Tiffany Hanssen: This is All Of It on WNYC. I'm Tiffany Hanssen filling in for Alison Stewart. In 2016, the DJ and producer TOKiMONSTA underwent surgery that left her unable to hear music as more than harsh metallic sounds. A few years later, she became the first Asian-American woman to be nominated for a Grammy for Best Electronic Dance Album. This month, she released a new album called Eternal Reverie. Here's a song, Switch It, from TOKiMONSTA.

[MUSIC - Cakes da killa and TOKiMONSTA: Switch It]

I mean, I mean

What else can you do?

You know I just need somethin' new

Excite me (like this)

Figure it out

Need someone who brings

More lore and pleasantries

Tie me down

To keep it interesting

Tell me how (how)

You plan to capture me

Baby (baby)

Do you really wanna date me? (Do you wanna date me?)

Wanna go, can you take me?

Tiffany Hanssen: TOKiMONSTA has been a leader in electronic music and hip hop for the last decade and a half. She was the first woman signed to the music label Brainfeeder, founded by influential producer Flying Lotus. TOKiMONSTA has also produced for a number of other artists and runs her own label, Young Art Records. For our series Equalizers: Women in Music Production, here's Alison's conversation with TOKiMONSTA.

[music]

Alison Stewart: You've talked about going back to a time before music became your job. It was a necessary thing, something you enjoy, but that was necessary, a time back to when you just really enjoyed it. Tell me about that time. How did you find your way into music?

TOKiMONSTA: I think from a practical sense, I knew that it wouldn't be realistic to have music as a career. Being passionate about it, I was like, what could I do? That really was just go out in LA and go in the scene and hang out with other people who also love music. That's really what brought me to this career unintentionally, is by going into it with absolutely no desire to make it a career, just to keep it something as passionate and creatively driven as possible.

Alison Stewart: Let's go back to a really early track of yours, Let Me Trick You. When was this released?

TOKiMONSTA: Oh, my goodness. 2010 or '11, perhaps.

Alison Stewart: Okay. Tell us about your career at that time.

TOKiMONSTA: I didn't really have one.

Alison Stewart: [laughs]

TOKiMONSTA: I think at the point that that album came out, I might have made the decision to pursue music. Truly at that time, I was like, "There's just no way. I can't see myself making it." I see all my peers trying to do music full-time, and they're definitely not making it or living a quality life without also building some level of resentment towards music. For me at that time, it was still just about creative expression and trying out music as a career. Like I told myself, if I didn't make it, I would just, I don't know, try to go back to school, get a new job. All those things. At the time that that particular song came out, I took the leap of faith and was like, "You know what? Let's just try this out. Let's see if I can do music full-time."

Alison Stewart: Let's take a listen. This is Let Me Trick You.

[MUSIC - TOKiMONSTA: Let Me Trick You]

Alison Stewart: I'm speaking to DJ and producer TOKiMONSTA. Her new album is Eternal Reverie, and she's joining me as part of our Women's History Month series, Equalizers. She'll be performing in New York on May 22nd and May 24th. Toki, that song has a very different vibe than your latest album. How has your style or your approach to music production changed over the last 15 years?

TOKiMONSTA: I think at that time, when I first started making music, I was just this fully unfocused, creative, wild child. I wanted to see what music I could make, and I truly was just making anything that felt good to me. I think this many years later, I have grown to refine my identity as a musician. It's important for me to have a voice in that way. I mean, I'm a producer. I don't really sing or anything. Whatever that signature is, that is me, I've really worked on over the years.

As the artist I am today, I still look back at that wild untamed musician and use that to shape where I am, just to make sure that I'm always being creative and not trying to follow a formula. I do think that it's important for me that I've found somewhat of an identity at this point.

Alison Stewart: Let's talk about Eternal Reverie. It dropped on March 7th. When did you start working on that album?

TOKiMONSTA: I started working on it early of last year. Wait, what year was that? 2024. The very top of 2024, I started refining all these ideas because I'm constantly working on music at any given moment. I'm like, "I think I want to make a beat right now." I'll just hunker down and open my laptop and see what I could put together. At the point about, I guess, a little over a year ago, I decided I really wanted to start compiling these ideas and working on them and fleshing them out more.

Alison Stewart: You said that you use every album as a journal. What would you say is the important part of your journal for Eternal Reverie?

TOKiMONSTA: When I say journal, it's this analogy of a specific period of time. When I put out Let Me Trick You, that was a specific point in time. That was me in an era I can remember. That's when I was going out a lot in LA and discovering all these different subcultures. You fast forward to Eternal Reverie, and this is sort of this celebration of youth and experimentation and dreaming. It's also very, unfortunately, intertwined with a lot of loss that I had also experienced last year. There's a lot of complicated feelings around this album because I lost my best friend last year. I pushed this album until now so I could take time off to take care of my friend during her last month of life.

Alison Stewart: That was your friend Regina, yes?

TOKiMONSTA: This is my friend Regina Biondo. It's mixed, but I'm hoping that this album also represents healing and the journey through grief, and at the end of this album cycle, that I would have perspective because the kind of experiences I had last year, those befall everyone. Loss and grieving, that is something that humans are not immune to. I think in putting out this album, I really hope that this can be some level of a hero's journey, some level of seeing the other side of difficulty and hardship.

Alison Stewart: I want to play another track from Eternal Reverie. This is Enjoy Your Life. It's a really joyful music video, Toki, full of people dancing in everyday places, on the bus, while vacuuming. What message did you want to come from this song?

TOKiMONSTA: It might sound really cliché because it is in the title. Just taking a moment to savor and enjoy your life. There's a lot of hardship and negativity, and we are constantly exposed to this. It's nice to pause and smell the flowers and also take count of all the things that are wonderful about life. Sometimes it's just about going out on the street, enjoying a sunny day, and being with your friends, and being present in life.

Alison Stewart: Let's take a listen. This is Enjoy Your Life.

[MUSIC - Oby Onyioha and TOKiMONSTA: Enjoy Your Life]

And no one else can stop you

It's your right to

So it's gonna stay that way

You just wanna (enjoy your life)

And no one else can stop you (not on your life)

It's your right to (enjoy your life)

So it's gonna stay that way ('cause it's your life)

We all try to (enjoy our lives)

And you ain't different, baby (not on your life)

It's your right to do it (anytime), it's your life

Don't say you're ever gonna stop trying ('cause it's your life)

It's your right to do it (anytime)

Alison Stewart: That's the song Enjoy Your Life. I'm speaking to DJ and producer TOKiMONSTA. Toki, that will be a nice segue to what happened to you 10 years ago. You were diagnosed with a disease that affects blood flow to the brain, and you underwent two brain surgeries in 2016, which affected how you both process language and music. They probably told you, but I had to undergo brain surgery a year ago. I know what it's like to wake up and not be able to talk. [crosstalk] Exactly what was the--

TOKiMONSTA: Sorry.

Alison Stewart: No. Please go ahead.

TOKiMONSTA: I was saying it's like a weird club to be in, but not knowing how to talk anymore club.

Alison Stewart: What was the exact effect on you and the disease you had?

TOKiMONSTA: It was interesting because the aphasia, the lack of speech was the result of the surgery that I had to undergo to save my life. You are warned in advance that that's a very likely thing to happen. You will have aphasia. You may lose your ability to speak. It varies from person to person, and you don't know exactly the level of permanence. When you're afflicted with aphasia, you just wake up one day and you're like, "Wow, I cannot speak anymore and I can't understand anyone." You really don't know how long you're going to be in that position.

For me, it was alarming. I'm sure you felt the same way. You're like, "How am I going to navigate this?" Because even though you can't speak, you're still cognizant. You know you can't-- At least in my situation. All I could do was just focus on recuperating. I'm sure, too, with any person who's had their brain tinkered with, it's not just speech. There's all these other things that happen. Suddenly, you can't use your left hand, or it's hard to walk, or I can't put my sweater on.

Alison Stewart: Drop things. You drop things all the time, I find myself.

TOKiMONSTA: [crosstalk] Yes. Then there's good days and bad days, where some days I feel like I can pick up on what people are saying better. Then I have another day where I lose it again, and I go back to not being able to understand people. It is through that process of healing that I also discovered I couldn't understand music anymore.

Alison Stewart: Wow.

TOKiMONSTA: Not sure if that was something that you also discovered, but for me, that was very odd. No one warns you that, "Hey, you can't listen to music anymore." They do warn you about all these other things. As I sat there in this speechless bubble, I also didn't have any music to turn to. Music is our world, and I'm sure for you, too, with speech, it is also your entire world. Speaking is so important and being able to communicate. Music as a language, to me, was so important, and I didn't have that anymore.

Alison Stewart: What process did you go through to understand what music was like again?

TOKiMONSTA: In my particular case, I like to use the analogy of a bridge. I think whatever bridge that linked that part of my brain to the rest of my brain, it maybe got a little too messed with during my surgery. Eventually, that bridge was rebuilt and I was able to be at the same cognitive level that I was prior to surgery. Fortunately for me, I didn't have to relearn anything. In my case, I just had to let the swelling and the healing happen for those bridges to connect again.

Alison Stewart: You're able to hear music the same as you were before your surgery?

TOKiMONSTA: Yes. Now with much less headaches, which is great.

Alison Stewart: For sure.

TOKiMONSTA: It'd be nice to think that after brain surgery, you'd be superhuman. I'm just happy to be where I was and to be alive and to be able to speak to you and make music and continue living.

Alison Stewart: Let's play another track from your album. This is Corazón/Death by Disco, Part 2. What do you want us to know about this song?

TOKiMONSTA: This song was made from a sample I found in São Paulo, Brazil. The only reason I found this record was through my best friend who had passed away last year. She was the one that led us to find this record dealer on the streets of São Paulo, Brazil.

Alison Stewart: Let's hear Corazón/Death by Disco, Part 2.

[MUSIC - TOKiMONSTA: Corazón/Death by Disco, Part 2]

Alison Stewart: I'm speaking to DJ and producer TOKiMONSTA. Her new album is called Eternal Reverie. You were the first woman signed to the label Brainfeeder. In 2019, you became the first female Asian-American producer to get a nomination for Best Electronic Dance Album. What effect did that have on how you felt being part of the industry?

TOKiMONSTA: Things like a Grammy nomination, it's like an accolade I never asked for or would have ever expected. If you told me when I started making music that I would be nominated for a Grammy, I would have just been like, "There is just no way."

Alison Stewart: [laughs]

TOKiMONSTA: I'm more likely that I would win the lottery, to be honest. When I got that nomination, it felt like the cherry on top. It felt like I had earned the respect of my peers because it is your peers that nominate you for a Grammy. It felt good to be recognized. Obviously, it's not something I sought out or made a goal in life. It's like, "I need to get a Grammy." That's not it. For me, it's being able to make music and be joyful. When your peers are like, "Toki, you're doing a good job. Let's get you nominated for Grammy," it's like, "Wow, that feels great."

I feel nice and warm inside. I know that I've been doing the best I could as a creative individual. Me getting nominated for a Grammy just opens the door for people to surpass me and do better. I hope there's another female producer, Asian-American or whoever, any kind of person that is not included in a diverse environment like awards or like electronic music or hip hop or all those things. I hope that they can see someone like me and be like, "Well, if she could do it, I could definitely do it."

Alison Stewart: Great. That's what I want. I hope people think that I am the bar and that they can surpass me. You launched your label, Young Art Records, about a decade ago in 2014. What are your goals for it for the next decade?

TOKiMONSTA: Honestly, to continue doing what we've been doing, which is to uplift amazing, talented musicians. This label is not a money-making venture for me at all. I'm just happy that it's self-sustaining that I can continue to use this platform to share music I love because I make music because I love music. The label allows me to exercise that creative muscle of mine as well as mentor and allow these musicians to be heard by a wider audience. It's really hard to be in the music industry. Whatever I've learned, any shortcuts or ways that I can uplift these artists, I'm so happy to do so through this label.

Tiffany Hanssen: That was Alison's conversation with TOKiMONSTA, the DJ and producer for our Women's History Month series, Equalizers: Women in Music Production. Coming up, a conversation with the third woman nominated for Grammy for Producer of the Year in the 21st century and the only one nominated this year. That's next. Don't go anywhere.