Alison Stewart: This is All Of It on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. It's the end of a great week. If you missed any of our guests we had here on the show, you should go back and check them out. I don't want to play favorites, but you might not want to miss my conversation with artist Amy Sherald. Her gorgeous portraits are now on display in a new exhibit at the Whitney. She joined us on Wednesday to talk about her life and her process. You should listen to the segment and then go see her work, or maybe you want to go smaller and you want to check out artist Debbie Taylor-Kerman's work at the Heath Gallery. You should listen to that conversation. Her Scottish accent, chef's kiss.

Plus, if you're still catching up on The White Lotus, Carrie Coon joined us to talk about the season finale. She laid down some wisdom on us. That conversation is great as well. We celebrated Poetry Month with poets Ricardo Maldonado and Vincent Katz. You listeners called in to share their favorite poems. You can listen to All Of It on our show page at WNYC.org or wherever you get your podcasts. Now, let's get this hour started because while it's one o'clock here in New York, it's five o'clock somewhere.

[music]

Alison Stewart: Margaritas, anyone? The classic cocktail is easy to make at home so long as you have the right ingredients and a tequila that you love. Caroline Pardilla is a digital content editor for Imbibe magazine. She has written a new book with recipes and advice for making margaritas and su casa. It's called Margarita Time: 60+ Tequila & Mezcal Cocktails, Served Up, Over & Blended. She is here now to take your calls. Welcome to WNYC.

Caroline Pardilla: Thank you, Alison.

Alison Stewart: Listeners, do you love a good margarita? Do you have a favorite flavor? Frozen on the rocks? Do you like to make them at home? 212-433-9692, 212-433-WNYC. Maybe you want to tell us your favorite place in your neighborhood to get a margarita. You can shout out your recommendations now. What is a margarita that you love compared to other cocktails? Do you enjoy it when the weather's warmer? Anytime, call or text us right now. 212-433-9692, 212-433-WNYC. Okay, I read in the book that you think you can tell a lot about a person by the type of margarita they like. What's an example of that?

Caroline Pardilla: Well, if somebody's really into the Tommy's margarita, which is basically the margarita without the orange liqueur, they are really into tequila and the taste of tequila because they want a cocktail that focuses on that flavor. I found that a lot of bartenders, that's their go-to drink. Serious drinkers prefer Tommy's. Then if you want to go frozen, blended strawberry margarita, then you probably don't like the taste of tequila that much or you're just celebrating. [chuckles] I just figure, it's not judging. It's just like, "Oh, I just like to get a read on people." I think I'm both now.

[laughter]

Caroline Pardilla: Who is it or a little bit of everything, but yes.

Alison Stewart: There are a lot of stories out there how the margarita was created. To the best of your knowledge, what did you learn in your research for this book about the margarita origin story?

Caroline Pardilla: A lot of classic cocktails, they don't have specific origin stories. I felt like the margarita had a lot of specific origin stories. A lot of people taking credit for it or if it's associated with a woman named Margarita. There's a Texas socialite in the '50s. She said she created it for her celebrity friends because they were out in Mexico drinking and she wanted to have something to serve them by the pool.

Then another one said it was created for Rita Hayworth when she was a performer in Mexico. There are so many different origin stories, but then I interviewed cocktail historian David Wondrich. He was saying that they could actually all be right because during the Prohibition, when everybody went to Mexico to drink or bartenders went down there to work, they would make the daisy cocktail, which is a classic cocktail. They would use tequila because that was what was available down there. Then that's when the margarita really took off around the '50s and '60s from that. Everybody could be right. [chuckles]

Alison Stewart: You write that margaritas like other cocktails, they took off during the cocktail renaissance in the early 2000s. Why was there a renaissance around the margarita?

Caroline Pardilla: Well, it actually was a renaissance around all the classic cocktails. The margarita, I feel like it was in dire need of a makeover or a revisit because back in the '70s and '80s, they were making margaritas with really bad bottled lime cordials and just bad ingredients, bad tequila, everything. Then around the '80s was when the orange liqueur companies were actually promoting that their orange liqueur could hide the taste of tequila in your margarita. Yes, that was no good. The cocktail renaissance, it pushed fresh juices, fresh ingredients, high-quality spirits, high-quality ingredients. It just really glowed up all these cocktails that were about to just be forgotten or associated with really bad tastes, bad flavors. It really needed that.

Alison Stewart: My guest is Caroline Pardilla. She is a digital content editor for Imbibe magazine. We're speaking about her new cookbook, Margarita Time. Our call-out to you is, do you love a good margarita? Do you have a favorite flavor? How do you make it at home? Maybe you want to shout out your favorite place to get a margarita in our area. Call or text us now at 212-433-9692, 212-433-WNYC. Let's talk to Charlene, who's calling in from Queens. Hi, Charlene.

Charlene: Hi, how are you? Thanks for having me.

Alison Stewart: Yes, I want to hear about your margarita.

Charlene: Yes, we love my margaritas. My husband and I drink them all year. We feel like it's actually the perfect cocktail to put in some seasonal ingredients. Actually, this spring, we just made our own concoction where we create a juice with cucumber, lime, mint. We add in actually some cilantro and then we add the Cointreau and tequila. It's so refreshing and green-like spring. Yes, we love it.

Alison Stewart: Love that.

Caroline Pardilla: [chuckles]

Alison Stewart: We actually got another one that says, "Cucumber margaritas are the best assist." That's how they spelled it.

Caroline Pardilla: It's refreshing.

Alison Stewart: What's a good example of a refreshing spring cocktail in your book?

Caroline Pardilla: Well, actually, there was one called the Pod Racer. It includes snap peas, so I feel like that would be a good one. I also like the red onion margarita, which I feel like it's more for warm weather. It's like you make a salted red onion syrup and then she also adds a little bit of pineapple rum. It's just this really tropical, beautiful, perfect Patio Pounder. [chuckles] It has this umami and then the tropical flavors. It's delicious. I would recommend that one.

Alison Stewart: I did not expect snap peas and red onions to be discussed during our margarita segment.

Caroline Pardilla: [laughs] Two different margaritas, I have to say. [laughs]

Alison Stewart: Still, it's interesting.

Caroline Pardilla: Yes, no, what's great about the margarita as a vehicle, it's like you can make anything into a margarita and it'll be delicious. [chuckles]

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Kyle, who's calling in from Williamsburg. Hey, Kyle, thanks for taking the time to call All Of It. You're on the air.

Kyle: Excellent. I just wanted to give a shout-out to ANIMAL. It's at 307 Meeker, so right under the BQE. It used to be several different things over the course of the last 20 years, but I think they make one of the best margaritas in the city. It's definitely worth checking out. I like to go there with my gal pals all the time. Anyway, thanks. I got to run.

[laughter]

Alison Stewart: Okay, don't want to hold you up.

Caroline Pardilla: I want to know more about that. Why?

Alison Stewart: He's got to run. We'll ask him next time.

[laughter]

Caroline Pardilla: Extra answer. [laughs]

Alison Stewart: This says, "Margaritas are lovely, but don't waste high-end tequila with that much lime juice is good. Not outstanding tequila will do. Save the high-end tequila for two or three small ice cubes and savor them." All right, this brings us to the subject of tequila. How do we choose the right tequila for our margaritas?

Caroline Pardilla: In the book, I said the perfect tequila is the one that's your favorite. If you want some guidance, I highly recommend going on tequilamatchmaker.com, which is a tequila database where the founders and members, they taste all the different tequilas and they rate them. Basically, when you look on the scores, if it's higher than 85, then that bottle is excellent.

Also, when you go to the store, you're looking for bottles that say "100% pure agave," because if it doesn't have that, then it's like a mixto, which is 49% sugars that are added. That will not do your margarita any favors. You want it made in Mexico. I highly recommend looking on tequilamatchmaker.com for the ratings and everything. They used to have a list of additive-free tequilas, but they had to take that off for legal reasons, but it was really helpful. You want to also make sure there aren't additives in your tequila.

Alison Stewart: We got a text says, "Dandelion green-flavored margarita is my favorite." Love that as well. Let's also talk to Teresa, who is a bartender in Brooklyn. Hey, Teresa, thanks for calling in.

Teresa: Hi, how are you? ANIMAL does make a great margarita, by the way. My call is about a complaint and a gripe as a bartender, which I don't know when this trend started. It is probably some housewives somewhere on the Bravo network. The skinny margarita has become an epidemic of grand proportions. First of all, it's like a variation of either a skinny one or a skinny spicy or a mezcal. At a certain point, it's not even a margarita anymore if you're not putting those elements into the drink. Am I right? Just order a tequila soda and stop driving bartenders insane.

Alison Stewart: Thank you for your call. What's your take on it, Caroline?

Caroline Pardilla: I feel like the skinny margarita is just the Tommy's margarita. It's the margarita without the orange liqueur, so it doesn't have as much sugar. I hate that they call it skinny also. [chuckles] I'm like, "Oh, you mean a Tommy's?" They like what they like. If it gets people to drink margaritas and tequila, then who am I to judge? [chuckles]

Alison Stewart: What's in a basic margarita?

Caroline Pardilla: A traditional margarita is the tequila. About an ounce and three-quarters to two ounces of tequila and a lime, so about an ounce of lime juice, and then I counter that with a three-quarter or an ounce of orange liqueur. Then sometimes you can sweeten it if you want to with simple or agave syrup. It's a classic cocktail proportions where you're balancing the sweet with the acid. A lot of classic cocktails are like that.

Alison Stewart: What are some common mistakes that people make at home when they're preparing margaritas?

Caroline Pardilla: I think they just like that action of dipping their glass to salt the rim and they just wet the whole glass. They stick it in this bowl of salt. You don't want to do that because then you're covering the inside and the outside of the glass. You're basically having a salty cocktail, which you don't want. You just want the salt. The salt is just like a little bit there to-- It mutes the tartness of the drink. It'll enhance the sweetness. You don't want a salty cocktail. Also, people, they'll buy the bottled lime juice because it's at the grocery store. You think, "I'll just grab this and use this." You would do your margarita a disservice. You're making it bad. You're wasting your tequila by using that bottle of lime juice. Just buy lime. Cut it, squeeze it, done.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Rita, who's calling in from Santa Fe, New Mexico. Hey, Rita, thank you so much for making the call.

Rita: Oh, I listen. This is a wonderful conversation. I had moved here from New York and I am in the land of margaritas in New Mexico. I'll tell you, my favorite margarita is the one I make at home. I use a silver tequila. I don't like smoky. I use silver tequila, fresh lime juice, and Cointreau or whatever orange liqueur that you have around. I use equal parts of everything. It's tart. It's refreshing. Sometimes I top it off with a little orange juice or even a little grapefruit juice, which is really tart. I don't like the sweet, so the tart, refreshing, equal parts of everything. Oh, it's just divine.

Alison Stewart: Rita, thank you so much. I love hearing Rita describe that. My goodness.

Caroline Pardilla: I know. I'm like, "Oh, tell me more."

Alison Stewart: I know. Tell me more. Let's talk to Martin from the Bronx. Hi, Martin. Thanks for calling All Of It.

Martin: Oh, hi, Alison. I've called in before. Listen from day one. Love you. Love you. I have a quick take on a frozen margarita. Went with a friend to a bar 30 years ago. Spring, summertime was hot. We couldn't get into this very popular bar and we wanted to have some frozen margaritas. I said, "I have an idea." We were going back to his apartment, but first, we stop off in a supermarket.

I don't know whether this is cheating to you or your guest. We bought a number of pints, raspberry, mango, maybe just a regular lemon lime, frozen sorbet. Went back to his apartment. No fuss, no muss. You stick it directly into your glass, toss in your liquor of choice. Tequila, rum, vodka, whatever. Boom, instant margarita. It's fantastic. We've been using it for 30 years.

Alison Stewart: I love it. Boom. Is he right?

Caroline Pardilla: That's a great tip. A sorbet. I've heard of sorbet. Adding chocolate sorbet to milkshake to boost up the flavors. Yes, that totally makes sense. A lime sorbet or these flavored sorbets to make a frozen margarita. I love it.

Alison Stewart: We will have more with Caroline Pardilla. She's a digital content editor for Imbibe magazine. We're talking about her new cookbook, Margarita Time. Give us a call if you love a good margarita, frozen or on the rocks. Maybe your favorite place to get it in our area. 212-433-WNYC, 212-433-9692. We'll have more after a quick break. This is All Of It.

[music]

Alison Stewart: You are listening to All Of It on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. My guest is Caroline Pardilla. She's a digital content editor for Imbibe magazine. We're talking about her new cookbook, Margarita Time: 60+ Tequila & Mezcal Cocktails, Served Up, Over & Blended. We are taking your calls. Let me read a couple of texts here. "Charred pineapple is a great margarita topper." This one says, "The Brookdale in Bloomfield, New Jersey makes the best jalapeno margarita."

This one says, "My brother is a home mixologist. He makes a fabulous margarita with muddled seasonal summer fruits, watermelon, strawberry peach. He freezes fresh juice and lime juice in ice cube trays, adds a dash of Cointreau, high-quality silver tequila, which he infuses with jalapeno. Each time is a new experience. Delicious, basic, the best." All right, there's a lot in that last text. First of all, let's start with equipment. What equipment do you need to make a good margarita?

Caroline Pardilla: Surprisingly, you don't need a lot. They think you need a shaker, but you can use a milkshake, the protein shake bottle, or a mason jar or whatever. Yes, I guess that's all you really need. Oh, you need a juicer if you want. You can hand-squeeze those, but you really can make a margarita anywhere.

Alison Stewart: You write in the book that acid is where margarita can really go south if you're not careful. Limes are their basic acid ingredient. What is it about acid that we need to be wary of?

Caroline Pardilla: With the lime juice, you definitely do not want to use lime juice that's over a day old. There's a bartender who did a taste test. He tasted the difference between a fresh-squeezed, a couple-of-hours-old, and a 24-hour-old lime juice. The day-old one was, hands down, the worst. You could easily ruin your margarita with that. It's just too acidic. It's just nasty. [chuckles] It's like you don't want to waste your good tequila and then cheat out with the lime.

Alison Stewart: What about the orange liqueur?

Caroline Pardilla: The orange liqueur. In this book, what's amazing is that everybody takes the lead from the Tommy's. Not everybody, but a lot of the bartenders do. They'll swap out the orange liqueur with the gentian liqueur or other things like that. The orange liqueur, in the traditional, it brightens the cocktail. It complements the lime. Ivy Mix, who's a bartender in New York, she actually prefers Cointreau. She says that it pairs well with the agave in the tequila.

Alison Stewart: We love Ivy Mix.

Caroline Pardilla: Yes. [chuckles]

Alison Stewart: She's a regular on the show.

Caroline Pardilla: Name drops.

[laughter]

Alison Stewart: Let's talk to Maria from Huntington. Hi, Maria, thanks for calling All Of It. You're on the air.

Maria: Hi, thanks so much. My question is margaritas are so popular right now and there are so many amazing flavors, but I cannot do tequila after an unfortunate incident in Mexico around 30 years ago. I'm wondering if it's possible to swap in another alcohol like rum, for example, if that always works.

Caroline Pardilla: That wouldn't be a margarita then. [chuckles] That would be a daiquiri, which is fine. Daiquiris are good, but I would recommend giving tequila-- you have to taste good tequila. Go to a really great tequila bar that has a nice selection and taste a little bit. I actually talked to somebody else who had a bad experience with tequila and wouldn't drink it. Then she tasted that red onion margarita and it changed her mind. She was like, "Okay, I'll give it another chance." I'm just saying, unless you have a gag reflex when you taste or smell tequila, just taste something a really high-quality tequila. It doesn't even have to be expensive. There are some good high-quality ones that are affordable.

Alison Stewart: Think about where you were 30 years ago, the decision you made. Come on. Let's talk to Ann. Hey, Ann, thanks for calling All Of It.

Ann: Hi, Alison. Great to be on your show. I really love it. I always listen. Margaritas are near and dear to my heart and especially to the heart of my 96-year-old mother because I got her into them about five years ago when we were traveling in Charleston, South Carolina. It was Cinco de Mayo. We were supposed to go on a harbor cruise, but the weather was terrible, so they canceled it.

We found ourselves downtown and we went into a hotel. There was a nice lounge there and we sat down. It was Cinco de Mayo, so I said, "We have to have margaritas." My mother says she's never had one in her life. At this point, she's 91. Of course, we had to have classic margaritas straight up with salt, made with Jose Cuervo Especial, and she loved it. Ever since then, at every social occasion, every time we go out to dinner, she has her margarita. We all love it.

Alison Stewart: Love the call. Thank you so much for calling in. We got this text that says, "What was the place under the BQE that was recommended twice for their margaritas?" I want to let our listeners know. We upload transcripts of these conversations on our website, so you can always go through. You can get the best recommendations that people are giving.

That was called ANIMAL, by the way, which was a place under the BQE. For any information on this segment or any piece that you didn't quite hear, you can catch them in our transcripts. They go up a couple of hours after the show, so that was a piece of information for you. My guest is Caroline Pardilla. We're talking about margaritas. Her new cookbook is Margarita Time. All right, spicy margaritas. What kind of spices are we talking about?

Caroline Pardilla: You can do cut-up jalapeno peppers and put a couple of coins into the shaker and shake that up. I like to do this spicy tincture. It's called scrappy bitters and you do a couple of dashes. You add that to your shaker. You can go crazy and then do all of it and then do the spicy rim and put hot sauce and everything as crazy as you want.

Alison Stewart: We talked about this a little bit earlier. Are you pro or against salt on the rim?

Caroline Pardilla: It depends. I like that when the bartender gives you the option. The only suave, half of the rim. You can go back to it if you want. Generally, if the margarita is balanced and everything, I feel like I really don't need the salt.

Alison Stewart: You also have something in the book called ranch water, a spin-off of the margarita. What's ranch water? [chuckles]

Caroline Pardilla: Oh, you don't know ranch water? [laughs]

Alison Stewart: I don't. [chuckles]

Caroline Pardilla: Yes, okay. Ranch water actually is basically a margarita topped with Topo Chico, so sparkling water. The guy who invented it, I think his name is Kevin Williamson, he just wanted to lengthen his margarita. He wanted to sip on it more, so he just like, "Oh, I'll just grab this and top it." It's just this refreshing. He made the margarita even more refreshing [laughs] if that was possible. That's a favorite daytime drink or for brunch. They were attributing it to ranch hands because it's so easy to make. You can just add the tequila to your Topo Chico bottle and put a lime wedge in there and just swish it around and drink it.

Alison Stewart: I only got about 28 more minutes on the radio. I am so ready for margarita. It's not even funny.

[crosstalk]

Caroline Pardilla: [chuckles]

Alison Stewart: We got a message via Bluesky, "This margarita conversation is tempting me to make a guava margarita later. Haven't made one in a couple of years." What are some other fruits that we can add to margaritas? Should we get spicy?

Caroline Pardilla: Yes, spicy mango is a good one. There's strawberry, coconut. There are so many things you can add. You can add an ounce of whether it's the juice or some of the bartenders make a syrup out of the fruit. Yes, go for it. I think a margarita with fruit would just make it even more beautiful and fun.

Alison Stewart: I understand for this book, you put together a playlist for making and enjoying margaritas. Who are some of your favorite artists or songs that you have on that list?

Caroline Pardilla: Well, of course, I have-- Was it The Champs that did Tequila? I didn't like that song for the longest time because it was associated with Pee-wee Herman, but then I listened to it. I'm like, "Yes, this is perfect." [chuckles] A lot of the songs in there are around from the '50s and '60s. It was inspired by my aunt who passed away last year. She was into cha-cha music. Every time there was a party, she wanted to do the cha-cha. It has stuff like Sway by Pink Martini. It has Tequila by The Champs. I just imagine somebody with a shaker and just cha-cha and shaking their cocktail up. [chuckles]

Alison Stewart: We have been talking about margaritas with Caroline Pardilla, digital content editor for Imbibe magazine. Thanks for being with us, Caroline.

Caroline Pardilla: Thank you so much. This was so fun.

Alison Stewart: Let's go out on Margaritaville.

[MUSIC - Jimmy Buffett: Margaritaville]

Wastin' away again in Margaritaville

Searchin' for my long lost shaker of salt

Some people claim that there's a woman to blame

But I know it's nobody's fault