison Stewart: Listeners. We want to hear from you. What is the best thing you've eaten so far in 2025? A dish that you just cannot stop thinking about, a new spot that totally surprised you, whether it was a truck or a fancy restaurant, we want to hear about it. Sometimes it's the people who make a meal great, so maybe you had a great experience with a staffer, a server, or a chef. Tell us all about it.

Our phone lines are wide open. 212-433-9692. 212-433-WNYC. Call in. You can join us on air or you can reach out on social media, @allofitwnyc. What makes a Best Of list for 2025? What were you looking for, Tammie?

Tammie Teclemariam: For me, I based it a lot around the pieces that I worked on. Our highlight example that was photographed for this piece and that everybody really responded well to was the big stack of onion rings. They were the dosa onion rings, from The Onion Tree, which is an Indian pizza place in the East Village.

Alison Stewart: All right, tell me a little bit about these onion rings, which "puff up" like mini donuts.

Tammie Teclemariam: Correct. It's thick slices of red onion, so already, you're just getting just more earthiness, more onion presence. Then the dosa batter, because it's fermented rice, it has that tang along with the fried exterior that just makes it more than an onion ring, different from a dosa, and then these really nice chutneys alongside coconut, nice and savory, and a cilantro one.

Alison Stewart: It's served with chutney, I should say.

Tammie Teclemariam: Yes. Two chutneys on the side.

Alison Stewart: All right. What does that do to the taste of it all? Onion rings and chutney, that's kind of interesting.

Tammie Teclemariam: Well, with the dosa, you would definitely have chutney. With that kind of coating, it's not as greasy, so the flavor isn't as much of that crunchy grease, but you have the crunch, the thick pancakeness, and then just refreshing cilantro in one bite. Then, this really-- Really, the coconut chutney, it's-- I love it. It's just nice, savory, and thick. There might be Nigella seeds in there, but don't quote me on that.

Alison Stewart: That's One Tree Pizza Company, at 214--

Tammie Teclemariam: [crosstalk] Onion Tree.

Alison Stewart: Onion Tree. Excuse me. Onion Tree Pizza Company, 214, 1st Avenue. Oh, we went all the way down the rabbit hole. Let me get to you, Matthew. What has to be on your list to make it a Best Of for 2025?

Matthew Schneier: It just has to be something where, after I have the meal, I wake up still thinking about it. It's the thing I'm going back for. It's the thing I think, "My God, I could never make this at home," or, "I have to figure out how to make this at home," and ultimately completely flop. That's what keeps me going back to restaurants. There have been so many great dishes, and they're all across the spectrum. Some of the ones that I picked were these incredibly elaborate entrees. Roasted squab with cognac sauce and foie gras.

That's a huge undertaking, both to make and to eat. When you put that much effort into something, it's often going to be a real keeper. It could also be something as simple as the most vanilla, vanilla ice cream I think I've ever had, so vanilla and rich in vanilla beans that it was actually gray. It was almost unappealing, until you taste it, then you think, "My God, why isn't every vanilla ice cream gray?"

Alison Stewart: Tammie, have you noticed any food themes for this year? Food trends for this year?

Tammie Teclemariam: Goodness. Maybe colors. I feel like we're getting very primal with our foods. This wasn't on my Best Of list, but something that I recently wrote about for my viral foods column, and it is a-- They're called whips, and they're from this vegan bakery in Greenpoint, called Happy Zoe, and the most popular one. It blew up this summer. It's a rainbow whip, so each part of this smoothie, sort of, it's like airy banana, but kind of frozen.

They have to make them last minute, so they always get a long line of just young women all trying to get this drink so they can photograph themselves with it. It's also very healthy. There's no added sugar. It's just frozen fruit that they give this wonderful texture to, and because of that, it is $15 or so.

Alison Stewart: This is a little bit of a tangent. Has Instagram changed the way food is presented?

Tammie Teclemariam: TikTok has, and then Instagram gets whatever TikTok sees, three or five weeks later. [laughs] Yes.

Alison Stewart: What theme have you seen emerge this year?

Matthew Schneier: I think Tammie said it very well, and you did, too. I think we're seeing a lot of plating that is meant for the eye as much as for the mouth, the tongue, or whatever else we taste with, the nose. We're seeing people really understand that a lot of diners are going out not only to eat and be satiated, but also to have an experience and to share the experience. They're definitely-- these baroque, colorful, beautiful, towering. Someone served me a Jenga tower of potatoes recently.

I thought, "My God." The poor line cook in the kitchen who is painstakingly stacking and architecting this thing. Yes, we are certainly seeing a lot of interest in how things look and how they're presented.

Alison Stewart: Let's take a call. This is Craig, from Morganville, New Jersey. Hey, Craig, thanks for making the time to call All Of It.

Craig: Hey, guys. If you guys like ramen, there's a place called Tabata. Not Tabitha, Tabata. It's on 9th Avenue and 39th. They have-- It's a typical New York hole in the wall place. The best ramen and gyōza dumplings you will have. It's just great. It's a great New York place for tourists to get a real New York spot. It is cheap to boot. It's awesome.

Alison Stewart: How did you discover it, Craig? Oh, Craig's gone. He was like, "That's enough." Click. [laughs]

Tammie Teclemariam: It's his restaurant. [laughs]

Matthew Schneier: Well, that sounds great. We're always looking for places, I'm always looking for places in the theater district, which is not historically one of the best New York City dining neighborhoods. That's a great tip.

Alison Stewart: Listeners, we want to hear from you. What's the best thing you've eaten so far in 2025, a dish you cannot stop thinking about? Our phone number is 212-433-9692. 212-433-WNYC, or you can reach out on social media. It's @allofitwnyc. I'm going to try it this time. My guests are Tammie Teclemariam.

Tammie Teclemariam: Pretty good.

Alison Stewart: And Matthew Schneier.

Matthew Schneier: Close enough.

Alison Stewart: All right. They are the critics at Grub Street and the writers behind the feature The Best Food of 2025 (So Far). All right, let's go into bánh mì. It's usually a Vietnamese sandwich. It's a baguette, a little chicken, some pickled vegetables, usually. You zero it in on a bánh mì that starts with, first of all, the texture of the bread.

Tammie Teclemariam: Correct. At Bánh Anh Em. They had another restaurant uptown, on the Upper West Side, and they kind of built this restaurant to be able to zero in on making certain elements just completely from scratch, and bread was part of that. Yes, definitely, the stereotypical bánh mì on Uber eats is loaded with all of those elements, but I think bánh mì definitely has a wide range of things, that we don't get to see that often, in their most authentic form.

That's what Bánh Anh Em is bringing to this menu, with this very naked bánh mì, where it's just-- all you can really zero in on is just the excellence of the bread that they make there. Then also this pate, which is just-- it's not much to look at, but as with all great pates, it just does so much with just a secret of ingredients. [chuckles]

Alison Stewart: It's funny. You wrote, "Eating this was the first time I wanted a glass of red wine at a Vietnamese restaurant." What would you have paired with this bánh mì?

Tammie Teclemariam: At the restaurant at the time, they had an Austrian red. It was nice and light, and it really did hit the spot. Pate and red wine.

Alison Stewart: This is called Bánh Anh Em?

Tammie Teclemariam: Bánh Anh Em. I pronounce the Em, but I'm not an expert. [laughs]

Alison Stewart: [unintelligible 00:09:27] We're going to try it. Bánh Anh Em, at 99 3rd Avenue for the bánh mì. Michael, we are going to go to Jō, at 127 E 34th Street. It's another sandwich, only this is a mackerel sandwich.

Matthew Schneier: [chuckles] It is. I think mackerel is sometimes an under loved little fish. It's definitely on the oilier fishier side. There are the people that really love that. Then I think there are many other people who haven't been as exposed to it and are more hesitant about it. Jō is somehow a secret, still, despite being on this big thoroughfare in Manhattan. It is like a big silver door that's barely marked, but if you can get a reservation and get inside, it is a tasting menu.

Actually, tasting or a la carte menu that is sort of wondrous. It's a Japanese chef who, for many years, cooked only vegan Buddhist temple food,-

Alison Stewart: Oh, that's interesting.

Matthew Schneier: -at a restaurant called Kajitsu. It was beloved. It was Michelin starred. It closed. He went around for a few years and has come back with a fully omnivorous menu. He's doing unbelievable things with fermentations, with fish, with meat. He told me himself, "Kajitsu was fun, but I eat everything." The piece that really stood out for me, of the many I tried, was this delicious, really earthy grilled mackerel sandwich.

He grills it over charcoal in front of you. It gets crispy and smoky. It's oily, it's fatty. It's definitely a commitment, I would say. I don't necessarily know how good my breath was immediately afterwards, but while I was eating it, it was a real pleasure.

Alison Stewart: What goes with a side of mackerel?

Matthew Schneier: They have a tremendous sake menu there. They also were doing great things with wine. They actually have a really interesting wine pairing list. They were pouring a new to me grower champagne, that was really delicious, by a producer called Helene, which-- actually, they didn't even poured me. They poured the only other two people in the restaurant at the time. They were kind enough to share it with us. It just increased the feeling of feeling like you were in on a secret.

Alison Stewart: I got a text here that says, "Was the potato Jenga Tower at Somtum Der in the East Village? Saw that pass our table and our jaws dropped."

Matthew Schneier: I don't think it was there, although I know it's very unsatisfying that I don't remember where it was. Clearly, we are onto a trend. If we've got at least two, somebody can call in with a third, and then it will be confirmed.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Giselle, who's calling in from Jackson Heights. Hey, Giselle, you're on All Of It.

Giselle: Hi there. First time caller. Currently at an urgent care. I was listening to this on the radio and had to call in, because I needed to shout out this one restaurant called 969 Cafe. Jackson Heights has all sorts of great cuisines, like the Worldsboro, but this guy, he's such a character, but on top of that, he makes really great food. My go to is this shrimp sandwich and a tuna onigiri that's super well priced, perfectly seasoned rice. Really simple, but incredible.

I know it's a good day when I eat some of his food and have really great conversation with the guy. He's closed on Thursdays, and of course, that's when I'm craving it the most. Highly reccomend.

Alison Stewart: The big question is, are you at urgent care? Are you okay?

Giselle: Everything's fine. Got a little bit of allergic reaction. Not to the food that I got from 969 Cafe. [chuckles] Just fun allergies. I was like, "Hey, while I'm waiting, might as well call in and see if I get on the air," so yes, this is very exciting. [chuckles]

Alison Stewart: All right, well, we hope your day goes better.

Tammie Teclemariam: Gesundheit.

Matthew Schneier: Get well soon.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk about scones, Tammie. I'm so into scones. I've always been into scones. Mary's O Irish Soda Bread Shop at 93 1/2 E 7th Street.

Tammie Teclemariam: Yes.

Alison Stewart: I've seen these on the Instagram, on the TikTok. You write, "I think about these scones every day." What do you think about these scones?

Tammie Teclemariam: [laughs] The day that I tried them, it was also extremely cold. There was such a contrast between the steaming scone and just the cold air, it just woke me up. Even on a warm day, they bake them fresh throughout the day. [crosstalk]

Alison Stewart: They come out hot?

Tammie Teclemariam: They do. They come out hot, and then they're split down the middle, and there's just-- They put a really thick piece of salty butter in there, and then this blackberry jam that's barely a jam. If you have to imagine, the blackberry is still tasting fresh, but then just becoming saucy, and that, with the not fully melted butter and the hot scone, it's just-- One bite, and you just got to demolish it, and then make sure you get a six pack, and that way, you can keep them in the freezer, but you're on your own as far as jam is concerned.

Alison Stewart: Okay. Do I have to wait in a big dumb line?

Tammie Teclemariam: If you go early enough, I think you can avoid it. The weekends, you are really on your own. I believe last I checked, they're open on Thursdays. Although they will close up if they sell out. I think if you get there around 10:00, 11:00, on a Thursday or a Friday, maybe even noon. You could be in luck. [laughs]

Alison Stewart: To show up to work late one day? "I'm out getting a scone. I'll be right there." [laughs]

Tammie Teclemariam: I'm sure they'll save you one.

Alison Stewart: I was curious, you've seen so many cinnamon rolls and you've seen so many croissants. Are the scones-- Are they next? The next pastry?

Tammie Teclemariam: I think that scones like Mary O's are hard to come by. They would not be-- anywhere that you're getting a mono pastry shop. It's not a joke with her. It's the type of thing-- Yes, because they're coming out fresh all the time. Nobody's going to return one of these. A typical cafe scone, you get them early in the morning and they just kind of have to sell out. Right? Nobody's really caring for them this way, but maybe they'll start to. That's what I'd like to see.

Alison Stewart: [laughs] We are talking about the best food of 2025 so far. We'll have more after a quick break. This is All Of It.

[music]

Alison Stewart: You're listening to All Of It on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. My guests are Tammie Teclemariam and Matthew Schneier. They are critics at Grub Street and the writers behind the feature The Best Food of 2025 (So Far). Listeners, we want to hear from you. What is the best thing you've eaten so far this year, a dish that you can't stop thinking about? Our phone lines are open. 212-433-9692. 212-433-WNYC. Okay. This place just opened up around the corner from WNYC. I've been watching them put it together. Le Chêne.

Matthew Schneier: Ah, yes.

Alison Stewart: I'm watching them put the seats in, put the tables in, put the curtains up. I don't know if it's open. Oh, it seems to be open. Oh, they're having a tasting. Tell us what you ate at Le Chêne.

Matthew Schneier: Le Chêne is the place where I had the squab that I was mentioning before. It's the restaurant of a married couple, Alexia Duchêne and her husband Ronan, who runs the wine. They have an unbelievable wine program, a very uptown feeling wine program, I would say, for a place that is down here on Carmine street. Chef Le Chêne cooks a very heavy, traditional, luxurious, voluptuous French cooking. It's cote de boeuf, it's roast squab, it's foie gras. You're eating organ meat.

She doesn't go quite all the way to Ortolan, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was a dinner special one night. She does it with incredible technique and, clearly, real commitment and passion. It's a pleasure. The highest compliment I can give is that I went on a night that was about 90 degrees, and I still found my way to eating this really heavy, decadent French cooking.

Alison Stewart: All right. The Puerto Rican Pork Chop, Kabawa, on 8 Extra Place, okay? Extra place is a real place.

Matthew Schneier: It is a real place.

Alison Stewart: First of all, I'm not making that up. [laughs]

Matthew Schneier: It is a real place. It's very funny. It's actually-- I believe it's a cul de sac. It doesn't go all the way through. When you walk down at it, it does a little bit feel like you're on a film set or a TV set. I sort of was looking around my shoulder to see if this was actually Sesame Street, and Big Bird, or whoever's still there, is going to be filming behind it.

Alison Stewart: 1st Street between 2nd and Bowery.

Matthew Schneier: Exactly right.

Tammie Teclemariam: There are no cars parked on there.

Matthew Schneier: It's not a place where you're going to have outdoor dining. There's not a lot of foot traffic. It's a strange little space, but it's a historic Momofuku space. The tasting menu co, I believe, was there for a number of years. This is the first, if I have this correct, non-Momofuku restaurant with the backing of the Momofuku group. The chef, Paul Carmichael, was a longtime chef at the Momofuku restaurants, opened the restaurants in Sydney and, I believe, elsewhere.

Here, he's cooking from all across the Caribbean diaspora. It's just unbelievably delicious, spicy, flavorful. It's a cuisine that, I think, has so much to offer diners, but is often relegated to really small places or out of the way places, enclaves. Here, it's really given the fine dining treatment, and I think it shows that it richly deserves it.

Alison Stewart: You wrote, "An almost pornographically large scroll of sliced pork chop." [chuckles] That's some fun writing. [crosstalk]

Matthew Schneier: It's a family place, but only just.

Alison Stewart: That is Kabawa, at 8 Extra Place. We're going to go to butter chicken. This is you, Tammie.

Tammie Teclemariam: Yes.

Alison Stewart: Kebab ab Shurab?

Tammie Teclemariam: Kebab aur Sharab is how I would say it. [laughs]

Alison Stewart: It's at 247 West 72nd Street.

Tammie Teclemariam: Yes.

Alison Stewart: You mentioned that this butter chicken is served one of two ways, as a curry or on a kebab, but you chose the kebab version.

Tammie Teclemariam: Yes.

Alison Stewart: Why?

Tammie Teclemariam: This restaurant opened, I believe, at the very, very end of 2022. Usually, I try to go to newer restaurants or focus on that, but this was tied to a piece that I recently wrote about Indian restaurants, just how they're getting fancier, and more chef driven everywhere. Something that a lot of even these newer, fancier Indian restaurants are serving and want to highlight is a butter chicken. Maybe that's just because butter chicken is really delicious.

There are a lot of butter chickens out there right now, but this butter chicken on a kebab, this butter chicken kebab was my favorite version of it that I tasted. It's based on a version by a cook in Old Delhi who gets lots of visitors, and I think has broken through social media. It's skewered, the marinated meat is skewered. They cook it in a tandoor with volcanic rocks at the bottom to make the temperature really, really high.

Then they serve it over this just broken-- not even really a sauce, and it's just butter and hot cream on the plate. Then they season that a little bit, and then they just put this kebab on this plate of cream and butter. It's different. It's really great.

Alison Stewart: Cream and butter on the plate,-

Tammie Teclemariam: Yes.

Alison Stewart: -and the kebab.

Tammie Teclemariam: Yes.

Alison Stewart: Rice?

Tammie Teclemariam: You can order a side of rice. What was recommended by my server is the rumali roti. It's this really oversized roti that they put green-- I think it's unripe banana in the dough, which keeps it moist and pliable. The flavor, it's a very neutral flavor, but it's very textural. There aren't that many places where you can get-- it's folded up like a napkin, in quarters. It's nice, you can just soak up the sauce, and then grab a piece of chicken.

You can get rice, though. They have other rice dishes that I like. The bone marrow pulao. I really enjoyed that one.

Alison Stewart: That, again, is called-- Kebab are Shirab?

Tammie Teclemariam: Kebab aur Sharab.

Alison Stewart: Kebab aur Sharab. That's at 247 West 72nd Street. Thank you for helping me, by the way.

Tammie Teclemariam: No problem.

Alison Stewart: This is Jim calling in from Manhattan. Hey, Jim, thanks for calling All Of It.

Jim: Oh, thank you, Alison. This is great. It's a great show. I want to talk about a phenomenon in New York City. I love food. There is a restaurant down on 27th park called Hillstones, and they used to serve an absolutely amazing Idaho baked potato that comes fully stacked. Now, I know you think I-- Baked potato? Who wants the baked potato? This is a total phenomenon. It's a huge potato and it comes with bacon and all kinds of really good stuff in it.

It's amazing, but the chef there decided several years ago that they didn't want to offer this in this restaurant. This is a restaurant that I-- It's my favorite restaurant in the entire city. Service, everything. They have a sister restaurant in New Jersey, in Englewood, New Jersey, called Houston's, so it's part of that chain. We literally drive to Houston's, to New Jersey, in order to be able to have the exact same baked potato. It's an Idaho potato, and it is divine. I'm telling you.

Alison Stewart: It's true. I love a man who is devoted to his potato.

Matthew Schneier: This sounds like a moveon.org petition. I think we can get the people behind this. I think we can repatriate the Idaho potato from New Jersey to New York. I will sign.

Tammie Teclemariam: I love a baked potato, so yes, I'm on board.

Alison Stewart: We're on board, Jim. "Best dish I've eaten all year, at the newly opened--" Crevette? Crevette, in the West Village?

Matthew Schneier: Yes.

Alison Stewart: "From the people who opened Dame, or Dome, was their red shrimp carpaccio. Super simple, just very, very well done. Each sort of an unexpected ingredient singing together. Paper thinned shrimp with lemon rind and a perfectly grassy olive oil." That's from Whitney, in Ridgewood. Sounds like she might want to work for you. "We also had,-" this says, "-a delicious bite, fresh hot donut from the farmer's market washed down with a big slurp of cream from a local dairy."

Matthew Schneier: Wow.

Alison Stewart: That's a pretty good thing. "The best thing I've eaten this year, my world has been rocked since I discovered Korean sauna eggs. They're a next level experience. I make them in a crock pot on low for six hours. The white turns brown due to something called the maillard effect, and the yolk tastes nutty and chickeny, depending on your palate. Best eaten at room temperature. Enjoy." Are you familiar with any of these?

Matthew Schneier: We were actually just talking about Crevette in the Green Room. It has another partisan here at WNYC. I've been. It's a great restaurant, I believe I've had the carpaccio, although I might have had a different raw fish preparation. I think they call it Sicilian sashimi, or something cute like that. I have not heard of Korean sauna eggs, but I guess I'm mostly just relieved they're not served in the Korean sauna.

[laughter]

Alison Stewart: Quickly, let's talk about the mushroom pasta at Santi on East 53rd Street. It's got truffles involved, I believe.

Matthew Schneier: Not only does it have truffles involved, but I think you register the truffles about 15 steps before you register the rest of the pasta. That's one that you see and smell coming, with all the deliciousness that implies. Yes. Santi is a new restaurant from the chef Michael White, great Italian chef, has been involved with a lot of great places in the city, formerly Marea, I think, Osteria Morini, a number of places.

He is at an age when many very successful chefs semi retire to consult on big hotel projects or cruise ships, or do things where they're not standing up in a hot kitchen every night for hours on end, but there he is, back in the house and working hard. He definitely still has the chops. He's still teaching the younger kids what's what. It was an unbelievably delicious pasta. People who've been listening to the show may realize that I don't often go for the vegetarian option, to the dismay of my cardiologist, but this one was really an out of the park number.

Alison Stewart: I wanted to get to wings, Tammie. You mentioned Samyan, at 848 Fulton, in Clinton Hill. These wings, you wrote, are the closest you found to the still talked about Vietnamese wings served at the long gone Pok Pok on Columbia waterfront. What makes them so great?

Tammie Teclemariam: Yes, first of all, it's that salty, fishy, sticky, caramelized coating, but then, also, how it's executed. The fact that I got the wings delivered, and when they came to me, when I opened the container, they still had a crispness to them. Then the caramel on top, and to be able to stay crunchy in the face of sauce is one of the biggest adversities that a wing faces in this world. [laughs]

The other lovely thing is that they-- It's all flats, and they split them before frying, so you get the extra exterior, which means more crunch, more sauce, and it's daintier. Then you get more. You get the effect of having more chicken than you actually have wings. [chuckles]

Alison Stewart: Finally, Zimmi's. It's a restaurant, but your vanilla ice cream was-- Mwah.

Matthew Schneier: I could have picked many dishes from Zimmi's. I really admire and appreciate the cooking there. Also French. Much more rustic, in a way, much more tied to the chef's background growing up cooking with his grandmother in the south of France, but yes, if I had to pick one thing, the vanilla ice cream was unbelievably vanilla-ed, and all the better for that.

Alison Stewart: Tammie Teclemariam and Matthew Schneier. They are the critics at Grub Street, the writers, The Best Food of 2025 (So Far). Thanks for joining us. We really appreciate it.

Matthew Schneier: Thanks for having us.

Tammie Teclemariam: Glad to be here.