Alison Stewart: This is All Of It. I'm Alison Stewart live from the WNYC studios in SoHo. Thank you for sharing part of your day with us. I'm really grateful you are here. On today's show, writer Hanif Kureishi joins us to discuss his new book Shattered. It details his recovery after a fall in late 2022 that left him paralyzed. We'll also speak with the Oscar nominated production and costume designers for the film Nosferatu, and Ira Madison III is here to discuss his new book of essays, Pure Innocent Fun. That's the plan, so let's get this started with the one and only Laundry Evangelist.

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Alison Stewart: Earlier this week, we talked about how some people have vowed not to make new purchases as a part of no-buy 2025 challenge. This includes new clothes, shoes, furniture. However, in order to be successful, that requires some taking care of items that you already have at home. What if you notice that a pair of jeans in your closet you haven't put on a while looks a little bit dingy, that blanket that you keep in storage just in case you have overnight guests is just a little worn out, or would you like to save some money by washing that cashmere sweater that you usually take to the dry cleaners?

In today's installment of our series What the Hack, we're reviewing laundry best practices featuring none other than the "Laundry Evangelist" Patric Richardson. Patric wrote two books, one called Laundry Love: Finding Joy in a Common Chore, and the other is House Love: A Joyful Guide to Cleaning, Organizing, and Loving the Home You Are In. He also hosts the show The Laundry Guy on Discovery Plus. Hey, Patric, welcome back.

Patric Richardson: Hi. Thanks. Thank you so much for having me.

Alison Stewart: Listeners, we're taking your calls. Do you have a question about how to get your laundry done, have a stain that just can't get rid of, or a cashmere sweater or blanket that you don't want to ruin? Maybe you want to know how to make laundry more stress-free. Give us a call, 212-433-9692, 212-433-WNYC. You can call in and join us on air or you can hit us up via text or you can reach out on social media @allofitwnyc. All right, what is one laundry myth that you wish people would just stop believing in?

Patric Richardson: Well, the big thing is is that more detergent is better or longer cycles are better. You'll be so much happier if you use the express cycle, so the short cycle and you use less detergent. It saves you money, but it's also better for your clothes. The biggest myth is that more is better because really less is more.

Alison Stewart: Why is less more?

Patric Richardson: Because agitation is the worst thing we do to our clothes so that that two-hour cycle is just beating your clothes up. It's like washing your clothes in the creek with a rock. That extra detergent doesn't wash out of your clothes, so you lose that softness that you're looking for in those great jeans or the cashmere sweater. It's not as soft and then you're not as happy. Plus, that extra detergent actually causes your clothes to wear out faster because it causes the fibers to rub against each other.

Alison Stewart: General rule of thumb, how large of load of laundry should you wash at once?

Patric Richardson: If it's a front-loading washer, if you can put your hand in at the top and extend your thumb and pinky, you can fill it that full. If it's a top-loading washer, you can usually go about 75% full. You can get a much bigger load than you think.

Alison Stewart: Now, how often should we be washing our clothes?

Patric Richardson: I think as infrequently as you possibly can. Just because you wear something doesn't mean it needs to be washed. Maybe it just needs to be steamed out. I think you can wear your jeans 9 or 10 times before you wash them, unless of course you spill spaghetti sauce on them. Otherwise, you can go 9 or 10 times before you need to wash them.

Alison Stewart: I have to ask though, workout clothes, sometimes they can be mighty stinky after one or two washes. How do you keep them fresh and clean without using that artificial scent because that only makes it worse sometimes?

Patric Richardson: Oh my gosh, I think that's the worst thing ever because then you smell like BO and roses. A much better trick is to use oxygen bleach. The thing about workout wear is it's hydrophobic and oleophilic. It hates water, it loves oil. It loves all the oil from your skin and the sweat in the oil. Add some oxygen bleach. It'll actually also make the clothes wear better because they'll return to their stretch. I also have a funny little side trick for the sneakers that you're wearing when you go to yoga.

Alison Stewart: All right, tell me.

Patric Richardson: You can spray them with vodka. Vodka will kill the odor in anything. Your gym bag, your yoga mat, your sneakers, your equipment, you can spray it with vodka and it will kill the odor. It actually is very antibacterial.

Alison Stewart: BO and roses. Did not expect to hear that today, but it is a chef's kiss. Here's a text. It says, "Please help. How do you get dingy gray sheets clean and odor-free? Also, how do you get the gross teenage boy smell out of sheets and clothing? Thank you."

Patric Richardson: The teenage boy smell will come out with oxygen bleach. It's funny. I used to say it was gross too, but then I actually had somebody on a radio show tell me that the reason that your sweat smells is because you're healthier, so I've kind of re-looked at that process. The dingy sheets is probably actually from too much detergent. When you use too much detergent and it can't wash out, what ends up happening is the detergent actually settles back into your clothes with the dingy wash water because it has nowhere else to go, so less detergent and your things won't be dingy.

Alison Stewart: My guest is Patric Richardson, the Laundry Evangelist. He's offering some of his hacks for washing clothes and other fabrics in our home, and he's taking calls from listeners. 212-433-9692, 212-433-WNYC. Let's talk to Sarah from Hocus. Hey, Sarah. Thanks for calling. You are on the air with Patric.

Sarah: Hi, Alison. Hi, Patric. I read your book, but I read it a few years ago. I would like to know if there are any tips and tricks that you've picked up since you wrote the book.

Patric Richardson: Oh, wow, what a great question. It's funny, I have two. One is, since I wrote the book, laundry technology has actually improved one more time. There are now actually 15-minute wash cycles rather than 30-minute, which is what I wrote in the book that I loved. The other thing is, when I wrote the book, I didn't know about scent beads because they hadn't yet become a thing, and they're just as bad as fabric softener. I'm not a fan of either of those.

Then my final tip, which happened-- when I wrote the book, I didn't mention, and I knew it I didn't mention, that you could refresh clothes by putting a wet washcloth in the dryer and tumbling in a couple of minutes and then throwing the clothes in. You basically make your own little steam cabinet, and I forgot to put it in the book. I knew it, but I forgot to put it in.

Alison Stewart: There you go. It's on the radio. Thanks for calling, Sarah. Let's talk to Bob from Queens. Hi, Bob. You're on the air.

Bob: Hey, good morning. I have a question. I watch television, and I see all of these ads for things to add to your laundry even after you've used detergent and which creates a thorough wash as far as I'm concerned. I also see these ads that claim you're going to smell great forever. Your clothing is going to smell great all day and tomorrow. They seem, to me, when I look at the ads, to be racially motivated. They're targeting particular groups for the most part, which I find offensive. This also extends to now, not just deodorants, but whole body deodorant.

Alison Stewart: I've read from your list here. It says you want to know what's in these extra things that you're being asked to put in your washing machine. What's in them?

Patric Richardson: Basically, they are-- it's silicone that holds fragrance. It's actually how scent beads, dryer sheets, and fabric softener work. They coat your fabric with silicone, and they actually add extra fragrance. I'm going to go with my less is more strategy, you don't need them. Your clothes will be clean if you just wash your clothes, but those scent beads, they're just unnecessary.

Alison Stewart: Here's a text. "I have several pairs of Japanese denim that I will never, ever wash in a washing machine. I soak them in the tub with Dr. Bronner's maybe twice a year at most." What's your reaction to that, Patric?

Patric Richardson: I fully understand why you don't want to wash your Japanese denim because you want that gorgeous look. What you're doing is actually completely fine. I will tell you, you might, in the interim, want to give them a spritz of vodka. Dr. Bronner's is very clean. Really, what you're doing is great.

Alison Stewart: All right. Let's talk to Beth. Hi, Beth. Thanks for calling All Of It.

Beth: Hi. Thanks so much for taking my call. Again, I said to the screener, I adored this episode because I adored doing laundry. I was really happy to hear the topic. My question is, I have a couple of shirts that I've had for a really long time, and I wear them a lot. They developed-- when I wash them now, and I don't put them in the dryer, I just wash them and hang them up, and they develop a mildewy smell that I've not been able to get rid of. [crosstalk]

Alison Stewart: Yes, what does one do for mildewy smell?

Patric Richardson: Actually, what you can do is you can soak them in vinegar and water. That mildewy smell is a buildup of detergent. If you soak them in vinegar and water, you'll cause all of that detergent to wash out so that you'll be good to go. Do it just when you need to but not very often. You're wearing them a lot, so you're washing them a lot. Soak them in vinegar and water for a couple of hours and then just rinse them out. You'll be good to go.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Patricia from Westfield, New Jersey. Hi, Patricia. You are on with the Laundry Evangelist.

Patricia: Hello. Thank you for taking my call. A two-part question, I guess. Which one's better, liquid detergent or powdered detergent? I also wanted to mention I use vinegar to make my towels and washcloths soft, so I'll take my answers off the air.

Alison Stewart: Thank you. What do you think, powder versus liquid?

Patric Richardson: I don't have a preference over powder versus liquid. I will tell you with either one, two tablespoons is enough for a full load. As far as vinegar making your towel soft, it totally works, but it works because it washes out extra detergent. Only put it in the fabric softener cycle or fabric softener slot if you want to use it, but truthfully, if it's working, it's-- Gosh, I sound like a broken record. It's because of too much detergent.

Alison Stewart: Does it matter with the detergent because some of them are-- they're free of all things, all additives. It's free and gentle detergent. Does that have a lesser oomph than our super, this is going to get me out, OxiClean detergent?

Patric Richardson: It's really about the same. Those free and clear detergents, what they remove is the fragrance because a lot of times people that are allergic to detergent are actually allergic to the fragrance. The free and clear, it's the same formula. It's just fragrance-free, basically.

Alison Stewart: This is a great text. "Persuade me that I really need to invest $12-plus in a laundry brush or confirm my suspicion that a toothbrush is just fine."

Patric Richardson: It's easy to persuade you because there's a huge, huge difference. A laundry brush is probably made of horse hair, and when it gets wet, it gets softer. You could scrub the stain out of your cashmere sweater with a laundry brush. If you do that with a toothbrush, you'll get the stain out, but it will look like that you have scrubbed it with sandpaper or it will peel. $12 for a laundry brush is a lot cheaper than replacing your cashmere sweater.

Alison Stewart: All right, you convinced me. Let's say I'm having people over for a Super Bowl party this weekend and someone spills something on my rug, what's the first thing I should do?

Patric Richardson: The first thing you should do is enjoy your party. Don't worry about it. It's the Taylor Bowl, so we've got to just enjoy our time. Then when everybody's gone, then you can deal with it. You don't ever have to really worry about things in the moment. When they're gone, stick a towel under the rug and just scrub it with soap and a brush. If that doesn't work, use a little oxygen bleach and pat it on. The real key is to rinse it. Take a towel with clear water after you've done and blot that because you want to lift the soap back out and then just blow dry it. It'll be super easy, but your guests are way more important than your rug, even if it's a really great rug, because we can always get it clean.

Alison Stewart: What if I'm having a great time with my guests and one of them bumps into me when I have a glass of wine and it's on my shirt?

Patric Richardson: It's funny, I actually mentioned this in the book. If you ever spill wine at my house, the only thing I do is get you more wine. I never worry about it. Red wine will come out with oxygen bleach, so you can go change your shirt if it's at your house. If it's one of your guests and you loan them a shirt, no big deal, just a tablespoon of oxygen bleach and a bowl of water. Dip the stain in. It'll turn periwinkle blue, and once that happens, it'll wash right out. Super easy.

Alison Stewart: Let's say we've gone all the way to Valentine's Day, and somehow I get chocolate mashed into the couch. What do I do?

Patric Richardson: First of all, that's got to be a great story. What you do is you spray it with vinegar and water, and then you scrub it with soap and a brush. Then you take a towel and you blot with clear water and blot it up. It's really simple, but you have to spray the vinegar first because the vinegar cuts the surface tension of the oil in the chocolate.

Alison Stewart: We are talking to Patric Richardson, the Laundry Evangelist. He's offering us some hacks for washing clothes and other fabrics in our homes. We're getting tons of phone calls. We'll take a quick break and we'll get back to it. This is All Of It.

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Alison Stewart: You are listening to All Of It on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. My guest is Patric Richardson, known as the Laundry Evangelist. He is offering some of his hacks for washing clothes and other fabrics in our homes. If you're calling in and you're getting a busy signal, that is because our phone lines are just full. We're going to roll through some calls right now. Let's talk to Marybeth. Hi, Marybeth.

Marybeth: Hi. I want to go back to the comment you made, Patric, about shorter cycles because I have a short cycle on my machine that I use occasionally. I'd love to use it all the time, but you mentioned a two-hour cycle being too long. My regular cycle is only 47 minutes, but I also have a 25-minute cycle. What can I use?

Patric Richardson: I'll go to the 25-minute cycle all the time. The shorter cycle-- modern technology in fabric, in detergent, in our machines, has just made those short cycles the answer to so many of life's problems. You can safely use that for everything. I just wouldn't even bother with anything else.

Alison Stewart: Good advice. Let's talk to Nicole. Hi, Nicole.

Nicole: Oh, hi. I have a question about laundry detergent that comes not in a jug and not in those beads or powder but in those sheets. We're really environmentally conscious, so we try not to buy plastic. I've been buying those laundry sheets where basically it's almost like a dryer sheet but you drop it into your laundry and it dissolves. I wondered if you had any recommendations.

Patric Richardson: I don't have a recommendation on the brand. I will tell you to put them in on top of the clothes, not under the clothes. Don't put the sheet in first, put the clothes in on top. I am going to tell you because I just want to be candid and be very honest, they are finding a lot of research that those have microplastics in them. Research the brand that you are using to make sure that it doesn't since that seems to be an important reason for you to use them.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Neil from Brooklyn. Hey, Neil. Thanks for calling All Of It. You're on with Patric.

Neil: Thank you, Patric Evangelist. I have a storm and rain shell. The outer surface is a treated 100% nylon, meant to be water repellent, inside the polyester lining. I really like it. It's red. I've washed it under your guidelines with the proper amount of time, but there are some stains that just do not come out. Granted, I've had this for a number of years. Is it worth it to me to take it to a dry cleaner or will the dry cleaner just end up-- the stains will still be there

Patric Richardson: I think the stains will still be there. I wouldn't take it to a dry cleaner because the heat when they press it will actually diminish the water repellent finish. What you might be able to do is take some liquid hand soap, put them on the stains, scrub it with a brush, and let it sit a few hours and then wash it again because the soap may penetrate the fabric if you let it sit a few hours and lift the stain out.

Alison Stewart: Let's go to Zoe from Long Island City. Hi, Zoe.

Zoe: Hi. I actually grew up in the dry cleaning and commercial laundry business, and I work professionally on Broadway building costumes and props. They do indeed, in every wardrobe department, use cheap vodka to deodorize costumes, especially those big foam costumes. The other thing is, I always recommend-- I don't know about the most recent dryer sheets, but in the past, they are so flammable that we always say, please don't use them, especially on children's sleepwear.

Pyrotechnics actually use them as flash paper because that's how flammable they are. The thing about silk, 1,000 years ago, 2,000 years ago, they didn't have dry cleaning, but they used silk for clothing. There's no reason, generally, not to be able to hand-wash silk, but you must wet it all at once. You don't want to spot it. Silk can take a hot iron too, so you can really press it out nicely.

Alison Stewart: There you go.

Patric Richardson: I think we may become besties.

Alison Stewart: [laughs] There you go. This one is actually from Bluesky, how to clean weighted blankets used by teenage boys. By the way, you can follow us on Bluesky@olivetwnyc.bluesky.social. What do you do about weighted blankets?

Patric Richardson: You can wash them provided that they're not filled with buckwheat because some weighted blankets are. If the beads are plastic or glass, you can actually wash them. You can use oxygen bleach on them. It's just fine. I would probably take them to a Laundromat because they're weighted. Your washing machine at home can only hold about 25 pounds, and when the blanket gets wet, it gets heavier than that. I would put them in a commercial washing machine, but you absolutely can wash them. If the beads are glass, you might even put it inside a big mesh laundry bag just to make your life a little easier.

Alison Stewart: How often should we be dividing our clothes between whites and darks? Is that old-fashioned or is that true?

Patric Richardson: No, it's really true. Actually for two reasons. Number one, it'll keep your colors brighter. Number two, different colors actually have different weights. Darker colors are heavier, so if you wash a black T-shirt and a white T-shirt, beyond the fact that the white will get dingy, it actually is harder on the white T-shirt because it's like beating it up.

Alison Stewart: Here are two texts that go together. One says, "How do I get yellow armpit stains out?" Then somebody else wants to know. "I have a white cotton blanket from yellowing. It says dry clean only, but I need to unyellow it." What do you do for yellowing?

Patric Richardson: Another one of those things where I feel like a broken record, oxygen bleach. Oxygen bleach will take up that yellowing because that's just oxidation. For the armpit stains, you actually can put some hand soap on the stains, sprinkle oxygen bleach on it because it's a powder, let it sit and run hot water through it. Better trick, once you get the armpit stains out or you start with a new shirt, if you always spray it with a mixture of 50 white vinegar, 50 water, in the armpits or the collar, wherever you get the stain, immediately before you toss it in the washer, you'll never have the stain again.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Rita from Santa Fe, New Mexico. Hi, Rita. Thanks so much for calling us. Are you there?

Rita: Hi, Alison and Patric. Patric, I have your book. I love it, and I'm so glad you're on air again.

Patric Richardson: Thank you.

Rita: Great call, Alison. Here's my question. I don't use laundry detergent. I only use laundry soap, and I can get that either in a liquid form or a powder. What do you think of the difference between the two?

Patric Richardson: I don't have a preference. I actually prefer laundry soap to laundry detergent. It's just so much harder to find. When you use laundry soap, you use half the amount of detergent. A full load, you use one tablespoon if you like the liquid or the powder, whichever. I actually prefer the powder or the flake simply because I don't want to pay for the water. It's easier for me to carry, but laundry soap, if I had to list my five favorite things in the whole world, laundry soap would be one of the five.

Alison Stewart: This question we're getting from a lot of people. It says, what is the ratio of vinegar to water for a spray? Can the mixture stay in the spray bottle indefinitely or does it lose its potency after a period of time?

Patric Richardson: Oh gosh, what a great question. It's 50 vinegar, 50 water, and you can mix up the bottle and just leave it. I just top it off whenever I need to. The ratio probably in my world isn't always perfect because when it's low, I add about half more vinegar, half more water, but you want roughly a 50-50 ratio.

Alison Stewart: Let's take another call. Let's talk to Kevin. Hi, Kevin. Thank you for calling All Of It.

Kevin: Hey. Thanks so much. Such a blessing that you're back on the air. I know it was a while ago, but it's just great.

Patric Richardson: Thank you.

Kevin: This is a fantastic segment. I wanted to just mention that you mentioned about spraying the clothes with vodka. Actually, I started a few years ago buying just rubbing alcohol in a bottle and screwing a pump spray cap on it, where you can buy at the $0.99 store, the spray bottle. I use it for my gym clothes. It kills the smell. I pump it onto my sneakers. If I have a cut or something that I need to sanitize, or whatever, to disinfect. That's just something that I just wanted to mention that you don't necessarily use vodka. You can use just rubbing alcohol, I think. [crosstalk]

Alison Stewart: What do you say, Patric?

Patric Richardson: It actually will work. It's just that rubbing alcohol has a fragrance to it. It has a scent. I shouldn't say a fragrance. It has a scent to it. For your gym clothes, I think it's absolutely great. The one thing, if you were to spray your dress coat, you might smell the rubbing alcohol. It's just as disinfectant. It just has an odor, whereas vodka has absolutely none. That's the only difference.

Alison Stewart: We're getting a lot of calls about how to get rid of pet stains from carpets and sofas. You know what we're talking about.

Patric Richardson: I do. We're going to go back to our friend, oxygen bleach. You can blot it on. I will tell you on the sofa, if you throw a tablespoon of oxygen bleach to about a quart of water, if you have one of those little rug shampooers or you have a friend who has one of those little rug shampooers, it is the easiest thing in the world to do on your sofa. You can blot it on, but, man, if you have one of those little rug shampooers, it just makes it so much easier.

Alison Stewart: This says, "Question for the Laundry Evangelist. It's Patric Richardson, by the way. How would you clean a down comforter in the washing machine and get the weird wet down smell out of it? Thanks."

Patric Richardson: That's a great question. Wash it with just the tiniest, tiniest bit of detergent. What's even better is down wash. You can get that in specialty stores, and you can also get it in hiking stores because of parkas, but you want to use the tiniest bit possible. The real trick is throw it in the dryer with three tennis balls to beat the loft back into it. When you beat the loft back in, believe it or not, it actually helps remove that odor because it makes it fluffy and not clumpy so it doesn't hold the moisture and hold the odor in it.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Mark from Rye Brook. Hi, Mark. Thanks for calling All Of It.

Mark: Hey, guys. Hey, Patric. My question kind of goes with the last one. My wife and I are skiers, and I hardly ever wash my ski pants and my parka, and she likes to wash hers all the time. How should we do it? They also sell very expensive additives that are supposed to revitalize the waterproofedness of the garments. Do you know anything about this, and is it worth it?

Patric Richardson: You know what? It's funny. I have not heard of the additives. I'm going to research that now. I may have to do a social media post about it. I've not heard of them. You can wash the pants as often as you want. The key is, if it's your pants or your parka, don't put them in the dryer. Let them hang to dry, and then throw them in the dryer with no heat. Just air and the tennis balls for like 10 minutes to fluff up the down because the down can survive the heat of the dryer that water-repellent finish on your ski clothes cannot. I'm going to look into the additive, and I'll figure out how to get that information out there because that's a new one on me.

Alison Stewart: Patric, I know you had a thought about how laundry and Valentine's Day, they can go hand in hand. Would you share this with our folks?

Patric Richardson: Absolutely. I believe that you do laundry for people that you love. I think that taking care of someone's laundry is a total love language. I think even if that's you, if you love you, you do your laundry. I think it's so important to just do these because the big-- roses and things are great, but those everyday things that make the person in your life feel better and feel special are the best things. I think you do laundry for people that you love.

Alison Stewart: We've been receiving laundry tips from the Laundry Evangelist, Patric Richardson. He has a book out called Laundry Love: Finding Joy in a Common Chore. It's a great book. He also hosts the show The Laundry Guy on Discovery Plus. Patric, it's always a pleasure to have you.

Patric Richardson: Thank you so much. This was so fun.